General Dutch and Belgium Transport Talk

[Niek]

its obvious!

if i want to go to the island up there, why do i have to ride for 3 hours? with the HST it would be much shorter.


and, to get some more economical development over there!

And it could be stretched to go all the way to Hamburg and further. Isn't that kind of the idea anyway, a Europe-wide high-speed network?

[DeletedUser21]

Second page already.

The new VIRM-4 Rollingstock has been unveiled at Alstom Germany. With seats for first class and second class conform the new NS standards (red for firstclass and blue for second class), the lift has been removed so stairs are wider and more space at the doors. Also the first class has been refitted with extra power outlets for notebooks.

More info:

http://www.mp-produktie.nl/rn08/2008-06 ... 0Aken.html
(Dutch)

[Illegal_Alien]

And something just happened we didnt expected (riiight), The Ansoldo Breda V250 (that ugly thingy), hasnt been tested yet on the testtrack, and they expect some delays.

[hertogjan]

Now it is a sitting duck.
I wonder if that thing will ever move. I mean, it is so ugly that the thing can't possibly move.
On the other hand, I hope that it will go as fast as they claim it goes, so that you won't have enough time to actually see it.

[Illegal_Alien]

Almost a frontal collision between 2 passenger trains. (Veolia train and one from Germany) They stopped the Veolia train just in time.

[hertogjan]

Last week I saw in the news that the number of passages of red signals is significantly higher for the "new" transport companies (Connexxion, Veolia, Arriva) than for NS (Nederlandse Spoorwegen, the largest railway company). Specifically, quite a few dangerous situations happened on the Valleilijn between Amersfoort and Ede-Wageningen, a service which is currently operated by Connexxion (this is also the only train service by Connexxion in the Netherlands). An eyewitness reported how a Connexxion train passed a red signal and almost drove onto the main line on which an intercity train was nearing at high speed. Fortunately, the driver of the Connexxion train stopped before entering the main line, but far beyond the point where he should have stopped, thus avoiding a very serious collision. It turns out that this incident was not the only one to happen on that stretch of track, but fortunately there were no incidents so far in which someone was injured or killed.

These incidents happen a lot more for the smaller rail transport companies than for NS. It is believed that one of the reasons is that the drivers of the "new" companies get a lot less training (education) for becoming a train driver than the NS train drivers do. In other words, it is believed that NS train drivers pass a lot less red signals because of their longer training.
I do not know whether there are any laws on the qualifications which a train driver must have, or that the companies themselves can determine these qualifications.
I believe that the Department of Transport (Ministerie van Verkeer en Waterstaat) should investigate all these incidents, and should impose stricter safety rules on train companies. If incidents happen, the involved companies should get very high fines (in the order of millions of €s), so that they will be forced to maintain a high level of safety.
Otherwise it is just a matter of time until a serious accident happens with passenger trains colliding at high speed.

[chevyrider]

At the end of the year we get ATB v.v. (improved version).
This provides that you can drive trough a red signal.
The ATB we have now works only above 40 km/h.

The new system measures the deceleration and the distance towards the red signal.
If you don't brake enough, this system makes an emergency stop.
The same way as the now used ATB does above 40 km/h.

Driving away from a platform through a red signal is completely impossible.
This is i think in some 90% of red passages the cause.

You can recognize the signals what have that system at the yellow plate next to the rail in front of the signal.

[Illegal_Alien]

Happend yesterday, no-one injured:



Sources: http://www.flickr.com/photos/treinen_le ... 6/sizes/o/



And on this picture all the lines who are out of service (XXXX) The one near Den Haag was maintenance, near Gouda was the accident, so you could reach Amsterdam, Den Haag or Utrecht from Rotterdam (except if you go a long way around via Dordrecht), Den Haag could been reached with RandstadRail (Metroline) but thats is.

The Thalys should be there, but it was rerouted because of the maintenance work, and this was the only alternative rout too Den Haag. Well now that one is jammed. But today everything is started to work again.

[trainboy2004]

Is that on the east or the west side of Gouda?

I think it's about time ATB-vv is going to be active. Or more of this low speed accidents will happen.

[Illegal_Alien]

I think its on the side of Utrecht not sure though. (Thalys was passing by, the Koploper was just moving from platform.)

[trainboy2004]

Btw that reminds me of this:

http://www.brandweerzijpe.nl/Afbeeldingen/ritsen.jpg

Lucky fact that the Thalys uses Jacobs Bogies, that's much safer.

[Illegal_Alien]

http://www.nos.nl/nosjournaal/artikelen ... gouda.html

Pictures + Video (dutch)

[Dave]

Got any information about the cause of the accident? I assume a red signal is to blame?

Any serious facts coming out or is it all just railfan speculation?

[chevyrider]

Still nothing, can take over 6 months for the outcome.
I drive almost every day over that junction, and have my ideas about the cause.
No, i want tell till the official investigations are published

[Dave]

Yeah same here but there's usually a preliminary investigation which makes tentative steps towards identifying the cause.

[Pug]

Strange that nothing has been posted about the freight train which derailed close to Amsterdam Muidersloot, thereby forcing trains from Utrecht to Amsterdam to be rerouted through Amsterdam Schiphol. A serious accident with a lot of damage and they've been cleaning it up for almost a week now, accident happened 22/11 in the afternoon.

Does anyone have more info about this?

[hertogjan]

I don't have more info about this incident in particular, but it occurs to me that the number of derailments near Amsterdam Central Station appears higher than average. A few years ago, there have been several derailments (I believe two in quick succession) of freight trains near Amsterdam CS. It might have something to do with the condition of the tracks and the switches near Amsterdam CS, but perhaps this is nothing more than speculation.

[Illegal_Alien]

I can remember the crash of that intercity with the coach on the roof, then the freighttrain. Maybe time to do a complete overhaul on the station?

[trainboy2004]

Nah, it's better to create a new arc between Amsterdam WTC and Amsterdam Sloterdijk. So freight trains can drive around Amsterdam CS via the south.

[hertogjan]

At least on the spot of the accident itself the tracks have to be completely replaced. I have seen pictures of the tracks at the location of the derailment, and it looks absolutely horrible. I believe that the damage is quite large because the train has been driving several hundreds of meters with a derailed wagon before it derailed totally.
It is even said that one bridge has taken so many damage that the structural integrity might have been affected. At least a large piece of concrete fell off and almost struck a cyclist who was cycling under the bridge when the accident happened.

It is going to be a very expensive trip for the company who was running this train.