FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

[Alberth]

Unfortunately, no.

You cannot express "reviewed this string against the master file at <date/revision>" currently.
We need an extension of the NML language file to express that notion. So far nobody found a nice way to write that down.

[Ammler]

a little workaroud would be to alter the line but keep the string:

Code: Select all

STR_CARGO_NAME_FRUITS.t                                                         :gyümölcsöt
STR_CARGO_NAME_LUMBER                                                          :Fűrészáru
STR_CARGO_NAME_LUMBER.t                                                        :fűrészárut
STR_CARGO_NAME_METAL                                                            :Fém

Judgement if that is nice enough is up to you

[Brumi]

That's not a bad idea after all

[andythenorth]

So what's been going on in my least-favourite industry set (least favourite because I have to work on it and I'm lazy)?

1. inserted a python pre-processing layer. A bit of history. FIRS was coded in nfo + c pre-processor (cpp), then yexo and planetmaker and terkhen (mostly, maybe others helped, my brain can't remember) converted it to nml + cpp which was an enormous and heroic task. Then I sulked for a bit because I didn't know nml. Then I learnt nml, and then I sulked some more because my brain doesn't work so well with the cpp stuff. But I've proven python+nml works for FISH and BANDIT, so I decided to convert FIRS to use python. The fun part has been keeping a lot of the cpp in place and working, and not needing to change it. So there have been about 200 revisions to add the python stuff, and apart from some mistakes by me adding files, FIRS has continued to work for every revision. Whether this was a good thing to do or not remains to be proven, but it was fun, and the set is moving again.

2. been adding snow graphics. Obvious what that is.

3. added a framework for providing economies. Long talked about, never done. Now it's done. Nightly builds of FIRS have 3 economies (as parameter): 'FIRS', 'Basic', and 'Test Economy 3', the last one is totally meaningless. These are not savegame safe for now. I will change economies however I like until next tagged release of FIRS, and I might not remember to bump min compatible version. So you have been warned. Anyway, what do economies mean?

Each economy offers a different combination of cargos and industries. Some economies will have lots of industries and cargos, some will have few. Some will focus on a specific type of industrial chain, others less so. Also some properties change, like cargo payment rate, or probability of an industry type.

What doesn't and won't change is industry behaviour like supplies or production. It's too complicated to change that. Accepted/produced cargos might change a bit depending on what cargos are in the economy, but rules about production boosts, combinations for secondary industries etc won't change.

Some industries might only appear in certain economies. Mmmm, easter eggs.

There will be more economies. For now, I will accept any sane economy that anyone wants to contribute, provided it is coherent and doesn't break cargo chains, and has an interesting name. 10-20 economies is probably about right, more than that is a bit insane.

4. framework for changing graphics over time. E.g. steam cranes change to diesel cranes after certain date, horses to trucks etc. Entire buildings shouldn't change in the same way, but can have different appearance depending on build date.

5. DanMacK is drawing some lovely graphics. Work in progress includes Guano Mine, and replacement graphics for default Coal Mine, Bauxite Mine and Iron Ore Mine.

6. Industry animation got a bit less tedious to add. It was ok, but a small hassle. Now it's less so.

7. Fixed some bugs and crap.

8. The python compile step can also auto-generate documentation, showing which industries & cargos are in which economy. If anyone wants to chart that, I can get it to output JSON, config file format, or something else for structured data.

9. Stuff.

[wallyweb]

'FIRS', 'Basic', and 'Test Economy 3', the last one is totally meaningless

and the meanings of 'FIRS', 'Basic' are ...

[YNM]

'FIRS', 'Basic', and 'Test Economy 3', the last one is totally meaningless

and the meanings of 'FIRS', 'Basic' are ...

Lemme guess : His own-styled gameplay (what FIRS should used to be) , Basic economies (as in a normal OTTD w/o FIRS economies) , and the last maybe "sandbox" thingies ; or simply has its name undecided ?

[SquireJames]

As a suggestion for an economy, would it be possible to code a "real world" economy? Where by payment rates for coal start high at say 1900 and then steadily drop past 1940 with oil rates rising. Same with passengers, going down post 1960s. You could also have things like iron ore prices dropping, while bauxite prices go up, reflecting the change from steel products to lighter aluminium and alloys. It would be nice for those of us that play somewhat realistically, and also it would provide more challenge to the player in the long term, after money usually becomes a bit irrelevant. Suddenly instead of sitting on his profitable coal lines and such, he has to change what he is hauling gradually, reflecting the changes in demand that are faced in the real world.

[andythenorth]

@wallyweb http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/pus ... t_docs.txt
'Test Economy 3' is literally a nothing, just testing that the framework code works.

@squirejames - spec doesn't permit cargo payment rates to change. However custom profit calculation cb might offer a workaround to that. Cargo payment is a grey area, as most of it would be better controlled by a game script than newgrf.

[wallyweb]

@wallyweb http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/pus ... t_docs.txt
'Test Economy 3' is literally a nothing, just testing that the framework code works.

[andythenorth]

Default generic construction states.... (these might in future include specific sprites for each industry).

[Bob_Mackenzie]

They look good!

Is it possible to have the cranes point in different directions?

[andythenorth]

Added more construction sprite options. Each tile picks a sprite at random, no further control applied. Not going to do more with these right now, it's enough.

[Coxx]

What is needed to define a proper "economy" for FIRS?

[Eddi]

basically, a set of industries and their cargos. preferably with graphics. and with a system behind it...

Ideas include:

• car production: several industries producing car parts (rubber, glass, metal, etc.), cutting back the whole agriculture stuff to the bare minimum
• agriculture: the entire opposite, very detailed agricultural products and a minimal chemical industry (fertilizer) and machine industry (tractors)

[oberhümer]

This makes me think an export/import "industry" like the Railroad Tycoon port could be useful - put it near the edge of the map and/or water and define produced and accepted cargos per economy. It would simulate specialized economies much better, if they're desired.

[andythenorth]

This makes me think an export/import "industry" like the Railroad Tycoon port could be useful.

This is pretty much a definite. Just need to figure out the details.

[Gremnon]

Could you take a leaf from Railroad Tycoon 2 dock industry, where in its scenario editor, where you could define up to four cargos it could provide and how often?
Maybe using parameters to control which cargo(s) and how much per month they produce.

[SquireJames]

Ah I see what you mean now My initial idea would be better for a GS.

I therefore propose a Maritime Economy setting. In addition to the FIRS staples of Oil, Fish;

Salt : From salt extraction plants to towns
Tourists: Both produced and accepted by towns and beaches (so your transport links take tourists to the beach, and then take returning holidaymakers back again)

A modification of engineering products so that metal can be delivered to a new shipyard industry that manufactures maritime equipment, which can be taken to oil rigs to increase their production

Something else that might be interesting to play, although I know it's controversial on this forum, is a "Wartime" Economy, whereby metal and timber production goes into producing small arms, metal and chemicals into munitions, petrol and metal into military vehicles etc and a system whereby towns can produce recruits that are taken to a camp which in turn produces troops, which are taken to an international harbour. (which as people have suggested, could function in many different economies, importing and exporting different goods, like the ones from Railroad Tycoon and Industry Giant)

[Jon Harald Søby]

Here is a translation into Norwegian (Bokmål) for ya'll…

While translating, I noticed two peculiarities in the English original:

STR_EXTRA_ALUMINUM_PLANT: This message uses the word "per" twice twice. ("6,000l per per 8t grain delivered{} 6,000l per per 8t sugar delivered")
STR_EXTRA_TEXTILE_MILL: This message uses "tons" as the units for plant fibres; however, in other messages, the unit "bale" is used.

[Digitalfox]

I have a question,

Would it be possible to divide the industries chains, like a option in settings for what chains are in game?

Or in other words, have less types of industries when chosen to.

I understand that there those who love many many types of Industries in their games, but I find the number of them way to confusing for me.


I also understand that this request is probably a very low priority, but I hope someday it's possible.


Thank you.