Multiplayer with 3 or more players [working now]

Csaboka · Post by **Csaboka** » 19 Jan 2004 10:10

Well, it isn't going to support lobbying (DirectX 1 and 2 doesn't support this). If I do it, it'll work like this:

The server player selects "Host the game" and TCP/IP like before.
Clients select "Connect to game", TCP/IP, then specify the address of the server.
Everybody is constantly informed about how many players are connected and clients can change their minds by pressing Cancel. On the server's side, however, the Cancel button changes to Start if there's anyone connected, so the server player can start the game after everybody is in.

The server machine isn't really dedicated, it only does some special functions while connecting. After the connection is established, the game will run in a peer-to-peer manner. I don't know how DirectX can handle firewalls and proxies, so it might or might not work with remote computers.

Nappe1 · Post by **Nappe1** » 19 Jan 2004 17:42

Csaboka wrote: I don't know how DirectX can handle firewalls and proxies, so it might or might not work with remote computers.

as a loooong time lurker, this thread got my attention so well that I had to sign up.

in fact, since DirectX 6, at least MS internet connection sharing has been able to "sniff" on going games on local lan and make them visible to the net. In case of real firewalls, there's not much you can do except re-configure firewall allow both way traffic on computer that is connecting (client) or hosting the game. both way traffic is needed able to join on servers. (this applies from DX5 to DX7, DX8 and 9 have new DirectPlay8 and DirectPlay9 services that allow full Server-client implementation, but that differs A LOT for peer to peer networking used on older versions.)

but this is the case on all the other games that use DP for net and lan gamas as well.

and oh... the poll... my answer: yes, definately, as long as out of syncs aren't too often.

Thanks Csaboka, you already have done really marvelous job with TTDPatch networking patches. I myself planned many times starting to look at networking code, but never did find a time for it. Of course I start testing your 'network bulds' on LAN with my friends as soon as possible. hopefully we can bring some valuable bug reports about the crashes.

and P.S. Csaboka, on some systems TTD Dos original is rock solid with IPX. I can't even remember last time it being crashed. it certainly has crashed, but can't exactly say how many games ago it did it last time...

SHADOW-XIII · Post by **SHADOW-XIII** » 19 Jan 2004 17:57

welcome Nappe1 .. I already see you that you are very valuable member

Killer 11 · Post by **Killer 11** » 19 Jan 2004 20:28

Don't say that he joined only today

Csaboka · Post by **Csaboka** » 21 Jan 2004 12:25

First of all, welcome to the forums Nappe!

Nappe1 wrote:and P.S. Csaboka, on some systems TTD Dos original is rock solid with IPX. I can't even remember last time it being crashed. it certainly has crashed, but can't exactly say how many games ago it did it last time...

Well, I tried it a long ago once or twice and it crashed only around 2000 (without using sv2flip), but it was the unpatched version. I don't know how long a game can keep running after a desynch, but there shouldn't have been many of them...

Csaboka · Post by **Csaboka** » 21 Jan 2004 12:43

I've released a new experimental version, look at announcement topic.

Using the SDK nilsi found, I could make a patch that reduces CPU usage in multiplayer from 100% to a sensible value. Thanks again nilsi.

Csaboka · Post by **Csaboka** » 26 Jan 2004 10:38

I've started to work on multiplayer enhancements (allowing up to 8 players). The very basics are finished now, but no load/save support, subsidiaries don't work, and sometimes it desynchs right after starting a new game... It'll take a while to make it work well with all features. I won't release it until at least load/save support is implemented, though.

Nappe1 · Post by **Nappe1** » 26 Jan 2004 13:33

Csaboka wrote:I've started to work on multiplayer enhancements (allowing up to 8 players). The very basics are finished now, but no load/save support, subsidiaries don't work, and sometimes it desynchs right after starting a new game... It'll take a while to make it work well with all features. I won't release it until at least load/save support is implemented, though.

sounds excelent.

keep up the good work. right now I don't have possibility test network mode, but on next weekend we (I and my friends) start testing it with newest available build (this also includes 2 player builds if it's latest one then.) and we try document all crashes / bugs we found as detailed as possible and then send them to you. and hopefully we are able to help you with that.

Post by **orudge** » 26 Jan 2004 16:20

I can test various operating system combinations: I have on one PC XP and 98 (plus Virtual PC with NT 4.0, 2000, 98, 95, Me, 2003, although TTD is very slow on VPC). On my P75 I have 98 and NT 3.51 (the latter won't work with TTD though obviously), and on my laptop I have XP.

Anyway, sounds great, Csaba.

Do you have any idea though if it'd be possible to make it so you don't need such a low ping (for possible Internet support in the future)? No rush, just one thing at a time, I'm only wondering.

Csaboka · Post by **Csaboka** » 28 Jan 2004 15:13

I've uploaded the first test version (2.0.1 alpha 10 VCs) to
http://users.tt-forums.net/csaboka/ttdpatch/

It's based on alpha 10 because I couldn't download the diffs for alpha 11 yet.
To enable more players, turn on the new "enhancemultiplayer" switch, then connect games as I said earlier. Note that protocols other than TCP/IP may not work correctly.

What should work:

Starting new random games and playing scenarios.
Saving and loading games. (2-player savegames should be compatible with unpatched TTD)
Sending messages to other players with the message sending menu entry in the "news" menu.
Regular game actions (building, buying vehicles etc)

What doesn't work for sure:

Subsidiary management and Cht: PlayerID. If you try to use them, all games will lock up or fall back to single player.
Recording high scores in 2050. I think I have some time before the first 3-player game reaches this date
Since sv2flip doesn't support 2+ player games yet, desynchs can only be solved by loading an earlyer savegame.

Known bugs:

Sometimes when you want to end the game and go back to the title screen, some games lock up. I don't know what causes this, but exiting TTD seems to work fine.
3 player game with two VMware Win98 virtual machines was very very slow for me. I hope this is only because of virtual networking, so tell me if it lags badly for you as well.

Since my testing environment gets very slow with 3 players, I can't test things thoroughly. The real testing should be done by you if you want this new feature to work correctly. Please send bug reports and other feedback to this topic if you can.

Csaboka · Post by **Csaboka** » 28 Jan 2004 15:20

orudge wrote:Do you have any idea though if it'd be possible to make it so you don't need such a low ping (for possible Internet support in the future)? No rush, just one thing at a time, I'm only wondering.

I have no idea. TTD needs to send packets to the other machine at the end of every tick to keep game times in synch. The only thing I can think of is to combine all small 52-byte packets into a large one and send it in one piece at the end of the tick. This would need only one TCP and IP header per tick. Most of the time, however, you don't do anything, so only one packet is sent (end of packets), and it won't be faster that way, either.

Nappe1 · Post by **Nappe1** » 28 Jan 2004 17:43

SHADOW-XIII wrote:welcome Nappe1 .. I already see you that you are very valuable member

thanks.

sorry that I didn't notice this before.

Maverick · Post by **Maverick** » 28 Jan 2004 20:45

Csaba, Great work!

squishycube · Post by **squishycube** » 29 Jan 2004 20:26

Hell yeah, keep 'em ccoming Csaboka! I might even find people to play TTD with in the future, if internet play would become possible.

SHADOW-XIII · Post by **SHADOW-XIII** » 29 Jan 2004 21:12

great Csaba ... when I only will be able to test it (I think soon) I will

Csaboka · Post by **Csaboka** » 02 Feb 2004 11:53

Any test results

Where are those 28 people who want to play it regularly?
If no one uses it, I can't see any reason to continue working on it

.

Warspite · Post by **Warspite** » 02 Feb 2004 12:13

I would be using it, but my friend is on XP and i believe multiplayer still doesnt work on XP??

DominionSpy · Post by **DominionSpy** » 02 Feb 2004 12:19

Csaboka wrote:Any test results
Where are those 28 people who want to play it regularly?
If no one uses it, I can't see any reason to continue working on it .

I'm afraid I have to wait until my friends come back from Uni - so at Easter I'm sure I'll have lots of test results for you.

Csaboka · Post by **Csaboka** » 02 Feb 2004 12:25

Warspite wrote:I would be using it, but my friend is on XP and i believe multiplayer still doesnt work on XP??

The latest versions (including alpha 10 VCs 2) should work on XP (I test it on XP as well), so it shouldn't be a problem.

VPN-User · Post by **VPN-User** » 02 Feb 2004 13:03

Works but very very very slow! I had a ping time of 70ms to the other side.

Unplayable. It even lags behind when you scroll around. But it works.

Entering IP-Adress feature is very cool and makes it possible to play online without a VPN!

When will Josef include these features in his alphas?

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Multiplayer with 3 or more players [working now]

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