Wrexham and Shropshire to close

[JamieLei]

I can also imagine that the vast majority of people in uproar are those who don't actually live along the route, and who once took a pleasure ride for the sake of testing the service. After all, there's still the daily Voyager run by Virgin that's far more convenient for business since it only takes 2 and a half hours and actually reaches London at a sensible time to make a business meeting (0938)

[Pilot]

Went past some Wrexham and Shropshire coaches today that but been dumped in a siding. Not sure where the engines were.

The Locos have probably gone back to DBS and Toton/ Crewe Electric.

[welshdragon]

I can also imagine that the vast majority of people in uproar are those who don't actually live along the route, and who once took a pleasure ride for the sake of testing the service. After all, there's still the daily Voyager run by Virgin that's far more convenient for business since it only takes 2 and a half hours and actually reaches London at a sensible time to make a business meeting (0938)

Which doesn't call at Shrewsbury...

[JamieLei]

I can also imagine that the vast majority of people in uproar are those who don't actually live along the route, and who once took a pleasure ride for the sake of testing the service. After all, there's still the daily Voyager run by Virgin that's far more convenient for business since it only takes 2 and a half hours and actually reaches London at a sensible time to make a business meeting (0938)

Which doesn't call at Shrewsbury...

It doesn't call at Bangor either - what's your point?

Anyway Shrewsbury has frequent trains to Birmingham for connections to London. The problem with the service was that it was just so bloody slow to actually use, and that changing results in a much faster journey. With Grand Central, unless you start at Sunderland and change at Newcastle, it's as fast as if you were to change further down the line anyway. While there's inconvenience in changing, I believe on that route, businessmen probably would have preferred to change for the sake of a much faster journey.

[Ameecher]

Most of the people crying about WSMR going under are pro-loco-hauled enthusiasts.

[welshdragon]

It doesn't call at Bangor either - what's your point?

My point is that the Virgin Trains' Wrexham service calls at Chester (where it joins a Holyhead service), Crewe and then to Euston. I am hopeful (but doubtful) that Virgin will change their Wrexham Service to run via Shrewsbury.

Most of the people crying about WSMR going under are pro-loco-hauled enthusiasts.

And people who are fed up of Virgin being the dominant West Coast operator.

[JamieLei]

It doesn't call at Bangor either - what's your point?

My point is that the Virgin Trains' Wrexham service calls at Chester (where it joins a Holyhead service), Crewe and then to Euston. I am hopeful (but doubtful) that Virgin will change their Wrexham Service to run via Shrewsbury.

Most of the people crying about WSMR going under are pro-loco-hauled enthusiasts.

And people who are fed up of Virgin being the dominant West Coast operator.

I'm fed up of Arriva Trains Wales being the dominant Wales operator. They should being in Tesco to run the trains. Also you don't even live in Shrewsbury - what's your obsession with that place?

Believe it or not, the vast majority of people in Britain only have one option for travelling to London you know!

[Dave]

It doesn't call at Bangor either - what's your point?

My point is that the Virgin Trains' Wrexham service calls at Chester (where it joins a Holyhead service), Crewe and then to Euston. I am hopeful (but doubtful) that Virgin will change their Wrexham Service to run via Shrewsbury.

Most of the people crying about WSMR going under are pro-loco-hauled enthusiasts.

And people who are fed up of Virgin being the dominant West Coast operator.

I'm fed up of Arriva Trains Wales being the dominant Wales operator. They should being in Tesco to run the trains. Also you don't even live in Shrewsbury - what's your obsession with that place?

Believe it or not, the vast majority of people in Britain only have one option for travelling to London you know!

Funny that... I've got four.

[EXTspotter]

If I'm at home I have 2 (FGW and SWT via Exeter) and if I am at uni I have 2 direct during peak (SWT (all day) and Southern) as well as Southern connecting via Redhill or Epsom off peak.

[Kevo00]

Is Shrewsbury some kind of massive hub of international business that we didn't know about?

I guess here in Milton Keynes we kind of have two choices for travel to London - Virgin or LM. In reality though, its Hobson's choice, because taking a journey in and back out by LM isn't really attractive because their trains take so long.

The other option, which I often prefer, is driving to Colindale tube station and taking the Northern Line, because the cost of a peak time return is about the same as a full tank of petrol.

And yes, I know I could go round via Bedford and FCC, but that would seem mighty pointless...

[JamieLei]

I suppose my argument would go under if Dave counted as more than 1 person.

I'd be very surprised if more than 10% of train stations in the country have more than 1 "sensible" route to London. Sensible by normal people standards, not railfans, before people start proclaiming to merits of Manchester to London via Sheffield, etc.

From the eyes of a businessman, for Birmingham, it's certainly only 2. LM isn't really an option unless you're penny-pinching. Likewise, Bristol to London is purely FGW unless you really want to go out of your way to do SWT.

Is Shrewsbury some kind of massive hub of international business that we didn't know about?

Of course! Even Welshie knows that its Chamber of Commerce is in a really accessible location!

http://bit.ly/fgGZor

[orudge]

I would say that here in Aberdeen, we have three sensible options for getting to London - East Coast (the only direct route), Virgin West Coast (with a change in Edinburgh), or flying. Personally, if I'm not pressed for time, East Coast would be my preference every time.

Most of the people crying about WSMR going under are pro-loco-hauled enthusiasts.

There's something a lot more civilised and pleasant about travelling on a proper loco-hauled train. It perhaps helps that the carriages on, say, East Coast and WSMR do seem to be a lot more spacious and comfortable than, for instance, Virgin's crammed-in seating. Plus, not having an engine under your seat results in a much quieter journey. Of course, there's no doubt that it is a lot more expensive to lug an engine around the place - obviously, there is a reason that DMUs have been so successful. Still, for a long journey, I'd personally much rather be in a nice old IC125 with refurbished seats (such as WSMR had), than squeezed into a Class 185, for instance.

I'm fed up of Arriva Trains Wales being the dominant Wales operator. They should being in Tesco to run the trains.

Now that could be interesting. Tesco Finest at the front, Tesco Value hanging out of the windows. And earn Clubcard points, too!

Also you don't even live in Shrewsbury - what's your obsession with that place?

Shrewsbury is, of course, the biggest town in mid-Wales, despite not actually being in mid-Wales. A bit like Chester being the largest town not-in-North Wales.

[Lordmwa]

I am at uni in liverpool and so virgin is the only real option for getting back down south, however i am very pleased with them. Travelling home at christmas i got to lime street and all the trains were cancelled. They were shooing people onto trains to birmingham and manchester and i only got back an hour late. My home operator is southern and they are blinking useless. I admit the 390's are not the nicest trains in the world to travel on but they are functional....

Since privatisation all the rail operators are companys and they have to make money. I cant see any other company taking up the route the Wrexham and Shropshire trains ran as clearly it makes no money. Virgin taking over the route would be like cadbury making chocolate teapots beacuse the chocolate teapot company went bust.

Like Owen i think it would be amazing if tesco ran trains and they way they are going i wouldnt be surprised if they do in the future (maybe a little way off yet)

[donchatryit]

I am in Lanarkshire and I have three main, decent London options:
East Coast
Virgin
fly

My favourite? Don't go to London.

That said, I agree with the sentiment that if a TOC can't make money, unless there is an overriding economic reason for its continuation (such as serving communities that otherwise would be cutoff) it should be allowed to disappear.

[orudge]

fly

But, sadly, not with bmi any more, only BA.

[Kevo00]

Is Shrewsbury some kind of massive hub of international business that we didn't know about?

Of course! Even Welshie knows that its Chamber of Commerce is in a really accessible location!

http://bit.ly/fgGZor

And the nearest station Wem-Euston is only around 2 hrs 30 mins.

[JamieLei]

Is Shrewsbury some kind of massive hub of international business that we didn't know about?

Of course! Even Welshie knows that its Chamber of Commerce is in a really accessible location!

http://bit.ly/fgGZor

And the nearest station Wem-Euston is only around 2 hrs 30 mins.

What's even funnier is that that's faster than the WXMR service was from Shrewsbury!

[donchatryit]

fly

But, sadly, not with bmi any more, only BA.

And easyjet. (And ryanair if you feel like going out of your way).

[orudge]

Well, true, but I was referring to civilised airlines.

[Ploes]

I am in Lanarkshire and I have three main, decent London options:
East Coast
Virgin
fly

My favourite? Don't go to London.

Amen to that