[3DTT] Ships...and one other thing

[Eddie Bernard]

(as in following with Stephen Down's, colloquialy known as "Stevie D,"
method, this post is marked with [3DTT])

I'm not sure whether this has been asked before Peter, but what changes will
happen to ships/boats in 3DTT. I'm just wondering whether you plan to
include roll-on, roll-off ferries. Maybe a ferry service that has been
commisioned by the local council could be offering RO-RO access, for a fee.
Then you could drive your lorries/buses over to the port, and when the ferry
arrives, they drive on and off. It would save a job of having to unload your
cargo, and then the ship having to load it, and then unload on the other
side, so another lorry can collect it. Of course, the same principle could
be applied to passenger trips. The ordinary people's cars could be on the
road, and they go onto the ferries. This would then provide competition from
the local authority...that is until they want to privatise it.
That point on cars leads me on to this...are there going to be ordinary cars
on the road? If so, how much competition will they be? Will you have to
provide a decent, regular, efficient and costworthy service to get people
out of their cars, and take your buses/trains?

Anyone got any other ideas about ships or cars, then please feel free to add
them to this thread. I'm sure Peter finds stuff like this very interesting,
to find out what we want in the game, and to get feedback about what is
already in it.

I hope ships will be more important in 3DTT. It was one area of TT which was
not particularly well developed.

Eddie
-- Personal Site: http://www.ebernard.greatxscape.net
-- Transport Tycoon World: http://www.ttworld.cjb.net

[Peter J. Dobrovka]

Eddie Bernard schrieb in Nachricht <8680eb$26...@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk>...

(as in following with Stephen Down's, colloquialy known as "Stevie D,"
method, this post is marked with [3DTT])

I'm not sure whether this has been asked before Peter, but what changes
will
happen to ships/boats in 3DTT.

As far the ideas have been collected and discussed, there will be:
- more ships than in TT and supported also the late ages
- no extreme long bridges allowed and no artificial islands to prevent
things like building a RR station by an oil platform.
- rivers coming down from the mountains and seas. Only small ships can be
here
- Schleusen <miss the word> to overcome waterfalls
- modular seaports for different sizes and purposes
- ship is built on land
- ships available earlier than railroad
- probably drawing bridges

I'm just wondering whether you plan to
include roll-on, roll-off ferries.

Very interesting idea. This would include a new category of objects: mobile
ways (dynamic linking streets and rails). And the ferries would be station
and transport vehicle in one.

Maybe a ferry service that has been
commisioned by the local council could be offering RO-RO access, for a fee.
Then you could drive your lorries/buses over to the port, and when the
ferry
arrives, they drive on and off. It would save a job of having to unload
your
cargo, and then the ship having to load it, and then unload on the other
side, so another lorry can collect it.

Hehe, but it would not save jobs for the programmers.
But it could be done.
Maybe it should be done.

Of course, the same principle could
be applied to passenger trips. The ordinary people's cars could be on the
road, and they go onto the ferries.

Yes, this could be done, too. Although we would have to extend the
simulation to car traffic. We wanted to have some private cars running
around the map only for graphical purpose. Yet. Hm...

This would then provide competition from
the local authority...that is until they want to privatise it.
That point on cars leads me on to this...are there going to be ordinary
cars
on the road?

Yes, this is very sure.

If so, how much competition will they be? Will you have to
provide a decent, regular, efficient and costworthy service to get people
out of their cars, and take your buses/trains?

Yes. After the cars entered the market earning money with RR will be much
harder (preventing exponential growth, hehe). It will be that the player
will have to sell or abandon his suddenly unprofitable lines.

Anyone got any other ideas about ships or cars, then please feel free to
add
them to this thread. I'm sure Peter finds stuff like this very interesting,
to find out what we want in the game, and to get feedback about what is
already in it.

I hope ships will be more important in 3DTT. It was one area of TT which
was
not particularly well developed.

No, especially because the ships were not supported after 4-5 new models.
Early in the game they can be profitable - later they are no real
concurrency to monorail and maglev.

Peter

[Koen Van Hecke]

Peter J. Dobrovka <dobro...@t-online.de> schreef in berichtnieuws
868vp0$n3...@news03.btx.dtag.de...

Eddie Bernard schrieb in Nachricht <8680eb$26...@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk>...
(as in following with Stephen Down's, colloquialy known as "Stevie D,"
method, this post is marked with [3DTT])

I'm not sure whether this has been asked before Peter, but what changes
will
happen to ships/boats in 3DTT.

As far the ideas have been collected and discussed, there will be:
- more ships than in TT and supported also the late ages
- no extreme long bridges allowed and no artificial islands to prevent
things like building a RR station by an oil platform.
- rivers coming down from the mountains and seas. Only small ships can be
here
- Schleusen <miss the word> to overcome waterfalls
- modular seaports for different sizes and purposes
- ship is built on land

Why not include shipyards as a form of industry. You can also add factories
were they produce vehicles, trains, aircraft. This would add an extra
strategy dimention to the game as these factories use a lot of steel and
other products (goods, equipment, ...) and need a lot of people to work
there.

- ships available earlier than railroad
- probably drawing bridges

I'm just wondering whether you plan to
include roll-on, roll-off ferries.

Very interesting idea. This would include a new category of objects:
mobile
ways (dynamic linking streets and rails). And the ferries would be station
and transport vehicle in one.

Maybe a ferry service that has been
commisioned by the local council could be offering RO-RO access, for a
fee.
Then you could drive your lorries/buses over to the port, and when the
ferry
arrives, they drive on and off. It would save a job of having to unload
your
cargo, and then the ship having to load it, and then unload on the other
side, so another lorry can collect it.

Hehe, but it would not save jobs for the programmers.
But it could be done.
Maybe it should be done.

Of course, the same principle could
be applied to passenger trips. The ordinary people's cars could be on the
road, and they go onto the ferries.

Yes, this could be done, too. Although we would have to extend the
simulation to car traffic. We wanted to have some private cars running
around the map only for graphical purpose. Yet. Hm...

This would then provide competition from
the local authority...that is until they want to privatise it.
That point on cars leads me on to this...are there going to be ordinary
cars
on the road?

Yes, this is very sure.

If so, how much competition will they be? Will you have to
provide a decent, regular, efficient and costworthy service to get people
out of their cars, and take your buses/trains?

Yes. After the cars entered the market earning money with RR will be much
harder (preventing exponential growth, hehe). It will be that the player
will have to sell or abandon his suddenly unprofitable lines.

Anyone got any other ideas about ships or cars, then please feel free to
add
them to this thread. I'm sure Peter finds stuff like this very
interesting,
to find out what we want in the game, and to get feedback about what is
already in it.

I hope ships will be more important in 3DTT. It was one area of TT which
was
not particularly well developed.


No, especially because the ships were not supported after 4-5 new models.
Early in the game they can be profitable - later they are no real
concurrency to monorail and maglev.

Peter

[Peter J. Dobrovka]

Koen Van Hecke schrieb in Nachricht <869e6u$ub...@news0.skynet.be>...

Peter J. Dobrovka <dobro...@t-online.de> schreef in berichtnieuws
868vp0$n3...@news03.btx.dtag.de...

Eddie Bernard schrieb in Nachricht <8680eb$26...@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk>...
(as in following with Stephen Down's, colloquialy known as "Stevie D,"
method, this post is marked with [3DTT])

I'm not sure whether this has been asked before Peter, but what changes
will
happen to ships/boats in 3DTT.

As far the ideas have been collected and discussed, there will be:
- more ships than in TT and supported also the late ages
- no extreme long bridges allowed and no artificial islands to prevent
things like building a RR station by an oil platform.
- rivers coming down from the mountains and seas. Only small ships can be
here
- Schleusen <miss the word> to overcome waterfalls
- modular seaports for different sizes and purposes
- ship is built on land

Why not include shipyards as a form of industry.

They actually are, just as the RR-factory and some other industries, which
are no industries in TT. Before you can build a ship, you have to buy steel.
This will be possible but very slow and abnormously expensive - until you
connect this factory to an industry that produces steel and connect this one
to an iron ore mine and coal mine. Then steel prices will suddenly drop
because transportation is cheap and there can be produced larger amounts.

Seaports will be a kind of importing industry.

You can also add factories
were they produce vehicles, trains, aircraft. This would add an extra
strategy dimention to the game as these factories use a lot of steel and
other products (goods, equipment, ...) and need a lot of people to work
there.

This is exactly the way it is planned.

Peter

[Pete Humble]

Quoth "Peter J. Dobrovka" <dobro...@t-online.de> in
alt.games.microprose.transport-tyc:

[snip]
- Schleusen <miss the word> to overcome waterfalls
I suspect schleusen == lock. A lock is an area with gates at each end which

allows boats to be raised or lowered to different water levels.

[snip snip]
If so, how much competition will they be? Will you have to
provide a decent, regular, efficient and costworthy service to get people
out of their cars, and take your buses/trains?

Yes. After the cars entered the market earning money with RR will be much
harder (preventing exponential growth, hehe). It will be that the player
will have to sell or abandon his suddenly unprofitable lines.

I'm not sure that this is a good idea - it might make the game less

interesting to play. Please be careful when designing this bit.
--
___ __o Pete Humble, JRI Europe, Ltd
_ \<,_ Email: peet AT dircon DOT co DOT uk
(_)/ (_) Any resemblance between the views expressed here
============= and those of my employers is pure coincidence.

[Eddie Bernard]

Peter J. Dobrovka wrote

Eddie Bernard schrieb in Nachricht

I'm not sure whether this has been asked before Peter, but what changes
will
happen to ships/boats in 3DTT.

As far the ideas have been collected and discussed, there will be:
- more ships than in TT and supported also the late ages

Good.

- no extreme long bridges allowed and no artificial islands to prevent
things like building a RR station by an oil platform.

I suppose this is better in the realism stakes, but in terms of TT gameplay,
it was something I liked doing.

- rivers coming down from the mountains and seas. Only small ships can be
here
- Schleusen <miss the word> to overcome waterfalls
- modular seaports for different sizes and purposes

Good.

- ship is built on land

Excellent. Rather than it being built out at sea! An incredibly silly idea!

I'm just wondering whether you plan to
include roll-on, roll-off ferries.

Very interesting idea. This would include a new category of objects:
mobile
ways (dynamic linking streets and rails). And the ferries would be station
and transport vehicle in one.

This idea came to me during a geography lesson. We've been doing about ports
recently, and for some reason, the idea just came into my head! And I
thought, "Sounds good!"

Maybe a ferry service that has been
commisioned by the local council could be offering RO-RO access, for a
fee.
Then you could drive your lorries/buses over to the port, and when the
ferry
arrives, they drive on and off. It would save a job of having to unload
your
cargo, and then the ship having to load it, and then unload on the other
side, so another lorry can collect it.

Hehe, but it would not save jobs for the programmers.
But it could be done.
Maybe it should be done.

3DTT could end up needing loads of memory for all the suggestions that have
been put on this NG!

If so, how much competition will they be? Will you have to
provide a decent, regular, efficient and costworthy service to get people
out of their cars, and take your buses/trains?

Yes. After the cars entered the market earning money with RR will be much
harder (preventing exponential growth, hehe). It will be that the player
will have to sell or abandon his suddenly unprofitable lines.

Another excellent thing. I don't think many railway builders will be too
impressed with this though.
Something else has just came into my mind, would there be government subsidy
offered? I know in this country the government pay lots and lots of money to
the railway operators, and bus companies because their routes often don't
make enough money to break even, but the government will pay out hefty
subsidies to make sure alternatives to the car stay around. This could
perhaps redress the balance caused by the increase in car usage.

I hope ships will be more important in 3DTT. It was one area of TT which
was
not particularly well developed.

No, especially because the ships were not supported after 4-5 new models.
Early in the game they can be profitable - later they are no real
concurrency to monorail and maglev.

Hehehe! I quick fiddle with our friend TTAlter, and they once again become
great things. I love seeing the oil and coal ships going at 75mph!

Eddie
-- Personal Site: http://www.ebernard.greatxscape.net
-- Transport Tycoon World: http://www.ttworld.cjb.net

[Peter J. Dobrovka]

Eddie Bernard schrieb in Nachricht <86akcq$ta...@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk>...
...

- no extreme long bridges allowed and no artificial islands to prevent
things like building a RR station by an oil platform.

I suppose this is better in the realism stakes, but in terms of TT
gameplay,
it was something I liked doing.

I also like everything that gives me an advantage but it is a kind of
cheating. This never was meant to be this way. 3DTT's coastlines are
unchangeable.

...

Yes. After the cars entered the market earning money with RR will be much
harder (preventing exponential growth, hehe). It will be that the player
will have to sell or abandon his suddenly unprofitable lines.

Another excellent thing. I don't think many railway builders will be too
impressed with this though.
Something else has just came into my mind, would there be government
subsidy
offered? I know in this country the government pay lots and lots of money
to
the railway operators, and bus companies because their routes often don't
make enough money to break even, but the government will pay out hefty
subsidies to make sure alternatives to the car stay around. This could
perhaps redress the balance caused by the increase in car usage.

There will be subsidys but they will not turn unprofitable lines into
profitable ones. But sometimes you better do not close unprofitable lines
because they support a profitable one.

Peter
--
Die 3. Dimension der Strategiespiele:
http://www.digitalprojects.com/way-x