Auztralian Industries (AuzInd)

[Alberth]

Actually, you don't get cluttered maps, or at least you shouldn't.



The total number of industries that should exist is a base value that slowly increases to simulate growth (growth is very slow, only a few each 10 years).

The game computes how many of each type of industry should exist within that total number of industries, and compares it with the industries that are really at the map.
Industry types that should have many more than there actually exist, get a high priority in constructing new industries. Industry types that have too many get a low or even negative priority.

The game tries to maintain the total number of industries at the map the same as the number of industries that should exist, where it favours building industries with a higher priority (the types that are missing a lot). In particular, it does not build anything if the total number that should exist is equal or lower than the real number of industries at the map.


Now if you disable closure, the only way to get a new industry is to wait until "growth" has increased sufficiently to warrant building a new industry. (Under the assumption that the map is flat enough that build attempts do not fail.)

If you have many industry types that appear later, the "should exist" data changes as time progresses, but since the "old" industries don't disappear, the number of industries at the map does not go down. The objective of "maintain" is thus fulfilled, and the new industry types do not get build, except due to the growth increase.

[3iff]

Yes, 'cluttering' was probably the wrong word to use as the game doesn't work that way (as you explained).

I always have industries able to close for one reason or another to allow industries that are badly placed to close down eventually and allow a replacement to appear perhaps in a better location.

Equally it can be frustrating to create a new service and have the receiving industry close just before the first arrival. Setting the minimum closure opportunity to 10+ years gives you more chance...but unless I'm playing a static industry game (almost never) I prefer the randomness of industries closing.

I presume this 'base value' for industries is not accessible via a newgrf? It could be very useful to influence it within an industry set.

[GarryG]

Hi fellas,

Some strange factors .. When I start a game all industries build. Some times the timber siding will not build at start say not suitable place .. but not all the time.

I been using OpenTTD 1.6.0 .. are you using later version 1.6.1 or a nightly version?

I unable to do any coding or patching to what I done at moment as the computer I have access to don't have my work and NML.

My computer in pieces at moment and hope to have it re assembled in next few days. Still getting over the journey .. no sleep for several days .. unable sleep on plane as lot of air turbulence.

Last 11 months I been in my own country Australia being tortured by physios and medical experts trying help me with some problems. But now that all over for a while and I've return to my family in Philippines, which means when I get my computer re-assembles I have to share it with my partner and 3 kids.

I appreciate reports of problems as every game players play things a bit different then others and can often pick up errors that the person who makes the game may not find.

[Alberth]

How big is the timber siding?

Unless you did something special, an industry needs a flat area where it can be build (eg if you only allow it high up in the mountains, you'd need a flat enough area high up in the mountains). The game just tries it at random places, so the more flat areas you have the more likely it will build.
The other way around, the more non-flat area you have, the less likely it will build. Eg when you use 'rough" terrain (iirc) you get loads of small bumps, which is murder for large industries (large as in having many tiles).

[GarryG]

On the Bulk Terminal B , should it not be Import wool,cotton and goods ,export fish and timber , there is alcohol instead of fish . A similar error appears with Bulk Terminal A.
A update playing on a 4k map I am finding it very hard to transport cargos on long distance due to Industries closing , very irritating , is there a way of stopping industries closing ?

The cargoes for these is correct .. as Australia does export these products.

When I able to access my computer again and get time at it see what adjustments I need to make to stop early closures.

As SPI mentioned I used a lot of his coding as I was only learning them days when started this set .. and I still am learning. You will find many Industries I have used as same as what FIRS 1.4.3 and SPI used and I just tried to add a few others that are not found in those and other sets.

How big is the timber siding?

Unless you did something special, an industry needs a flat area where it can be build (eg if you only allow it high up in the mountains, you'd need a flat enough area high up in the mountains). The game just tries it at random places, so the more flat areas you have the more likely it will build.
The other way around, the more non-flat area you have, the less likely it will build. Eg when you use 'rough" terrain (iirc) you get loads of small bumps, which is murder for large industries (large as in having many tiles).

Timber siding only a 2x3 size. When It wasn't always building at start in the coding I had it building within a certain distance of a town. Since I removed that coding it now builds every time. Wonder if there is a limit to how many Industries can tell to build near a town?

Curious the industries coding are same I used in other versions of AuzInd and had no reports of closing except for the coal mines which seems to be fixed. Only since I done AuzInd160 that getting reports of Industries closing.

I still using OpenTTD 1.6.0 .. those who having Industry closing problems are you also using same as me r have you upgraded to 1.6.1 or are you using a Nightly version of Open TTD.

Hope tomorrow I be over my travels and feel like re-assembling my computer and start finding some time to see if can fix these errors.

Cheers all

[GarryG]

Hi all,

I having a look at the AuzInd160 NML file to see if I see what is closing the factory. Unfortunately I not be able to edit it with NML for a few more days until I get my computer up and running again and have access to my NML.

Until then someone might be able to let me know if I on the right track.

If I remove some or all of these lines from each factory will it stop it closing.

Code: Select all

/* 50 : 50 chance that we actually close down (extra_callback_info2 contains random bits) */
switch (FEAT_INDUSTRIES, SELF, flour_mill_close_random, (extra_callback_info2 & 32)) {
 0: return CB_RESULT_IND_PROD_CLOSE;
 return CB_RESULT_IND_PROD_NO_CHANGE;
}

/* Check whether sufficient time expired to close it */
switch (FEAT_INDUSTRIES, SELF, flour_mill_had_produced_check, LOAD_PERM(15)) {
 0..primary_close_months: return CB_RESULT_IND_PROD_NO_CHANGE;
 flour_mill_close_random;
}

/* Check whether we may close industries at all */
switch (FEAT_INDUSTRIES, SELF, flour_mill_check_closure, allow_close_secondary) {
 1..255: flour_mill_had_produced_check;
 return CB_RESULT_IND_PROD_NO_CHANGE;
}

/* Check for restriction via parameter */
switch (FEAT_INDUSTRIES, SELF, flour_mill_check_availability_param, restrict_open_during_gameplay) {
 1..255: return CB_RESULT_IND_NO_CONSTRUCTION; // disallow when restrictions in place
 return CB_RESULT_IND_PROBABILITY_FROM_PROPERTY; // we may build
}

[Alberth]

Timber siding only a 2x3 size. When It wasn't always building at start in the coding I had it building within a certain distance of a town. Since I removed that coding it now builds every time. Wonder if there is a limit to how many Industries can tell to build near a town?

There is a setting to allow several of the same industries in one town (where "in" mostly means "around it"). Otherwise, not really as far as I know.

You may be able to fix the problem by enlarging the maximum distance, as an alternative.

Curious the industries coding are same I used in other versions of AuzInd and had no reports of closing except for the coal mines which seems to be fixed. Only since I done AuzInd160 that getting reports of Industries closing.

That doesn't mean much. Just because you publish something doesn't mean people will drop everything and play your grf. It takes time for people to discover your set, and tell others about it.

Also, they need time. Maybe they had other games, were busy with life, or exams, and didn't have time before. Reports could just be from new players that use different settings or different patch packs. There are so many settings, it's impossible to check how it works for all possible combinations.

I still using OpenTTD 1.6.0 .. those who having Industry closing problems are you also using same as me r have you upgraded to 1.6.1 or are you using a Nightly version of Open TTD.

Number of changes is so low, it's unlikely to be the cause, just check the changelog (at the right of https://www.openttd.org/en/download-stable ), number of people playing nightlies is close to zero, patch packs is a much larger group.

Hope tomorrow I be over my travels and feel like re-assembling my computer and start finding some time to see if can fix these errors.

Good luck, and have a good time!

[GarryG]

Thanks Alberth for your answers. Appreciated.

There is a setting to allow several of the same industries in one town (where "in" mostly means "around it"). Otherwise, not really as far as I know.

You may be able to fix the problem by enlarging the maximum distance, as an alternative.

Re-thinking about this Industry and a few others that I have them building s certain distance from towns. By not having a restricted distance from a town I think would suit many players. Allowing to build anywhere for some be like having intermediate sidings between towns. I can still put them in towns if want when adding to a scenario. I think the following can be changed to build anywhere Grain Silos, Cream Shed, Fruit Cannery, Fruit Packing Sheds, Livestock Siding, Livestock Sales Yard, Perway Depot, and the Timber Siding.

That doesn't mean much. Just because you publish something doesn't mean people will drop everything and play your grf. It takes time for people to discover your set, and tell others about it.

Also, they need time. Maybe they had other games, were busy with life, or exams, and didn't have time before. Reports could just be from new players that use different settings or different patch packs. There are so many settings, it's impossible to check how it works for all possible combinations.

How true what you said .. I'll be teaching my boys to play this OpenTTD soon so they sure to find any problem for me once I let them loose on it.



Cheers

[GarryG]

Hi .. just been having a play with AuzInd160 .. I think the problem could be .. original setting with the Flour Mill was same as FIRS 1.4.3 and SPI had .. when you started the game in 1800s or sooner used to be a flour mill with a windmill. However when I changed the graphics looks like I've deleted reference to that mill.

Starting a game in the 1800s I have same problem .. flour mill will not build.

I'm unable to repair just yet .. be at least a few more days before I can do and code editing.

I might need to bring back the original graphics so windmill will build.

All games I play I always start in early 1900s .. be why I not picked up this problem before.

Cheers

[kamnet]

Aha, yes! All of my recent attempts started in 1830. It never occurred to me to try it normally! *grin*

[GarryG]

I rebuilt my puttie and had a look at the flour mill .. it had reference to the windmill which I not realizing had removed the reference to the windmill sprites.

What I have done for now is removed references to the windmill and now the Flour Mill will build sooner.

I can a game starting in 1850 for an hour on fast using AI players and didn't notice any factories closing.

If anyone like to try AuzInd160 with flour mill problem fixed here is that version.

AuzInd160V8.rar

(1.05 MiB) Downloaded 133 times

If other player like idea .. I the codes I shown a few entries earlier, I could remove them from all industries so they no close to soon. See if can get them to operate under normal game play.

[GarryG]

I re-coded a lot in AuzInd160 and made the following changes:

*Removed all references to Industries closing in a certain number of days.
*Changed Manpower that I had from 3iff's SPI .. if I coded it right it should now reference to other Cargos delivered to the mines .. ie .. both mines need timber to shawl up the mine shafts .. the more timber delivered, the deeper the mine shafts can be build and hence produce more raw materials.
* Power Station now accepts Coal, Wood (for power poles) and Goods (other supplies needed for maintenance).
* I noticed the first steam loco available in 2CC set is 1835, so all the Industries I had made to serve the railways does not become available until 1835 or later.

Start dates for the following Industries:

CARRIAGE WORKSHOPS 1835
CREAM SHED 1845
FASTFOOD 1940
FRUIT PACKING SHEDS 1855
FUEL DEPOT 1870
GOODS SHED A 1838
GOODS SHED B 1835
GRAIN SILOS 1845
HOLIDAYRESORT 1820
LIQUIDS TERMINAL 1870
LIVESTOCK SIDING 1840
LOADING BANK A 1838
LOADING BANK B 1840
LOCOMOTIVE DIESEL FUEL 1900
LOCOMOTIVE FUEL DEPOT 1835
LOCOMOTIVE WORKSHOPS 1835
METAL FABRICATION 1901
METAL WORKSHOPS 1762
MOTOR INN 1945
OIL REFINERY 1870
OIL RIG 1870 (I know oil rigs were not available this early .. but for my game play it represents Oil being imported from other countries)
OIL WELLS 1870
OPEN CUT COAL MINE 1875
PARCELS OFFICE 1835
PERWAY SIDING 1850
POWER STATION 1880
STEEL MILL 1850
SUB_STATION 1880
TIMBER SIDING 1845
WATER TOWER LARGE 1850
WOOL DUMP 1850

If you feel that any of those date should be changed late me know.

Remember when you go to NewGRF Settings to select AuzInd160 also check the Set Parameters see whats available and change to your liking.

I was going to put a test here for you to use and test with me for next few days see if all working better this time. I started a game before I started typing this message and let the AI players have a go .. and all the coal mines and Iron Ore Mines Closed.

So looks like I got some problem solving to do.

At least this will give you an idea what I trying to achieve.

I'll be back when I find the answer to those closures.

Cheers

[GarryG]

I had to put the reference to Industry closures back in .. when this is removed Coal Mine and Ore Mine closed as soon as start a game. When left in the stay open. This happens even when removed all closure references from all industries.

So I set the default to "Primary Industries Never Close".

If you like them to close after a certain amount of months or years if your not using them then you can change this in the Set Parameters.

Made a few date changes to some industries when the will become available.

I've set them for years when the first one was opened in the world where possible.

Grain Silos 1870
Liquid terminal 1856 .. this is when first Oil Refinery opened
Locomotive Diesel Fuel Depot .. 1892
Oil Refinery 1856
Oil Wells 1830
Perway Siding 1836
Power Station 1868
Sub-station 1868
Water Tower 1835
Wool Dump 1845

Just a few things to do to the codes and with luck will have it available for release very soon.

[kamnet]

Instead of having an early oil rig, why not have an oil import terminal that simply generates oil and requires nothing?

[GarryG]

Instead of having an early oil rig, why not have an oil import terminal that simply generates oil and requires nothing?

Why didn't I think of that?

I shall look into that idea.

Maybe could convert the Liquid terminal to be a Oil Terminal and produce Oil instead of Petrol.

Thanks Kamnet.

[GarryG]

I think I finished the re-coding of AuzInd160.

I Liked kamnets suggestion to have a Oil Terminal .. so I renamed The Liquid Terminal to be the Oil Terminal and produces Oil_ and Chemicals.

I not get chance now to test properly till tomorrow due to other commitments.

If any one want to try version 10. It includes a Changelog so can have a read what been changed other past few days or so.

AuzInd160V10.rar

(1.05 MiB) Downloaded 95 times

Hope all working fine now.

[kittle]

The UK Railway Set 2 has the first loco appearing in 1830, to coincide with the opening of the Liverpool & Manchester Railway, so if you could change the railway-related industries to open in 1830, that would be awesome. Also, I liked playing with the windmills for my 1830-start games, so maybe if you had them in again, at least to start.

Still loving this industry set.

[GarryG]

The UK Railway Set 2 has the first loco appearing in 1830, to coincide with the opening of the Liverpool & Manchester Railway, so if you could change the railway-related industries to open in 1830, that would be awesome. Also, I liked playing with the windmills for my 1830-start games, so maybe if you had them in again, at least to start.

Still loving this industry set.

I shall do that change the dates an bring them forward by 5 years.

Shall have a look at the Flour Mill .. having the windmills again can do but might also have to have the original graphic for the normal flour mill when it comes available. If I have to do it that way .. I'll make some Silos in the objects sets so these can be placed near the flour mill if players desire. Shall see what I can do.

Glad you like the set .. Cheers

[GarryG]

Changed some dates in AuzInd160 Version 10.

METAL WORKSHOPS 1762
HOLIDAYRESORT 1820
CARRIAGE WORKSHOPS 1828
LOCOMOTIVE WORKSHOPS 1828
PERWAY SIDING 1828
LOADING BANK A 1830
LOCOMOTIVE FUEL DEPOT 1830
OIL WELLS 1830
PARCELS OFFICE 1830
WATER TOWER LARGE 1830
GOODS SIDING (SHED B) 1832
GOODS SHED A 1835
LOADING BANK B 1835
CREAM SHED 1840
LIVESTOCK SIDING 1840
TIMBER SIDING 1840
WOOL DUMP 1840
FRUIT PACKING SHEDS 1848
STEEL MILL 1850
LIQUIDS TERMINAL 1856
OIL REFINERY 1856
POWER STATION 1868
SUB_STATION 1868
FUEL DEPOT 1870
GRAIN SILOS 1870
OIL RIG 1870
LOCOMOTIVE DIESEL FUEL 1892
METAL FABRICATION 1901
FASTFOOD 1940
MOTOR INN 1945


Since first steam was in 1830 .. they needed a place to build it and tracks to run on, so the Loco Workshops, Carriage and Wagon Workshops and Perway Siding all become available a few years earlier.

Been suggested I add Post Office and a Courier Parcel Service to game for the road vehicles? What you think?

Post Office could start when your game starts .. but not sure when a courier service first started.

If had a Courier Service it would probably carry both parcels and goods.

Hope later today to change the flour mill.

Cheers

[kamnet]

Could you create some additional rotations for the pub/hotel so that it better aligns with roads and city blocks in towns? I've had several instances where the front of the building is buried behind other buildings.