Version 2.0 - Look to the Future

[2457]

aye, getting a single core cpu is quite hard these days
having ottd muti-thread is a verry nice idea.

but even so i would trade it for signals on bridges / in tunnels, diagonal bridges /tunnels.
programmable signals..

[Rubidium]

So what this thread basically comes down to: I want lots of new features, and I want so many changes that it isn't OpenTTD anymore. There are countless threads why certain things, like true multithreading (i.e. using more than one core), can't be done without sacrificing Transport Tycoon economics and game logic. Thus "OpenTTD" and true multithreading are mutually exclusive.

[Drury]

How about you opened two processes on the same machine, each running on separate cores, run a server with one process, then connect to that server with the other process (possibly with a 3rd party virtual network thing), and join the same company as both processes?

Yeah, technically, you'd experience the same sort of CPU deficiency, except on both cores. But you'd be playing multithreaded OpenTTD!

/this is why I'm not a programmer

[Eddi]

"my car doesn't go fast enough" - "simple: just use two cars and you can go twice as fast"... aye...

[FLHerne]

"my car doesn't go fast enough" - "simple: just use two cars and you can go twice as fast"... aye...

That might work, if you stacked them on top of each other and the lower one was a couple of miles long...

[SniperDJ]

So what this thread basically comes down to: I want lots of new features, and I want so many changes that it isn't OpenTTD anymore. There are countless threads why certain things, like true multithreading (i.e. using more than one core), can't be done without sacrificing Transport Tycoon economics and game logic. Thus "OpenTTD" and true multithreading are mutually exclusive.

I knew of the existence of those threads. What I did not know, that you could not do it without "sacrificing Transport Tycoon economics and game logic". So the solution is finding a fast 1-core CPU.

Thanks for the explanation, at least I know what the real reason is.

[Chris]

It doesn't have to be a one core processor, it just needs to be fast (clock rate and instructions per cycle). There are many dual core processors and even quad cores that fulfill this requirement.

[2457]

does anyone care to explain why multi threaded support for ottd is impossible ?
"an't be done without sacrificing Transport Tycoon economics and game logic"
this does not rely makes sense...

[Dave]

When Sports Interactive launched Football Manager in 2009 (?) that was the first of their games to use threading.

I have very little understanding of computers but if you're completing a number of tasks using different processors or different parts of the processor at once, surely this creates problems in ensuring they all remain in sync once they've been completed?

Or am I firing wide of the mark?

[Rubidium]

does anyone care to explain why multi threaded support for ottd is impossible ?
"an't be done without sacrificing Transport Tycoon economics and game logic"
this does not rely makes sense...

My posts at http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... 3#p1000293 and http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=999891#p999891 should give you an idea of what things cause problems. Some problems can be solved by changing the game logic, e.g. removal of crashing road vehicles.

[Expresso]

Version 2.0 isn't complete without Clippy.

[2457]

does anyone care to explain why multi threaded support for ottd is impossible ?
"an't be done without sacrificing Transport Tycoon economics and game logic"
this does not rely makes sense...

My posts at http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... 3#p1000293 and http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=999891#p999891 should give you an idea of what things cause problems. Some problems can be solved by changing the game logic, e.g. removal of crashing road vehicles.

none of those are revelant. the same game could be built with mutithreading in mind.
tipical example when a question is not understood but answered. (with an answer irrevelant).
but i figured it out my self. it would need a big re-write, not a loss of functionality.

to clear up things...
original question -> ottd v2.0 will be fully multithreaded ?
proper answer -> if someone rewrites exsisting code with multithread in mind, then yes.

would have saved a lot of time

[Drury]

Version 2.0 isn't complete without Clippy.

Looks like you're building level crossing traps through competitor's highway.

Would you like help?

[Rubidium]

to clear up things...
original question -> ottd v2.0 will be fully multithreaded ?
proper answer -> if someone rewrites exsisting code with multithread in mind, then yes.

The rewriting will require dropping some of the key aspects of the Transport Tycoon game logic, thus the game is not a Transport Tycoon clone anymore, i.e. it's not OpenTTD anymore. It will be a different game, and if you start rewriting code with multithreading in mind, you effectively start a new game from scratch... again resulting in something that is not OpenTTD.

In conclusion, the proper answer is: "OpenTTD 2.0 or whatever other version will never be fully multithreaded. If it happens, it is not OpenTTD anymore."

[Chris]

none of those are revelant. the same game could be built with mutithreading in mind.
tipical example when a question is not understood but answered. (with an answer irrevelant).
but i figured it out my self. it would need a big re-write, not a loss of functionality.

to clear up things...
original question -> ottd v2.0 will be fully multithreaded ?
proper answer -> if someone rewrites exsisting code with multithread in mind, then yes.

would have saved a lot of time

Oh do p*** off, the devs do a fantastic job of maintaining and adding new features to OTTD. They don't get paid, ergo don't be rude to them, and don't pretend that you know more about the game that they develop than they do.

[2457]

PBS signals are allso not included in original tt. so is the map array different, the map generator, the pathfinding, there is timetabling, and so on...
so even now, ottd is not a clone of ttd.
it has more features.
at best ottd mimics original tt and ands a lot of new functionality.
hence its not a 1:1 opnesource clone.
same would be the case if it was re-written with multithreading in mind.

funy, but .. still intresting.
someone asks what peeps would like to see in this game as features.
then others reply.

usualy they get flamed, or told to code the modification them self.
in witch case, why on earth ask what would be nice features ???

no, i do not say developers of this magnificent game should have to include everything asked by others.
no way. they do what they want. it is a great game as it is. praise the devs of OTTD.
and no, i never gona code anything for ottd. still if someone asks what features i would like, i will still mention that multi threading WOULD be nice, signals on bridges, and in tunnels, and programmable signals. I do not ask for them to be included, not ordering them like a pizza.
but still it WOULD be nice.


now.. since in the past 2-3 years this forum is full of trolls.. the few posts i made here are absolute pointless.
as trolls will keep trolling them.
so going ahed, i tell all trolls clearly :
i ignore every single feedback to this and the previous post. as it will be trolling. and since its trolling, its not worth reading.
so not worth posting eighter. And i bet there will be at least one troll who is not a developer of this game who will "try to explain" i'm wrong, and since i'm not a delevoper of ottd i should leave what is possible to them. ironic, as this troll will allso not be a developer of ottd.
time after time i visit this forum and i more and more dislike the high troll count. i registered in 2005. and its getting worse year after year.

[StopRightThere]

So if you won't listen to anything anyone says ever, and you won't listen to anyone who tries to explain to you that you're demanding of people their free time for your own entertainment, why are you here? It's one thing to say you'd like a certain feature and another to be a bit rude like you have.

[PikkaBird]

to clear up things...
original question -> ottd v2.0 will be fully multithreaded ?
proper answer -> if someone rewrites exsisting code with multithread in mind, then yes.

would have saved a lot of time

If you find that sort of answer useful, I am happy to inform you that everything anyone has ever suggested will be included in OpenTTD if someone includes it in OpenTTD.

Personally I think "the parts of the game that can be usefully split into separate threads already are, here is a heap of detailed information" is a more interesting answer.

[2457]

So if you won't listen to anything anyone says ever, and you won't listen to anyone who tries to explain to you that you're demanding of people their free time for your own entertainment, why are you here? It's one thing to say you'd like a certain feature and another to be a bit rude like you have.

Got ya, TROLL.
"you're demanding of people their free time for your own entertainment," -->>> I told , i do NOT DEMAND anyone to do code anything.
but TROLLS can not read. or if they do, they fail to understand them pesky words."cuz they'r smar A(double dollar signals).

and yes i know, i should not even reply to things like this. fuel on fire , natural TROLL food.

[Dave]

Dunno where you're from but in my country if you "tell" someone to do something that's not requesting politely.

And my first language is English. And you?