Extra demolitions done by town

denwong · Post by **denwong** » 28 May 2005 17:36

hi everyone I am quite new here... I upgraded my TTD directly from 2.01 rev1 to alpha 50 yesterday, configured it with TTDXC, and added DB Set XL and Alpine set. I created a new game in alpine climate, begin playing, and soon noticed a weird thing.
Each time a town pulls down a building of 1x1, a square of 2x2 is cleared also. (I've included a picture to illustrate this) Roads next to the building were removed also, stucking my vehicles.
I've roughly searched the history here and see that no people had raised such question before... so I really suspect that it's my own problem, but I just can't figure out what to do. Any help is greatly appreciated.

I also like to take this chance to say a sincere word of thanks to the patchmakers for their effort on this game, especially when most people are turning to locomotion.

Patchman · Post by **Patchman** » 28 May 2005 18:10

Probably due to the alpine set. Note that the set is extremely experimental, so strange things should be expected. If you actually want to play a game, don't use the alpine set, it's not ready yet.

YouTube · Post by **Geo Ghost** » 05 Jun 2005 13:45

amen to that!
I had a huge city, and now it looks like its been nuked!

michael blunck · Post by **michael blunck** » 05 Jun 2005 14:15

I don´t think this has anything to do with the AlpineSet. I never noticed this behaviour myself but I don´t use all those recently introduced switches.

And o/c, this has been reported also in other threads, even in the absent of AlpineSet, e.g.

http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=15242
http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=15207

regards
Michael

Patchman · Post by **Patchman** » 06 Jun 2005 23:39

OK, then I'd like a savegame (+ttdpatch.cfg and newgrfw.cfg) that is saved just before a town removes something it shouldn't remove, e.g. a connected road tile.

denwong · Post by **denwong** » 07 Jun 2005 15:49

Patchman wrote:OK, then I'd like a savegame (+ttdpatch.cfg and newgrfw.cfg) that is saved just before a town removes something it shouldn't remove, e.g. a connected road tile.

thx Patchman and michael blunck for your explanations

I'll try to make the town demolish something, but I am not quite sure when will it happen. I'll just try my best in a few days after the current examinations.

P.S. The problem seems to have vanished when the alpine set is removed from the newgrfw.cfg, holding all other stuff constant. May be it's the size of one or two buildings being wrongly set.

Not sure about why others encounter that in temperate though.

Patchman · Post by **Patchman** » 07 Jun 2005 15:56

denwong wrote:I'll try to make the town demolish something, but I am not quite sure when will it happen. I'll just try my best in a few days after the current examinations.

That's what makes this bug so hard to fix. To fix a bug, most of the time I need to see it happen with my own eyes, and check what's going on internally as it happens. So I need someone to prepare a game such that I can do this.

YouTube · Post by **Geo Ghost** » 08 Jun 2005 13:54

i have some here if you like.
http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=15207

Half the town has gone, and a few station tiles are missing also

Patchman · Post by **Patchman** » 08 Jun 2005 15:07

No, you don't understand. I need a savegame from before the tiles disappear, not from after it has happened.

eis_os · Post by **eis_os** » 08 Jun 2005 16:52

Patchman: you could try load a savegame into the editor and click A LOT on expand town and see what happens...

Patchman · Post by **Patchman** » 08 Jun 2005 17:07

I don't want to hunt for a bug that doesn't happen here. If I can't get someone to send me a savegame saved just before it happens, I refuse to waste more time on it.

YouTube · Post by **Geo Ghost** » 08 Jun 2005 19:11

Patchman wrote:No, you don't understand. I need a savegame from before the tiles disappear, not from after it has happened.

Its not before, or after. It continuously goes on, it doesnt stop!

denwong · Post by **denwong** » 09 Jun 2005 05:28

eis_os wrote:Patchman: you could try load a savegame into the editor and click A LOT on expand town and see what happens...

I am sure expanding the town doesn't work. I've tried that myself

but then I can suggest which building is causing the problem: it's the statue.

I need a savegame from before the tiles disappear

I think I succeeded doing this.

Look at the pictures attached. This is a scenario created just for finding out this problem.... and these pictures are taken in two consecutive seconds. I saved the game half a second before the statue was demolished, and loaded the game a couple of times to make sure that the demolition is not a random manner. I hope it works on other's computers.

I enclosed here the ttdpatch.cfg, newgrf.cfg, my savegame and these two screenshots to illutrate the problem. Hope this would be helpful for Patchman. A million thanks for your hardwork.

denwong · Post by **denwong** » 09 Jun 2005 05:48

Two more discoveries:

1. I just found that the problem DOES have something to do with statues but it is NOT limited to statues. Fountain is another example. Check out the screenshots I posted below.

2. The best thing to do to activate the problem is indeed "Build a statue of company owner". This will replace one building at the town centre with a company statue. When a statue or a fountain is demolished a 2x2 square is indeed cleared, but this does not happen on most other building I tested.

hope that helps. sorry for spamming the forum with two posts

YouTube · Post by **Geo Ghost** » 09 Jun 2005 11:43

It deletes sectiong of train stations too! one day you could have a football field the the middle of your train station!

Patchman · Post by **Patchman** » 09 Jun 2005 14:27

denwong wrote:I think I succeeded doing this.

Thanks a lot, I'll check it out when I get home.

Patchman · Post by **Patchman** » 11 Jun 2005 18:17

OK, it's sort-of a bug in the newhouses feature. If you enable a newhouses grf file in an existing savegame, the size of some buildings may change.

In this particular case, the alpine set changes the size of what used to be the statue to a 2x2 building. That means, when the statue is removed, the game thinks it's removing a 2x2 building, and thus removes four tiles.

I'll have to see what Csaba says, but it's perhaps possible to prevent the removal of additional tiles unless they have the right ID. Otherwise, the only option is to not add newhouses grfs later in the game, that is, after the scenario has been created.

YouTube · Post by **Geo Ghost** » 11 Jun 2005 19:18

Ah ha.
That explains it then

Thanks for the expination Patchman. I know what you mean. i dont normally understand much of this patch buissness, but that time i did.

Whats the advise if any?

Patchman · Post by **Patchman** » 11 Jun 2005 19:53

Until the bug gets fixed, don't add newhouse grfs after the towns have already been created. If the grf isn't active when you're starting the game (before the towns are generated), you are likely to run into this problem.

denwong · Post by **denwong** » 12 Jun 2005 13:46

Patchman wrote:OK, it's sort-of a bug in the newhouses feature. If you enable a newhouses grf file in an existing savegame, the size of some buildings may change.

In this particular case, the alpine set changes the size of what used to be the statue to a 2x2 building. That means, when the statue is removed, the game thinks it's removing a 2x2 building, and thus removes four tiles.

I'll have to see what Csaba says, but it's perhaps possible to prevent the removal of additional tiles unless they have the right ID. Otherwise, the only option is to not add newhouses grfs later in the game, that is, after the scenario has been created.

Until the bug gets fixed, don't add newhouse grfs after the towns have already been created. If the grf isn't active when you're starting the game (before the towns are generated), you are likely to run into this problem.

thx again. i got the idea now.

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Extra demolitions done by town

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