Will this work? (Sl to ML priorities question)

[MiracleCure]

Hiya, trying to merge a whole load of lines together and have a question regarding sharing a priority.

Will this work is the simple question and if not perhaps an explanation of why not would help.



I need to merge 10 lines in to 10 other lines, the lines being merged in to will have heavier traffic than the merging lines. If this works I would just drag it out for the 10 lines, giving all the 10 joining lines a choice of 2 mainlines. Fingers crossed I have got te right end of the stick.

[petert]

To work, the one-way combos at the "V" need to be two-way exit signals. I'll show you in a second, but I'm sure you know what I mean, no?

[MiracleCure]

in the Red circles the signs are hiding the other half of the 2-way combos, I think you mean the green circled signals?

[petert]

The green circles are what I meant, they create a priority. I'm actually surprised that this worked out so well.

[MiracleCure]

Thanks for the advice, I'll give it a go tomorrow, for now is bed time

[audigex]

Ignore PeterT, you're right with what you had.

If you turn the green signals into two-way then the top sideline will give way to all three other lines, at the same time. Also, if you get a train on both main lines at once, the whole thing will stop. and nothing will go anywhere.

Peter, please actually check that you're right before giving advice. This isn't the first time you've done this.

As an aside, I'd also turn the 3's (exit signals) into 2's (combo signals). It's not that the exit signals are bad, it just makes it easier to extend the priority later if you put faster trains on the mainline. Otherwise you'll find that you forget to convert an exit into a combo, and that priority won't work as expected.

[XeryusTC]

This should all work indeed. PeterT is giving you wrong advice as audigex said before.

Might I point out that sometimes it is better to give the lane with the lower traffic density priority as sometimes the trains from that line wont be able to join the other line if the traffic is dense enough and the priorities are long enough. It kind of depends on the situation though so you should check it out beforehand yourself.

[petert]

Indeed, both of you are right. The regular one way combo's do work correctly, I have just tested. I take full responsibility for this.

If you turn the green signals into two-way then the top sideline will give way to all three other lines, at the same time. Also, if you get a train on both main lines at once, the whole thing will stop. and nothing will go anywhere.

Oh, I see why this happens. It still creates a priority upon itself. This has happened to me in games before.

[audigex]

It doesn't create a priority on itself, but the mainlines will block each other (via the two green circled signals).

[petert]

I've got another question. Why does the one way combo signal create a priority? Aren't priorities based on the two way/backwards signals?

[MiracleCure]

Thanks for the input folks, I'll get it built a little later on.

@XeryusTC I see what you are saying, this is why I am trying to give each sideline a choice of 2 mainlines. Would it not be worse to have a hold up on a denser packed line than the lighter loaded sidline? I would have thought that would behave like cars on the motorway, ie a slight slow down will cause a backwards travelling "ripple" through the traffic behind. In this case, fortunately, I will have space to change which track has priority if the above solution doesnt work smoothly.

As a little insight into what I am trying to do, I have a station with 3 tiers, 2nd being an overflow from 1st and 3rd an overflow from 2nd. Each Tier has 52 platforms fed in pairs from 26 incoming lines so therefore 26 exits per tier (See attached screenie). I then need to squash these 78 exits back down to a reasonable number to then drop into an as yet unbuilt mainline system. This is where the prioritised joining is coming in. The exits from Tier 1 will always be heavy traffic with Tier 2 and 3 having progressively less traffic. So, I want Tier 1 trains to be "the most important" in their journey to the mainline and Tier 2 > 3.

So far I've compressed 26 to 17 and then 17 to 10, twice and now need to join the 2 sets of 10 together. This is where the junction in question will come in.

Will post some progress later on.

Thanks again folks

[2457]

could you post a savegame? I realy can't imagine what are you transporting that needs 70+ stations just as a loader. I do belive you got your own reasons, but still I'd like to see it my self
might happen you don't need such a huge complex, and that would -could- simplify the re-joining for the loader trains.

[Alberth]

Don't count on it, they do need such stations
http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive

[petert]

Don't count on it, they do need such stations

Usually those are used only for drop stations, not pickups.

[MiracleCure]

This will be a drop off station for short trains (6 tile long) with the longer platforms (51 tiles long) being the removal trains. This is really an experiment in handling large volumes of trains through the same station with a view to seeing actually how much goods can be created at a single factory + sawmill. There is no save game as such as I have only built the station and station exit so far, so no trains or even hooked up industries yet.

I'm not a network builder, more of an infrastructure builder, I like to make large stations and high capacity track and then see how they behave. This means that some parts of my game are probably over complicated and some parts are less complicated than they could perhaps should be.

I will sort out a decent post tomorrow with a save game from the most recent experiment (not this one) and a couple of screenies to explain my goals but I don't have a full, completed save game as I recently had some Windows issues and lost everything stored on one of my hard drives which unfortunately meant the last years worth of OTTD anyway, life goes on.

[petert]

There is no save game as such as I have only built the station and station exit so far, so no trains or even hooked up industries yet.

It's still a save game, just because you haven't started the actual game yet.

[MiracleCure]

Okay.
So, I am using Gremnons patch pack (Gremnon's_Patch_Pack_r17856_win32, downloaded from his google page here Forum thread here)

I also have the following GRfs installed:
eGRVTS v1.0
Industrial Stations Renewal
Heavy Equipment Set
Total Bridge Renewal
New fences
Temperate oil wells only decrease
av8 Apache
Very large ships
Hover bus
Modern Suburban Stations
BK Enhanced Tunnels
Rural Stations


in the attached save I have only used Industrial Stations so far so i would ignore any alerts for missing ones.

Click to download save game

Sorry to not host on the forums but just would not complete the upload, perhaps too big? 5.9megs.

Hope you get the idea, post any questions/suggestions etc and i'll see them tomorrow, again, once i've had some sleep.

[petert]

Sorry to not host on the forums but just would not complete the upload, perhaps too big? 5.9megs.

You can set the compression to "Best" in the winRAR compression. It will lower the size of the save.

[2457]

what could i say...
well, downloaded the patched version, failed to start it.
savegame did not download, but my antivirus was screaming like hell.


Maybe you should test on a dumb map what a streamed mainline can process traffic wise, and see how many station platforms can it serve at best.
70+ stations drop for 4 mainlines is way too much. say.. 10 main lines could manage it in extreme conditions i belive , but could be wrong. as for merging many station exits properly to mainlines i could not think of anything else than a well built multi-cyclotron...

[planetmaker]

I realy can't imagine what are you transporting that needs 70+ stations just as a loader.

There certainly might be, though I agree with you that it sounds a bit over-sized. Alberth already gave the link to our PublicServerArchive. Noteworthy might be games #125, #122, especially #121, and #99.
Your logic that per main line usually something like 6 ... 8 station tracks are needed is correct. The actual number depends a bit on the train length used. For a pickup station you might add a few more station tracks as trains sometimes have to wait for load - and you possibly don't want a big jam on the tracks; but much more than this is also too much for a factory pickup.