Railway boundaries - How close can you get?

[Geo Ghost]

This is indeed a question to anyone in the know.

I like to find places close to the railway to watch or photograph trains - particularly prior to steam tours and such.
I always stay behind boundary fences and never go where I am not permitted to. I know the rules and I stick by them.

However, yesterday I encountered something rather puzzling. I was walking through a woodland that was easily assessable (no fences, signs etc), walked down a bit of a slope and looked for anywhere close tot he railway.
Walked for a while and then before I knew it, I was almost ON the railway
Naturally, I went back a bit from it encase of any passing trains. Don't want to panic any drivers and such even if I was a fair distance form the track. The only fence I saw was directly next to the track and I'm not certain whether this was a boundary fence or not because it was basically just stakes in the ground and wire between them.
I spend half an hour looking around for any more fences further back or signs - Found nothing! So as far as I can tell, I'm legally in that area and not trespassing but I've no idea how close I can legally get to the railway before it is considered trespassing.

I've attached some photos of the only fence I came across but if anyone have a bit more info on boundaries and how close people are allowed to get, I'd really appreciate it.

[Chris]

In Marston, just north of Grantham, there is a pedestrian crossing on the ECML, so if you want you can stand on the gate, right next to the tracks. The fence was the typical rural wooden sort, definitely stronger than the fence in those pictures .

[Badger]

Geo, is that somewhere between Stevenage and Hitchin, near the A1 (M) bridge on the up side?

[Dave]

If there's no fence I'd consider the edge of the ballast the railway boundary, although I assume there's a bit more than that, in that case you just need to be sensible and don't give drivers a heart attack.

[Railwaymodeler]

I know it doesn't mean much to most of this forum, but in the USA, 20 feet from the rail is considered railroad property in most cases.

[Geo Ghost]

Geo, is that somewhere between Stevenage and Hitchin, near the A1 (M) bridge on the up side?

It's north of Knebworth just north/next to the bridge (down-side).
Though I know the area you mean. Been around there photographing a bit before.

Railwaymodeler - That's the kind of info I am after. I imagine it would be much the same here but I don't really want to be caught out if it's different or I'm on land I shouldn't be.

Dave - I thought as much too. As you said, I don't want to give drivers a heat attack and also I don't want them thinking I'm trespassing on the line then phoning ahead to someone about it.

[JGR]

I can think of quite a few places I know in Switzerland and France where there's no fence at all.
You're expected to use your brain and not walk all over the tracks

Just south of Rothrist comes to mind. At least 6 tracks wide, fairly major passenger and freight route, minor road right next to it (five metres or so from the nearest track). Bit of grass and ballast gravel in between.
The field on the other side of the road is often used by people to fly RC planes too ^^.

Also, around Paris where I used to live, quite a few lines run through forests (particularly Forêt de St. Germain), and they're very lax about fencing.


As for how close is wise/safe, you never want to be so close that if you suddenly collapsed/fell/whatever, you would end up in danger of being run over when a train turned up. So about 2-3 metres absolute minimum.

[teccuk]

I can think of quite a few places I know in Switzerland and France where there's no fence at all.
You're expected to use your brain and not walk all over the tracks

Well yeah, actually the only place i've seen fencing everywhere is the UK. Every European country i've been to, the US and well anywhere else for that matter doesn't bother fencing the rails. Typical over engineering and unnecessary regulation. Sod it. If people get on the track... don't even close the line. Avoid the delays.

[Dave]

I like that it happens like that but so much more of the UK network is urban and would be vandalised if left unfenced.

[GurraJG]

I like that it happens like that but so much more of the UK network is urban and would be vandalised if left unfenced.

Indeed. In Sweden, the urban parts are mostly fenced, whilst the rural parts aren't.

[Ameecher]

In the rural areas of the UK on branch lines it is fenced but that's largely to keep livestock out. Wouldn't stop and undetermined vandal.

[Dave]

It seems to me that people in the UK need reminding how dangerous the railway is... And the Europeans aren't quite that stupid...

[GurraJG]

It seems to me that people in the UK need reminding how dangerous the railway is... And the Europeans aren't quite that stupid...

I dunno, I once saw a potential winner of the Darwin Awards on the middle of the busiest railway line in Sweden.

[teccuk]

Hmm good points, livestock especially, but shouldn't the landowner fence the fields rather than the rails fence the rails?

Even in the middle of cities I've seen rail unfenced in Switzerland and Germany. But then maybe they don't have the same problems with vandalism and 'scrap' collection

[Kevo00]

Actually, I think fencing can be a sort of reverse deterrent to the very stupid - they see it as a challenge to be overcome, not something provided for safety. And fences never stop copper thieves.

Of course its a common British myth that we do things Europeans are too intelligent not to - look at binge drinking, or football hooliganism. Both these things exist in continental Europe, but the British perception is that they don't...

[GurraJG]

Actually, I think fencing can be a sort of reverse deterrent to the very stupid - they see it as a challenge to be overcome, not something provided for safety. And fences never stop copper thieves.

Of course its a common British myth that we do things Europeans are too intelligent not to - look at binge drinking, or football hooliganism. Both these things exist in continental Europe, but the British perception is that they don't...

Exactly. I come from Sweden (not really continental Europe, but hey), and binge drinking there is as much of a problem as it is here. Football huliganism as well, though perhaps not on the same extreme level as here.

[JamieLei]

Regarding binge drinking, according to Swedish friends (Ok - ie: all the people I met in Sweden when I stayed with Chrilly), drinking isn't really something you do on a daily basis - just left for binging. What's the point of drinking if you can't get drunk, they say!

Back to fences, that actually did shock me when I saw that photo. Personally I'd stay well in the bushes and try and avoid being seen too much if I was photographing.. - I was late for the London TT-F meet precisely because of people looking as if they might be trespassing on the Chiltern Main Line.

[GurraJG]

Regarding binge drinking, according to Swedish friends (Ok - ie: all the people I met in Sweden when I stayed with Chrilly), drinking isn't really something you do on a daily basis - just left for binging. What's the point of drinking if you can't get drunk, they say!

At least not to get drunk. There's nothing odd about having a beer for dinner, but getting drunk during dinner on Tuesday is frowned upon, as it were.

[Badger]

In the rural areas of the UK on branch lines it is fenced but that's largely to keep livestock out. Wouldn't stop and undetermined vandal.

It's frequently the rural areas vandals decide to nick signalling cable and compromise the railway's safety.

[Dave]

Actually, I think fencing can be a sort of reverse deterrent to the very stupid - they see it as a challenge to be overcome, not something provided for safety. And fences never stop copper thieves.

Of course its a common British myth that we do things Europeans are too intelligent not to - look at binge drinking, or football hooliganism. Both these things exist in continental Europe, but the British perception is that they don't...

There was definitely at least a sliver of irony in my post...