Changing Toyland to futuristic space colony

Killer 11 · Post by **Killer 11** » 07 Mar 2006 12:39

Well if we use starcraft sprites for ships it is allowed if we don't sell nor claim copyright's on them(becouse now a lot of mods modify starcraft gfx but since blizzard cares about it's customers they let you do it if you don't sell those modified sprites)

Villem · Post by **Villem** » 07 Mar 2006 12:50

Or maybe you could just, be creative and actually do your own ship designs

Red*Star · Post by **Red*Star** » 07 Mar 2006 14:09

Like these?

(But I don't know if they render nice in all views, when they are textured.)

Killer 11 · Post by **Killer 11** » 07 Mar 2006 18:21

actualy i could supply you with some freighters of my own creation(unstudded lego models)in blender format.

chipetke · Post by **chipetke** » 07 Mar 2006 22:16

@Red*Star: they're cool, but the left one looks like a Sovereign's engineering hull

I hope it's not an accident

:D:D

Edit:
BTW we should ask the patchteam if the planes (spaceships) can be stopped in the air (well, "land" at 2 levels above airport), and they have to load/unload freight/passangers by transporter beam

:D:D

"Hey Scotty! Beam me up!"

Red*Star · Post by **Red*Star** » 07 Mar 2006 23:29

Do you really mean >the< Sovereign class? If so, I really don't see the similarity apart of the fact that it has two pylons and one thing that looks like a deflector (although it's actually two deflectors...) At least the warp nacelles don't have any similarity: http://users.sisna.com/roguewing1/schem ... ereign.jpg

chipetke · Post by **chipetke** » 08 Mar 2006 09:55

really.. forgot that the Soverign class' pylons are located at the end of the hull, and the nacelles are parallel and have a more aerodynamic shape.

Actually I like more the "non-fictional" ships - I mean those ships that can be seen on screen, except the NX-01. It looks lika an Akira class ship with no armature tower and somebody stepped on

Red*Star · Post by **Red*Star** » 08 Mar 2006 11:11

chipetke wrote: really.. forgot that the Soverign class' pylons are located at the end of the hull, and the nacelles are parallel and have a more aerodynamic shape.

Actually I like more the "non-fictional" ships - I mean those ships that can be seen on screen, except the NX-01. It looks lika an Akira class ship with no armature tower and somebody stepped on

Unfortunately yes... I mean, the Akira does looks great, I have a big picture of the port view hanging above my door - but I want to know whose crazy mind came to the idea to disfigure the Akira so much as it has been done in ST:Ent...

(To say nothing about that the NX-01 looks much too modern for the time the series plays in...)

Back on topic: Thank you for the commendationon the models, chipetke

.
The landing/docking point is also a good idea, I also thought about how to impliment a "docking process" for our space vessels

. I don't know if it's possible, but maybe we can keep the current handling when we modifiy the graphics, so that the landing point is one tile moved forward... I hope you know what I mean

Edit:
Have forgotten that planes have shadows. So my idea won't work - unless at least the shadows will be moved 32 px downwards, like in the spacesport-muckup I've just created.

Ouuch... that's another point which comes into my mind: We won't have diffuse light in space, so shadows will be completely black, unless other light sources are near them. But in TTD shadows are always grey... (!)

chipetke · Post by **chipetke** » 08 Mar 2006 11:57

Floating while loading/unloading: IMHO this can be achieved by "misplacing" the sprites. This is a really reqired thing since there are very few ships that can land on surface (mostly smaller ships - Intrepid, Defiant, ...). I'm not sure if "yofs" sprite parameters have to be decreased or increased in the .nfo file.

Plane shadows are dropped by the graphic engine or they are sprites too, made up with an action colour? If they are sprites, we're saved and able to do these ST ships

Edit: Verrrry nice mockup

Would be cool, if ships could dock in for loading/unloading, but I think, it's impossible. if we draw the sprite one tile forward by "xofs" & "yofs" it can work for one docking port, but for another port it's located wrong..

and can make the sprite sorter go crazy...

The floating method seems much easier...

Killer 11 · Post by **Killer 11** » 08 Mar 2006 13:13

this is what i have created it wasn't supposed to be a civilian vessel but i can easily modify it

Red*Star · Post by **Red*Star** » 08 Mar 2006 15:34

Kewl, nice ship Killer 11

.

The problem with all our ships is: If we render them too big, it will cover too much tiles and cause problems with clipping when docked, if we render them too small, you can't see anything of the details

.
I think we must find a scale for each single ship that is a compromise between these two poles...

@chipetke:
Plane shadows are made by the graphic engine by using the transparent blue of the sprite as a mask: The non-blue area is made transparent grey (I think the same way transparencies of station roofs are done).

(So it won't make sense to adapt the sprite xofs and yofs, because the shadow will move with the plane... and we probably will become problems with the clipping.)

Because also the shadow color is not sufficient to our needs (as I already said, it has to be completely black for the space mod) we so or so have to ask a developer to code us a space mod.

DaleStan · Post by **DaleStan** » 08 Mar 2006 16:15

chipetke wrote:Floating while loading/unloading: IMHO this can be achieved by "misplacing" the sprites. This is a really reqired thing since there are very few ships that can land on surface (mostly smaller ships - Intrepid, Defiant, ...). I'm not sure if "yofs" sprite parameters have to be decreased or increased in the .nfo file.

Neither. yofs is the location in the PCX.

chipetke wrote:Plane shadows are dropped by the graphic engine or they are sprites too, made up with an action colour? If they are sprites, we're saved and able to do these ST ships

Neither. Shadows are the exact same sprite as the plane. So a airplane set to "land" to units above the ground will also cast a shadow two units above the ground.

Red*Star wrote:(So it won't make sense to adapt the sprite xofs and yofs, because the shadow will move with the plane... and we probably will become problems with the clipping.)

Correction "it won't make sense to adapt the sprite xofs and yofs because then the sprite will have to be moved in the PCX too, unless you want nasty white blocks in the sprite."

But even if you change the correct metadata (xrel/yrel), you'll still have the same problems.

Red*Star · Post by **Red*Star** » 08 Mar 2006 17:52

DaleStan wrote: But even if you change the correct metadata (xrel/yrel), you'll still have the same problems.

That's what I meant.

chipetke · Post by **chipetke** » 08 Mar 2006 20:45

/me thought about the sprite positioning ingame not the pcx coordinates

But if it's impossible

... but I still want'em

DaleStan wrote:
chipetke wrote:Plane shadows are dropped by the graphic engine or they are sprites too, made up with an action colour? If they are sprites, we're saved and able to do these ST ships
Neither. Shadows are the exact same sprite as the plane. So a airplane set to "land" to units above the ground will also cast a shadow two units above the ground.

So the shadows are calculated from the current height of plane, and the plane sprite itself... no good

Red*Star wrote:Plane shadows are made by the graphic engine by using the transparent blue of the sprite as a mask: The non-blue area is made transparent grey (I think the same way transparencies of station roofs are done).

You are possibly wrong. As I remember the wiki well (and some forum posts) station roofs are made with a special "semi-transparency-yellow" action colour. But they are made up with two sprites, the normal roof graphic, and the semi-transparency mask sprite which contains only that special (?) yellow colour

Red*Star · Post by **Red*Star** » 08 Mar 2006 21:06

Yes, I am wrong, if you interpret what I said in this way. But that's my fault because I expressed myself unclear

However, I /meant/ that the /transparency/ is done in the same way, not that the pixels which /are transparent/ are calculated the same way.
I know that for the stations the magic yellow is used (and, I have made the experience that it is so while I tried to code my own station) to determine transparent pixels.

Hope now it's clearer

DaleStan · Post by **DaleStan** » 08 Mar 2006 21:15

chipetke wrote:special "semi-transparency-yellow" action colour.

That is NOT, repeat NOT, a special color. Transparency is a function of how the sprite is drawn, not which colors are in the sprite. (http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php ... oordinates and http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php ... lorSprites)

chipetke · Post by **chipetke** » 08 Mar 2006 21:15

I (think I) understand... without patch programming the whole idea with ST ships is impossible.. but I can suspect that on the asteroids there are some dust that makes some diffuse light, and I can believe

that all of them can land on surface. Because they are so beautiful

My english is very far from perfect, so I could misunderstood it even if you said it perfectly

DaleStan wrote:
chipetke wrote: special "semi-transparency-yellow" action colour.
That is NOT, repeat NOT, a special color. Transparency is a function of how the sprite is drawn, not which colors are in the sprite. (http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php ... oordinates and http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php ... lorSprites)

okay, okay, okay... please calm down...

I only hope that the rest of my post was correct. OK, it's not a special color. simply this was chosen to draw the mask...

I'll go and get deeply into the wiki..

Red*Star · Post by **Red*Star** » 08 Mar 2006 22:29

chipetke wrote:My english is very far from perfect, so I could misunderstood it even if you said it perfectly

No problem

, I also have problems sometimes - at least with learning vocabulary. I always blame that on my bad English teacher(s) I have had in school

DaleStan: It's right, cool down a little bit. Just because you are deeper in the TTD programming structures then we are you don't have to shout. Just relax and don't be so harsh - please - that makes the atmosphere here much more pleasant

DaleStan · Post by **DaleStan** » 09 Mar 2006 05:48

I've been fighting that misconception for over a year now, and I thought it had finally vanished.

Discovering that something like this has, in fact, not vanished, makes me a rather unhappy camper, and results in posts that probably should not have been posted.

It's not personal. Basically everyone who speaks falsehoods gets corrected. Some more harshly than others, but that's more a function of the falsehood than the speaker.

Post by **PikkaBird** » 09 Mar 2006 07:30

Is it possible to use a different sprite for the shadow with a var action 2 variable 40, since the shadow is the "mail compartment" and a seperate vehicle?

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