[Offline] NS-Pack

G-TANK-G · Post by **G-TANK-G** » 25 May 2005 18:14

spaceman-spiff wrote:I think everybody should STFU now, shifty has acted accordingly, he has removed the download links and contacted those involved, we'll wait their answers

Shifty, I hope you will get positive news and that you will act like a real man if it is negative

Our forum is getting a bad name due to scrat/oppie wars and now this problems with the msts people

i agree with you there mate. this is getting out of hand now. when i mean this i mean everything. we should all just shut up and put up, because in the end of the day, you don't have to download this.

spaceman-spiff · Post by **spaceman-spiff** » 25 May 2005 18:23

mstsuser wrote:I have been informed that some "developers" use graphics from msts models without permission. I see all kind of skins, made by different developers for msts, used in TT and locomotion, using a conversion tool and claim it's them creation. If you are that kind of a "developer" realize what you are doing, don't say they are not going to get me.
For personal use it's no problem, but making them available for download is illegal and action to stop that will be taken.

It's fair to ask the owner of the graphics if you are allowed to use his textures, mostly the answer is yes. Credits of the owner must be in a readme so every user knows who owns the graphic. I have been looking in these downloads but can't find any legal credits.

This is just a warning to you all, don't destroy the pleasure by using textures without permission of the owner.

Speaking for the msts textures owners group BST, models and textures you have used in your NS creations are illegal without permission , so we give you 24 hours to remove them until further notice, please contact the owner of the graphics for permission. If you not take this notice seriously , you will be prosecuted and proper action against you will be taken.

Regards
mst users

Dear mstsuser, I've read your post twice now and I have two questions:
- Are you always so blunt ?
- Why didn't you contact the forum moderator ?
A kind word goes a long way

Shifty Powers · Post by **Shifty Powers** » 25 May 2005 19:05

I got the confirmation from Chris Longhurts (http://www.christrains.com) for using his models to convert to locomotion.

This is his e-mail with my question and his confirmation.

----- Original Message -----
From: "ChrisTrains" <E-MAIL REMOVED>
To: "Shifty Powers" <E-MAIL REMOVED>
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 7:58 PM
Subject: Re: NS-trains transfer to Locomotion!

> Now this is a good idea!
> I was looking to do this myself but could never figure out a "clean" way
> to do it.
> How do you plan on doing this?
> I'd like to make these "official" downloads when you're done - I play
> Locomotion a lot....
>
> Chris.
>
>
> Shifty Powers wrote:
>
> > (I'm Dutch, but I'll make this e-mail in English, so you understand it
> > much better.)
> >
> > Hi Chris Longhurts,
> >
> > Hereby I want to ask permission to use your models, to be exactly the
> > .s files, for use in the game Locomotion of Chris Sawyer. I do this
> > cause the game does have NS models, but doesn't look like they suppost
> > to.
> >
> > Your name will be entered at the credits line in the readme.txt.
> >
> > This is the list of the models I want to use with your permission:
> > - NS DDAR & mDDM
> > - NS Sprinter (re-skinnend version made by Bas A.K.A RailhopperII
> > (http://www.christrains.nl/forum/))
> > - NS Citypendel
> > - NS ICM Koploper
> > - NS IRM Regiorunner (SuperScale from the EuroLoco Pack)
> > - NS Plan U
> > - NS Plan T
> > - NS Plan V
> > - NS Mat '54
> > - NS Buffel
> > - NS Plan E carriages
> > - NS Class 1200
> > - NS Class 2200 (SuperScale from the EuroLoco Pack)
> > - NS Class mP3000 Motorpost
> > - NS Motorpost carriage (mail carriage)
> > - NS VAM (SuperScale from the EuroLoco Pack)
> >
> > If you could personally e-mail me with the trains/carriages you arpove
> > for conversion to Locomotion, then I know which one are aproved.
> >
> > Kind regards,
> >
> > Shifty Powers (http://www.tt-forums.net)

Only BST needs to reply.

chevyrider · Post by **chevyrider** » 25 May 2005 19:18

Spiff, could you lock this for about 24 hours, so that things can cool down and the people who are involved with this disagreement can PM with each other and solve it in an adult way behind closed doors.
Thanks,

Shifty Powers · Post by **Shifty Powers** » 25 May 2005 19:23

chevyrider wrote:Spiff, could you lock this for about 24 hours, so that things can cool down and the people who are involved with this disagreement can PM with each other and solve it in an adult way behind closed doors.
Thanks,

I think this topic doesn't need to be closed for 24 hours. Permission has been asked, Chris Longhurts has given me aproval, now I only have to wait for BST to aprove this all.

scrat · Post by **scrat** » 25 May 2005 19:37

kazimierz wrote:That "someone" is most probably scrat.. Trying to make life difficult for Shifty.. This is really going nowhere..

Ah, you again. For the record: I had nothing whatsoever to do with this.

Shifty Powers · Post by **Shifty Powers** » 25 May 2005 20:01

scrat wrote:
kazimierz wrote:That "someone" is most probably scrat.. Trying to make life difficult for Shifty.. This is really going nowhere..
Ah, you again. For the record: I had nothing whatsoever to do with this.

Thats good to know that Scrat, then I only fight with BST for the credits.

scrat · Post by **scrat** » 25 May 2005 20:12

" then I only fight with BST for the credits."

<sighs> Perhaps you should not see this as a fight; a choice of words like that will cost you goodwill and it is goodwill that you need to get the permissions that you require.

If you have learned from our own little fiasco you will really have to stop focussing solely on matters pertaining legal position, but instead focus a little more on doing the right thing. Modders mod for free and if treated with respect are generally easy going with regards to the use of their mods.

Ask, don't take. Don't make the same mistake twice.

That's one cent and now for my other cent of free advice: The users Doomhammer and Kazimierz do not have the interest of the community as their priority, since both of them are fairly 'trollish' in their behaviour. Their advice should therefore be taken with a grain of salt.

Villem · Post by **Villem** » 25 May 2005 20:15

Now i might be offtopic but,

Shifty Powers if you could tell Chris Longhurts that this forum has A LOT of resources he could require for rendering, and coding the vehicles he wants for locomotion himself. Like Camera Setup file for 3dsmax, and few other tools..

and by the way, if your using other peoples models, "fighting" for credits is not really the proper word to use..i partially agree scrat on the matter.

RailHopper II · Post by **RailHopper II** » 25 May 2005 20:17

Dear mr. Shifty Powers,

You don't have to fight with BST for credits. The only thing we want is that you send an e-mail to ask permission for the usage of the BST models and skins. It don't take great pains to do so and it prevents a lot of trouble. In my opinion it's dedent to ask permission before you put the files on the internet and put the names of the original authors.

Yours sincerelly,

Bas (aka RailHopper II)
Author of ChrisTrains PhotoSkins, plan W skin, Df skin and member of the BST

Villem · Post by **Villem** » 25 May 2005 20:20

Oh yes what i forgot to say in my post was that even some of the members can be very helpful if he wants to make vehicles for Locomotion.

Shifty Powers · Post by **Shifty Powers** » 25 May 2005 20:31

RailHopper II wrote:Dear mr. Shifty Powers,

You don't have to fight with BST for credits. The only thing we want is that you send an e-mail to ask permission for the usage of the BST models and skins. It don't take great pains to do so and it prevents a lot of trouble. In my opinion it's dedent to ask permission before you put the files on the internet and put the names of the original authors.

Yours sincerelly,

Bas (aka RailHopper II)
Author of ChrisTrains PhotoSkins, plan W skin, Df skin and member of the BST

Bas, I sended you an e-mail after almost 4 hours of e-mail problems here, you should have it in your hotmail box.

@Scrat
Your right, sometimes my words are a bit rough, but no one who english isn't his homelanguage can speak better english then an english-man himself, but at least I try. I think the propper words then has to be, "Asking hardly for permission at BST-adress to use there models (if they answer my e-mail please dudes, check this e-mail box, admin(at)benelux-sim.nl)?" This better?

lobster · Post by **lobster** » 25 May 2005 22:16

and what are you going to do when you don't get that wanted permission? start practising your modelling already, you might need it. nice things don't always come falling out of the sky.

(note the awesome Jay/"Dogma" reference).

Steve · Post by **Steve** » 25 May 2005 22:24

Must i start locking topics?
Must i start getting users banned?
What do i need to do to stop mindless arguing?

If you find you have been mis-credited. The first step is to talk to the person making the pack. And as far as i can see, Shifty is getting permission to use the models and then can we get on with our lives?

Perhaps i'll just start posting happy pictures in random threads to help increase forum morale.

d00mh4mm3r · Post by **d00mh4mm3r** » 25 May 2005 23:05

lol... why is it the new people that are now getting onto every-one making SWEET (BUM, but worse word starting with A and ending with S) mods, Heck.

FOR ALL THE PEOPLE THAT ARE BAGERING MODDERS ABOUT CREDITS... LET THEM FINNISH MAKING THE MOD, they have most-likely not had any contact from the BST team, or MSTS team, or better yet, THE ORIGINAL designer of the real train. So its better to make the mods while waiting for a responce, that way people all over this nifty forum can try and contact the (so-called) original designer:lol:

So on a better note...

Theses sets are hitting off, well when a new one starts

Daan Timmer · Post by **Daan Timmer** » 26 May 2005 00:15

Steve wrote:Must i start locking topics?
Must i start getting users banned?
What do i need to do to stop mindless arguing?

If you find you have been mis-credited. The first step is to talk to the person making the pack. And as far as i can see, Shifty is getting permission to use the models and then can we get on with our lives?

Perhaps i'll just start posting happy pictures in random threads to help increase forum morale.

ya do that please! I will start off!

d00mh4mm3r · Post by **d00mh4mm3r** » 26 May 2005 01:01

lol.. heres one for people who dont post, and it makes this topic happier

Amtrak · Post by **Amtrak** » 26 May 2005 07:01

mstsuser wrote:I have been informed that some "developers" use graphics from msts models without permission. I see all kind of skins, made by different developers for msts, used in TT and locomotion, using a conversion tool and claim it's them creation. If you are that kind of a "developer" realize what you are doing, don't say they are not going to get me.
It's fair to ask the owner of the graphics if you are allowed to use his textures, mostly the answer is yes. Credits of the owner must be in a readme so every user knows who owns the graphic. I have been looking in these downloads but can't find any legal credits.

To mstsuser. firstly i as working on the Ausset4lomo am sorry if my actions may have offended you but i it appears you have not seen the ausset PreRel readme or the S-set readme I DID CREDIT Chris Jennings and did NOT take any credit for it. all i am doing is providing fine works of 3d modelling made by skilled people and provided for those here in the locomotion community using a program created by SOMEONE else (scrat , who i also credited). all i did was apply a palette and fill in some boxes.

mstsuser wrote:I have been informed that some "developers" use graphics from msts models without permission. I see all kind of skins, made by different developers for msts, used in TT and locomotion, using a conversion tool and claim it's them creation. If you are that kind of a "developer" realize what you are doing, don't say they are not going to get me.
It's fair to ask the owner of the graphics if you are allowed to use his textures, mostly the answer is yes.

Yes, i realise that i have to ask permission. But i do recall reading in one of the threads that if no profit was made and the CORRECT person(s) were credited that was good enough.

Please don't ruin an already fragmented community over some credits. No one is making money. We are just trying to help a community a provide it with more great mods/addon's

Shifty Powers · Post by **Shifty Powers** » 26 May 2005 07:02

I think the people who are posting pictures for fun should stop, cause this is not an off-topic place. This topic is for the NS-pack only.

@Steve:
This topic should not be closed, it's still under development here. As long as that is, it stays open.

ajy170 · Post by **ajy170** » 26 May 2005 07:35

For God's sake, is this WW4 (3 was scrat/oppie, please consider coming back eventualy. I would love some brilliant maglevs!).

People, ask premission first before you go out and use VC to start porting them over to Locomotion then we will never see these arguments with the MSTS community ever again.

Also, i think a few of the problems here have been caused by some people laking a firm understanding of the english language. I don't think Shifity intened to use the word "fight" when he was talking about seeking permission to use the models. Just my thoughts, i will go away now.

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