Dutch Trainset v2.0

[michael blunck]

@Hyronymus

Hehe. You understand.

The only reason I kept that one in mind is that it should be possible to design a "combined animation" between a loading train and crowded station platforms, i.e. whenever a train would start loading, passengers on the platform would be "walking" up to the open doors of that train (train must be long enough) and seem to get into the train. (Question remains how to proceed with arriving trains ...)

O/c this would require lots of work and lots of sprites for a doubtful type of enhancement and ATM I´m working already on too many labour-intensive ideas. But o/c it´s another challenging idea.

regards
Michael

[DaleStan]

from what ive heard and read it should be(if i understood the nfo tutorial correctly). The reason most sets dont have [opening and closing states] is because they dont have the sprites or people dont realise its possible.

Enlighten me.
Loading states, yes.
But opening and closing states?

[Gamble]

talked to Purno yesterday in his channel, and he told me could use some help on graphics so I started yesterday eve on the NMBS 22.5

would like to get you're oppinion people

[Purno]

Ok, first let me say it looks quite good for an engine with a quite hard shape.

Some comments;

- Although the pictures are not very clear about this, the engine is kinda blue, AFAIK.
- The engine is too high, I'd suggest decreasing the height with 1 pixel in | / and \ view.
- The wheels of the engine (and everything else under the engine) should have some different color than the rest of the engine.
- The headlights needs more variations. We needs sprites with only the yellow headlight on (don't forget the third headlight above the windows) and sprites with only the red headlights on.
- _ view needs more room for the wheels (2 pixels high) and anything else under the engine.
- _ view needs more room for the roof (4 pixels high).
- The roofs are not correctly shaded.
- The pantographs are wrong; at least one of them should be up, the other down, the direction of the pantographs is a bit hard to see, but I think it's _<____>_ , if you understand what I mean.
- There's some white text at the front, which you made yellow.
- The roof is not correctly shaped in / and \ view, at the border of the front (just slightly above the windows).
- You wouldn't be able to see any headlights in _ view.
- | view needs to be longer (longer roof)

That's it for now. Keep up the good work! Don't be scared by the amount of comments I have.

[Hyronymus]

I agree with Purno's comments although I think the picture here are quite clear on the colour actually. I know the rer cabin in / and \ view are hard to draw but perhaps you can make them more visible somehow.

For a first attempt I'm pretty impressed btw, Gamble. Keep it up!

[Gamble]

Hyronymus:
I know the rer cabin in / and \ view are hard to draw but perhaps you can make them more visible somehow.
I can't see any cabin on the rear of the engine, there is no door at this side either, as far as I can see, so that's why i didn't draw it.

Purno:
- Although the pictures are not very clear about this, the engine is kinda blue, AFAIK.
Done, delibarately left the | and _ view grey, so you can see what it looked like and what the blue looks like

- The engine is too high, I'd suggest decreasing the height with 1 pixel in | / and \ view.
This will not do any good to the engine, it will make it too small to fit on the rails.

- The wheels of the engine (and everything else under the engine) should have some different color than the rest of the engine.
With the color of the engine edited, the weels can be better seen.

- The headlights needs more variations. We needs sprites with only the yellow headlight on (don't forget the third headlight above the windows) and sprites with only the red headlights on.
Right I forgot the light above the cabin window, drawn now. But you don't want a red light on front, only a white/yellow one? Forgot the one above the window in the | view, its on there now (not in this attachment)

- _ view needs more room for the wheels (2 pixels high) and anything else under the engine.
Done.

- _ view needs more room for the roof (4 pixels high).
Done.

- The roofs are not correctly shaded.
What you want different, and what view do you mean, I changed the grey to a little darker in the _ view, it makes it look better.

- The pantographs are wrong; at least one of them should be up, the other down, the direction of the pantographs is a bit hard to see, but I think it's _<____>_ , if you understand what I mean.
Tried to get the rear one up, think it looks quite good.

- There's some white text at the front, which you made yellow.
White now.

- The roof is not correctly shaped in / and \ view, at the border of the front (just slightly above the windows).
Edited, looks better now yes.

- You wouldn't be able to see any headlights in _ view.
You're right, you would see the yellow fitting of the headlights.
Edited.
- | view needs to be longer (longer roof)
Edited, added 3 pixel in total.

I'll add the renewed one as an attachment, for if you got some new comments.

BTW, thanks on the compliments.

[Purno]

This is how _ view should be shaped;

[SWASTIKA]

I understand what you mean about the view Purno, but when standing side on to a locomotive, or anything for that matter, you can never see both ends unless; A: you're looking through a gigantic refracted lens from a far distance away, or B: the loco (or whatever) is seriously damaged by a side impact that has bent the main structure of the object.

you should only see to the centre line of a vehicle if it has a spherical shape on either end. i'm not trying to make a comment on the way you draw or your sprites, they're very good, but i don't understand your logic?

do you have any model trains? if you do, take a single loco out place it on a bench and stand at the view you would see in the game, you'll find that you can't see either end (unless you have something small like N-Gauge
which is usually shorter than the gap between your eyes so it gives a false effect).

Just thought i'd mention it, it's a basic rule of perspective. The further away an object is the smaller it will appear, so the far side of your train should be made to look smaller (not in physical size but with using darker colours), not bigger

Here's what i mean:

[Purno]

You forget several things;

- The fronts of this engine are under an angle.
- From TT view you look from above the engine, so you see both fronts since they're under an angle.
- TT is not perspective, but isometric.

I can't explain it better, but I know I'm right.

When you look at the top of an engine with angled fronts you would see something like this:

| front | ----------------------- roof -------------------------- | rear |

(engine side would be /=====\, like in this case)

It's uncomparable to Real Life, as Real Life isn't isometric. Besides, you don't look at a train from the above, usually. Remember that TT point of view, is high in the sky.

[SWASTIKA]

Yeh, i spose that's kinda right... but unless the angle of the roof is more accute (ie: the highest central point on the roofs end to the lowest part on the sides) than the angle of the noses central point, then you shouldn't be able to see the oppisite side of the cab... only half.

Look in my previous post, i made an edit with a diagram Pay close attention to the angle of the roof and the cab... and imagine what it would do if you pivited those angle to make a flat nose

[Purno]

Agreed to the image, but firstly that's not the case with this engine, secondly it would be only a matter of a very few pixels.

[Caelan]

Just a more general question, how far are we with the inventory of the data?

[Aegir]

Swastika, you're right as far as 'perspective' goes, but isometric is a different kettle of fish. You retain all dimensions throughout the entire thing. One of the first things I learnt during technical drawing at trade school.

I'm not much of an artist when it comes to trains though, and you're stuff is quite good, I'll just take it on faith you all know what you're doing .

[Purno]

Just a more general question, how far are we with the inventory of the data?

You mean the excel sheet Hyronymus works out for our coder? Dunno, TBH...

[Gamble]

I don't if you looked at it in 'groot formaat' in MSPaint, but if you did that you can see that I made a darker area for the front and rear, in normal view you can hardly see it, so I'll just make it a little bigger so can see it better in normal view. I hope that's about it for now?

EDIT: changed the color on all the views to blue-ish, made the front side on the _ view more viewable with a lighter blue, it's hard to see on the transparent blue

@ Purno: did you want the red headlights on the front or not?

[SWASTIKA]

Red lights on the rear, White lights on the front just like a car

Purno & Aegir: Yeh, i kinda get it now. I just think that the far side should be less visible, A LOT of Purno's stuff look disproportioned to me because he hasn't made the far ends of the nose/tail darker - i'll see if i can find a prime example of it, then edit it and show you - it's hard to explain

[Gamble]

Right, weird, because the picture of the real enigine has red headlights as well, but okay if you want it to only have red lights on the rear, so be it .

[Purno]

Right, weird, because the picture of the real enigine has red headlights as well, but okay if you want it to only have red lights on the rear, so be it .

Red lights aren't turned on at the 'front' (front being dependant of the driving directions of the train). You can just make them blue, or greyish, like a light that is turned off. Samething for the rear, you just make the yellow ligths greyed-off there.

[Gamble]

Well if you got no other comments on the engine then it's done I guess.

I must say I have learned a lot from this engine, and actually I'm looking forward to making new ones!

Check out the final result, I hope you guys are happy with the result.

[Purno]

The lower row of pixels in / and \ view need to show the wheels and such under the train. I'd suggest replacing one line of blue pixels by grey/brown pixels.