Planeset [version 1.5.3 released 2006-10-24]

krtaylor · Post by **krtaylor** » 19 Jul 2004 02:34

A proposal has been made to dump the A318, and replace it with the A340-600. I have examined this issue, and it raises certain other issues of balance.

First, I looked at the Excel file. The A318 appears in 2002, and has a capacity of 100. Looking around at planes of a similar size, there is the Embraer ERJ-145 in 1996 with 50 pax, and the Canadair CRJ-100 in 1992, also with 50. Then there's the Airbus A320 with 150, and excluding props and choppers, the McDonnell Douglas MD-80 in 1980, and the venerable 737 in 1967 with 110.

The reason the Embraer is included is because it is the only Embraer aircraft on the list, and we could not ignore the Brazilians completely. But we can't axe the Canadair jets either as they are very widespread. There is a stretched version of the CRJ available now, but it wasn't in 1992; if there was a stretved cersion of the Embraer available, I'd use that, but there isn't.

Notice that the much-argued-over 737NG isn't on the list.

Then we consider the proposed new vehicle, the A340-600 which carries 370. We have the Dreamliner (2008, 280); the A380 (2008, 600); the 777 (1995, 340); the 747-400 (1989, 520); and so on back. Do we need a 370-capacity plane when we have a 340-capacity and bigger?

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On examining this list, I am thinking that the change we ought to make, is to dump the Embraer ERJ-145 in favor of the Embraer 190 with 94 seats, released 2004; and replace the A380 with the A340-600 with 370, as suggested, in 2003. Is this reasonable?

planefreak · Post by **planefreak** » 19 Jul 2004 03:02

Is it possible to refit an aircraft so that it appears to have a different seating arrangement, so the plane could carry more or less passengers to suit the players needs?

krtaylor · Post by **krtaylor** » 19 Jul 2004 03:24

Not that I'm aware of. What would be the point? Flying empty seats doesn't cost anything.

planefreak · Post by **planefreak** » 19 Jul 2004 03:34

Maybe i was trying to be too realistic.

459 · Post by **459** » 19 Jul 2004 12:57

IMO it's OK to axe ERJ-145 in favor of Embraer 190. Now we have an Embraer airplane and a sufficiently-sized airplane to replace the A318.

I think we should keep the A380 and axe the A318 (you typoed?) in favor of some plane. My personal suggestion #1 is DC-8 Super which was for some years by great margin the biggest aircraft before the first 747. The airplanes of that type have endured better than 707's and are probably still used in notable numbers as cargo airplanes.

Suggestion #2 is to replace the A340 with A330 (two A340's no good?) and give the slot freed by A318 to A340-600, the longest and largest single-deck airplane in service.

zero1000 · Post by **zero1000** » 19 Jul 2004 13:36

yes, i aggree:

kick the ERJ 145 (1996, 50 pax) for the ERJ 190 (2005, 100 pax), even tough it looks complete different.

but i see no need for the a340-600, because there isn't much difference between a340-200/300 (1993, 260/300 pax) and a340-600 (2002, 370 pax). if we take the a340-300 with 300 pax we have a good big long ranger to replace the b747-400 if they are old until the a380 appears (except for very busy routes, but there the b747-400 can stay as in real life too).

459 · Post by **459** » 19 Jul 2004 14:05

The A340 that's currently in the list is A340-300, the biggest variant of the family upon it's release.

IMO, the B747-400 propably doesn't need to be replaced as it's needed as the big jet for the timeline between 1990-2006 unless we just decide to extend the original B747 lifetime.

Do we need anything for the capacity space between A340-300&B777-200 and B747-400 anyway for the "modern days"? It sounds like you need and the real-life options are A340-600 and B777-300, both having around 450 seats in my calculation methology, equaling roughly the size of initial 747's.

459 · Post by **459** » 19 Jul 2004 14:38

I decided to alter the amount of A340-300 passengers to 370. In real life this would mean that economy class seats 9 abreast instead of 8. B777-200 capacity stays at 340. I've made these calculations based on companies seatmaps. For comparision purproses, I updated the spreadsheet with data of the proposed aircraft, new capacity for A340-300 and some variant numbers of planes for clarity's sake.

459 · Post by **459** » 19 Jul 2004 15:05

Of company colors in aircrafts: Just yesterday I discovered the OpenTTD and the fact it's more or less possible to use custom GRF's in it. Some work, some don't but in future things should be better. The fact OpenTTD supports multiplayer (I even tested it and it works, though it's yet a bit unstable) brings demand for company colors. However, there are still the single player people who prefer the liveries over company colors.

These conditions will support the fact that there'll be need for two separate packages, one with company colors and other with liveries.

NCarlson · Post by **NCarlson** » 19 Jul 2004 15:35

What I suggest is a single set but that there be some area on aircraft that use the company colour, for example the tail could be set to company colour on all aircraft regardless of the actual colours.

krtaylor · Post by **krtaylor** » 19 Jul 2004 16:08

I have changed the official list and will shortly upload it. I made the following changes:
Deleted the Embraer ERJ-145
Deleted the Airbus A318
Added the Embraer 190
Tentatively added the Airbus A340-600.

Please make these changes to the Excel file, or I can.

I am happy with the first three changes, and don't think I'm likely to revisit them. The A340-600 may be subject to some more arguments.

The DC-8 was on the original list, but it got chopped because it was too similar to the B707. I wouldn't mind reinstating it, at all; but we'd have to agree not to include the A340-600.

459 · Post by **459** » 19 Jul 2004 19:15

So is it a vote between DC-8 Super and A340-600 then? Here's something for people to base decisions on.

#1: DC-8 Super
-Once the largest-capacity passenger jetliner (imagine a B757-300 with four engines)
-A notable cargo carrying type long after its introduction
-Adds more visibility for DC/MD planes in set

#2: A340-600, replace A340-300 with A330-300 (so there's no two A340's in the set although in real life the A340-300 and A330-300's biggest visible difference is the amount of engines and range)
-It makes a good bridge between jumboes and planes of 300-passenger size class for the modern age

459 · Post by **459** » 19 Jul 2004 23:17

Introducing the Embraer 190 and waiting for your opinions. If someone has any idea how to make wingtips that look better, please do so.

459 · Post by **459** » 19 Jul 2004 23:45

I must be bored or something... #1: my suggestion for A300. #2: The original A300/B757/B777/whatever sprite. I've done the A300 by chopping a bit off from the fuselage forward, giving company color for engine pods and repositioning the engines slightly inwards. Please comment.

459 · Post by **459** » 20 Jul 2004 00:36

krtaylor, I think you should reserve the now vacant DC-10 slot for the original DC-10/MD-11/Tristar sprite. It'd serve as DC-10 perfectly.

What's the status of the Trimotor anyway? I haven't seen anything thus far and the slot is reserved.

How's the Connie, zero1000? Stop ="#¤%/="#/¤ around with that US set and draw that final sprite because that plane looks damn good!

Nobody seems to have any idea about doing helicopters. With this pace we'll have all the planes drawn soon but there'll be no drawn helicopters or airships. Someone please do something so we'll get the choppers and airships and don't have to use the Sikorsky sprite as a replacement forever

zero1000 · Post by **zero1000** » 20 Jul 2004 07:02

but they're so beautiful, these us locos

i tried some drawings for the diagonals for the connie, but i don't know how to draw the bow of the body in a proper way. but i continue

the ERJ190 looks good (haven't i seen the fuselage before?

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and the A300 looks also good.

my vote for DC-8/A340-600: DC-8 ! (can be used as freigther after detached from passenger service)

zero1000 · Post by **zero1000** » 20 Jul 2004 07:38

OK, here is what i have so far for the connie.

in game:

zero1000 · Post by **zero1000** » 20 Jul 2004 07:40

... and the sprites. any comments are welcome.

Szappy · Post by **Szappy** » 20 Jul 2004 08:56

zero1000 wrote:... and the sprites. any comments are welcome.

They look very good.
One minor note though. The engines seem a bit too large (in front and front-diag views), and they look as if they were jet engines. You sure this is right?

-edit- if you could lighten the centers a bit, I think it would look better

zero1000 · Post by **zero1000** » 20 Jul 2004 09:36

oooh, i used the TTD original Vickers propellers / engines and didn't thought about the size. but now i will (possibly

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