Bundesbahn set [Planning & pasting - 2,13% done]

[Saskia]

Hey, not everybody can be online every day

@Marshy: that wasn't a joke or the such. Maybe you have talent

@Singaporekid: Try it like I do: play around with details, add them, leave them away, combine them to a block of pixels, until your image in scale 1:1 (like in the game) looks like it has the same details of a BR 01. The pipes along the boiler could be merged to a single pipe, for example, but not that much, that the boiler looks splittet. Draw a stripe with a somewhat brighter or darker colour, so that it is visible in 1:1, but not that it jumps into your eyes. That is how I add details.

We have BR 86, 01, 01.10, 10.2 and S3/6 aka. 18.4 now, right? Do we have all liveries and views? Please don't be so chaotic

@Bastiaan: yes, cool! You even made the cabs look rounded

@All: please don't wonder if I sometimes don't appear for a few days. I haven't so much time for TTD at the moment. I don't disappear forever *g*

[Uwe]

Hi,

just some questions (please see them as comments, not as criticism):
Where is a complete list of engines and cars to be included in the set? The only list I found missed steamers and electrics.

Why do you want to include both the BR01 and the 01.10? They are quite similar in their characteristics. I think the original streamlined BR01.10 would be a cool alternative. A drawing can be found here.

What does the V320 do in this set? There only ever was the prototype engine, as far as I know. Same goes for the BR202. I'd rather see engines which were really used in daily operation.

Why don't you want to merge DB and ex-DR? Many of today's engines are ex-DR engines (like 143, 155, 232). Including such engines would add a lot of variety as well, for example with the special Staedteexpress-livery of the former east-german DR.

Hmm, quite a long first post, hope I can contribute some more good ideas in future.

Uwe

[Saskia]

just some questions (please see them as comments, not as criticism):
Where is a complete list of engines and cars to be included in the set? The only list I found missed steamers and electrics.

Uh, please don't use the old thingy. It's very out of date and incorrect. A new table is still not available, but I add a very incomplete new list (Open Office format).

Why do you want to include both the BR01 and the 01.10? They are quite similar in their characteristics. I think the original streamlined BR01.10 would be a cool alternative. A drawing can be found here.

Hm, first I decided to add BR 01, because a read somewhere, that it was an universal engine. Then Singaporekid suggested to add BR 01.10 Maybe the BR 01 will completely replaced by BR 01.10, but we should better have a universal or cargo engine.

What does the V320 do in this set? There only ever was the prototype engine, as far as I know. Same goes for the BR202. I'd rather see engines which were really used in daily operation.

It does add some goodies These engines will only be available a (few) year(s). If you are lucky, you can use one And there have been four BR 202 engines *g* I decided to add them, because they are too cool to be forgotten, and diesel engines have ever been week in germany.

Why don't you want to merge DB and ex-DR? Many of today's engines are ex-DR engines (like 143, 155, 232). Including such engines would add a lot of variety as well, for example with the special Staedteexpress-livery of the former east-german DR.

The problem would be the time where Germany was not united. For every DB engine there was also a DR pendant = we would need the rolling stock of two complete railway companies. That would take up much space, that could otherwise been used for other interesting vehicles. And it would be to much ... mixed up And I'm not a big fan of the DR, and know too few about them.

Hmm, quite a long first post, hope I can contribute some more good ideas in future.

Of course!

[Singaporekid]

I think the BR 01 was sometimes used for freight but BR 01.10 was only for passenger
I havent seen the BR 10.2 yet
BR 18.4 is not done yet
Br 86 is not done yet
I also attached something, so far it only does side views for steamers

[Uwe]

Hm, first I decided to add BR 01, because a read somewhere, that it was an universal engine. Then Singaporekid suggested to add BR 01.10 Maybe the BR 01 will completely replaced by BR 01.10, but we should better have a universal or cargo engine.

The BR01 was planned as express passenger engine, it was rarely used for freight services. I would definitely add a BR44 or 50 for cargo, or maybe the BR41 as kind of universal engine. The BR38 was also a very important type that could fit in here.

The problem would be the time where Germany was not united. For every DB engine there was also a DR pendant = we would need the rolling stock of two complete railway companies.

Well, the passenger cars were mainly the same, except for the colors, which should not be too much of a problem. And I don't think you need to double the amount of engine types. Steamers were mainly the same in east and west, since they were built before the war. Same goes for the old electrics (like the E94 crocodile).

The only real difference I see is some six east-german types that I would include: BR171 (the eastern equivalent to the VT98), E11 (comparable to the E10/BR110), V100 (equivalent to the west-V100), V180 (comparable to the V160/BR218), V200 (a diesel-electric engine for freight services), V300 (todays BR232), BR243, BR250. The latter three are still in use. Anyway, I know quite a lot about those types used by the DR, so feel free to ask.

Uwe

[Singaporekid]

The BR01 was planned as express passenger engine, it was rarely used for freight services. I would definitely add a BR44 or 50 for cargo, or maybe the BR41 as kind of universal engine. The BR38 was also a very important type that could fit in here.

Isn't this a DB passenger set?
U want me to add a BR 38?
wO0t! new BR 01!!11oneone

[Saskia]

The BR01 was planned as express passenger engine, it was rarely used for freight services. I would definitely add a BR44 or 50 for cargo, or maybe the BR41 as kind of universal engine. The BR38 was also a very important type that could fit in here.
Ok, thank you, I'll rethink that with the universal engine. BR 01 goes into the passenger set then. BR 45 is planned as cargo engine, because of the late availability (otherwise it would be available before BR 86) and the more usable speed of 90 km/h.

Well, the passenger cars were mainly the same, except for the colors, which should not be too much of a problem. And I don't think you need to double the amount of engine types. Steamers were mainly the same in east and west, since they were built before the war. Same goes for the old electrics (like the E94 crocodile).

We could have as many different passenger car liveries as we want. They wouldn't be a problem, since they mostly will be only overrides = engine dependend. With the engines it's different. If we would need to have different liveries (E94: DB green/black and later blue/cream, DR green/red), they had to use different vehicle IDs, that would mean we need to use the double space for one engine. And no, I won't use the same engine as DB/DR, because the livery simply would be wrong

The only real difference I see is some six east-german types that I would include: BR171 (the eastern equivalent to the VT98), E11 (comparable to the E10/BR110), V100 (equivalent to the west-V100), V180 (comparable to the V160/BR218), V200 (a diesel-electric engine for freight services), V300 (todays BR232), BR243, BR250. The latter three are still in use. Anyway, I know quite a lot about those types used by the DR, so feel free to ask.

You see, that are many engines, and we don't have unlimited space here. I even don't know, how many space will be left, if all the vehicles are added, that definately should be in the set.

I think it would be better, if we let this be a pure set of DB vehicles, and make another set for DR later. Only with this method all interesting vehicles of both DB and DR could be used in TTD. If we merge them, many vehicles would be lost due lack of space

@Singaporekid: Look at the title, we are developing the base set (not only passengers and the passenger set extension here

[Singaporekid]

So should i do the br 38?

[Saskia]

I'm not sure yet, which universal engine should be added. Of course you can draw it, but it would be better to complete the others first. I collect facts about universal engines in that time

[Purno]

I've been away and there's still only 2% done?

Can someone give me a short summary of the progress made the last three weeks?

[Saskia]

Yes, still 2% *g* - The only progress is, that Singaporekid drew some steamers and I worked on the vehicle list (but only a very small bit)

[Bastiaan]

ET423:
View 0, 2, 4 and 6 are done. I've tried to draw view 1, 3, 5 and 7.

[Saskia]

*wah* and I forgot: Bastiaan draws those series of new S-Bahn/Regio ETs Good work, BTW!

[Bastiaan]

Yeah, the ET423 is finished!

Some information about the ET423
----------------------------------------
Number of coaches in one trainset: 4
Number of trainsets: 456
Year in service: 2000
Power: 2350 kW
Maximum speed: 140 km/h
Traction type: electric
Information: New S-Bahn trainsets from ADtranz for S-Bahn duties in München, Stuttgart and Rhein-Ruhr to replace the first series of the ET420
Picture: http://www.railfaneurope.net/pix/de/ele ... 3032hb.jpg
----------------------------------------

Important: If you want to code the ET423, please don't use the sprites in this image, but send me an email and I give you the good sprites in a PCX-file!

Bastiaan

(Now I'm going to draw the ET424, 425 and 426)

[Purno]

Looks good Bastiaan, especially the roof.

Saskia, if you want me to draw anything, just ask like everybody else does.

[Georg]

Yeah, the ET423 is finished!

Not bad.

But: In reality, the roof is actually not flat as there are quite obvious installments for the train's air conditioning. Futher, the front doesn't seem quite right to me: It think is a little too flat (too vertical).

[Saskia]

Hm, I see no way to make it both look less vertical and not too vertical at a time. But you can see that it should look rounded Take a look of the first picture of it on the previous page. I you can see it better with white background. BTW, congratiulations to your VT133

I hope I also find some time to draw again

@Purno, let me see how it looks if you draw the steering cars of a ET403 Pictures available at the euro-thingy-server. No, find them on your own, don't be so lazy

[Purno]

@Purno, let me see how it looks if you draw the steering cars of a ET403 Pictures available at the euro-thingy-server. No, find them on your own, don't be so lazy

[ARGHH...] which directory at the euro-thingy-server? Can't find any ET403 within electric and diesel directories. [/ARGHH...]

BTW: I'm not angry

[Georg]

@Purno, let me see how it looks if you draw the steering cars of a ET403 Pictures available at the euro-thingy-server. No, find them on your own, don't be so lazy

which directory at the euro-thingy-server?

http://www.railfaneurope.net/pix/de/ele ... 3/pix.html

[Purno]

thx.

Which livery?
- Yellow/white
- Red/white
- Yellow/white + grafiti