Selectable Load/Unload and auto-refit suggestions

[DanMacK]

Did a quick search for these and couldn't find anything. One of these suggestions goes hand-in-and with the other. Basically, waht I'm wondering is if it's possible to add an option to unload specific cargoes at a station and refit cars depending on cargo.

Scenario 1

A----------------B

Train hauling steel from A to B. Mill in town A, Factory in town B, town A accepts goods. Right now, you need 2 trains with 2 sets of locomotives and rolling stock to haul these 2 cargoes. Depending on the type of rolling stock (coil cars for instance wouldn't be able to do this), only one train could be used. Train 1 hauls steel slabs on flatcars from A-B, and the flatcars are automatically refitted to goods, reloaded with goods and sent back to A, repeating the cycle.

This would streamline networks, remove some unneccisary deadheading and make things more efficient (not to mention realistic)

Some things wouldn't be able to be done, for instance refit a food tanker to oil. these options would need to be set in the particular train grf.

Scenario 2

Train carrying oil, steel, lumber and goods. Drop off only thr steel and lumber at a specific intermediate station, where it's picked up by a local on a branch, which hauls the steel and lumber to a factory and returns to the interchange point with goods.

Is this possible?

[wallyweb]

An automatic refit after unloading at a station that has a different product waiting for pick up, provided the unloading train has appropriate wagons refitable to that product?

I like that idea.

[Zephyris]

I have thought of suggesting something very similar:

A (coal mine, iron ore mine) <---------------------> B (steel mill, power station)
A train with open hopper wagons is travelling A <--> B, with this patch active the game compares produced cargoes (coal and iron ore) and accepted cargoes (coal and iron ore) on the train's route, the wagons are then automatically refitted to carry whichever cargo there is more of currently waiting.


C (coal mine, iron ore mine) <---------------------> D (steel mill, factory)
A train with open hopper wagons is travelling C <--> D, the game compares produced cargoes (coal and iron ore) and accepted cargoes (iron ore), only iron ore is accepted on the train's route, so the wagons are automatically refitted to iron ore and then don't change.

[DaleStan]

Now that there are Patch-special orders, this might not be as impossible as previously thought. But when I last looked, I wasn't able to make sense of the changes. I'll try to remember to look in January, if this hasn't already been implemented.

[The Irish]

hmm, I don't like the idea of the game automatically figuring out which cargos to transport. I rather do it manually.
Still, I like the ideas of having a train refit at a certain station or the unload of a certain cargo at 1 specific station, but I would prefer to manually set such orders. Or at least, if it goes automatically, have an option to tell a specific train not to load anything at a certain station, just to make sure that my goods won't go to some strange place where I don't want them to go.

[Zephyris]

If the "refit as an order" patch can be implemented then presumably it would be simple to add a switch, on top of refit orders, to allow automatic refitting if desired.

[DaleStan]

hmm, I don't like the idea of the game automatically figuring out which cargos to transport. I rather do it manually.

I don't like having the game do it automatically either.

If the "refit as an order" patch can be implemented

I looked again; and my brain broke trying to safely store the cargo type in a single byte. I know it can be done, but I don't know how.

then presumably it would be simple to add a switch, on top of refit orders, to allow automatic refitting if desired.

I doubt it. The game would have to consider the cargo available at the current station, the cargos accepted at each other station in the order list, plus the current ratios of cargos at the current station and any stations it would have to carry cargo through to deliver some other type to its final destination. Then it would have to predict how those numbers would change and the time required to make the deliveries. Once it did all that, it would have to figure out which cargo arrangement would create the most profit, keeping in mind that not all wagons can be refitted to all cargos.

[Zephyris]

Very good point, I hadn't considered the difficulties of multiple types of wagon.

[DanMacK]

I should have been a bit clearer, I wasn't thinking about automatically refitting, I was thinking more on a "by order" basis. That way any cars that could be refitted to the "other" cargo would be, but it would only be if I want it to.

Hope this made sense

[Villem]

Thats close to how "refit-to" order works in openttd, you give a train a order in the orders list to go to a specific depot, then you select the order, and "refit" becomes available where you can choose what cargo to refit when the vehicle goes to the depot to refit.

[DaleStan]

I got that refit order working, finally.

But not quite how it works in Open: You order the train to a depot, and then, if you want a refit, you add a separate refit order. If you want multiple refits at a single depot, you add multiple refit orders after the go-to-depot order.

[The Irish]

Sounds great. Is it ready for testing yet?

[wallyweb]

I got that refit order working, finally. ...

I assume this is available as of r1808. Are there any new switches to set?

[DaleStan]

Yes, ready for testing, No, 1809. And no new switches.
It shows up if you've got advorders on. (And have a refittable vehicle, of course.)

[wallyweb]

Yes, ready for testing, No, 1809

Tomorrow morning then as the current nightly is at 1808.

EDIT I downloaded and installed r1811. I verified advorders on. I bought an engine and a highly refitable boxcar. I gave the train some orders including a goto depot order. I did not see a "refit" button nor anything similar with which to add a refit order. I Ctrl clicked on everything in the train's order window. No luck. Am I missing something or is the feature not ready for prime time yet?

[DaleStan]

Could you add any of the other advanced orders? If advorders is on, control-clicking on the goto button will cause a dropdown to appear. If the consist cannot be refit, the "Refit consist" order will be greyed out, but it shouldn't not be there.

There are known bugs with ships and aircraft. Some have been fixed in 1812, others I am still working on. (Also, the artic-RV refit bug applies here exactly as it does in the refit window.)

[wallyweb]

control-clicking on the goto button will cause a dropdown to appear.

control-clicking - rtfm = Ctrl - two of them - try the right one - MENU - try the left one - MENU
Make note to self to not try this kind of stuff without a full load of caffeine.
Stay tuned for screamies or screenies.

[DaleStan]

Stay tuned for screamies or screenies.

I'm seeing neither. Is this a good thing or a bad thing?

Anyway, the remaining known issues (except the RV-refit bug) were fixed or concealed[0] in 1813.

[0] Nearest-depot orders for non-rail vehicles are broken. If anyone[1] can come up with an arrangement where they're useful, I'll fix and re-enable them.
[1] Yes, including Rob.

[wallyweb]

Stay tuned for screamies or screenies.

I'm seeing neither. Is this a good thing or a bad thing?

It's a mixed thing. I am seeing an issue but it might not be your feature's problem other than it highlighted a problem that exists elsewhere. I need to try PikkaBird's and George's cargo schemes before I hang myself out to dry.

[JGR]

gotodepot.asm:743

Code: Select all

call [FindNearestTrainDepot]

Sorry, I should have realised that that wouldn't work for all vehicle types...

I can't think of a reason why you'd ever use it with non-rail vehicles, so that's probably why it never got tested...