Transport Tycoon Forums

[+] Spoiler

RAIL 50km Tramway
ELRL 50km Electric Tramway
MTR0 100km Metro, Rural
MTR1 80km Metro, Urban
MTR2 80km Metro, Urban & Concrete
MTR3 150km Metro, Highspeed
MTR4 150km Metro, With Grass Roof
MTR5 150km Metro, With Concrete Roof
MTR6 150km Metro, With Fake Airport Concrete Roof
INVI 300km Invisible Tramlanes

[+] Spoiler

RAIL (Tramway)(50km/h)(No Catenary)
Pow: RAIL, ELRL, MTR4, MTR5, MTR6
Alt:

ELRL (Electric Tramway)(50km/h)(Visible Catenary)
Pow: ELRL, MTR4, MTR5, MTR6
Alt:

MTR0 (Metro, Rural)(100km/h)(Invisible Catenary)
Pow: MTR0, MTR1, MTR2, MTR4, MTR5, MTR6
Alt: MAB3

MTR1 (Metro, Urban)(80km/h)(Invisible Catenary)
Pow: MTR0, MTR1, MTR2, MTR4, MTR5, MTR6
Alt: MAB3

MTR2 (Metro, Urban & Concrete)(80km/h)(Invisible Catenary)
Pow: MTR0, MTR1, MTR2, MTR4, MTR5, MTR6
Alt: MAB3

MTR3 (Metro, Highspeed)(150km/h)(Invisible Catenary)
Pow: MTR0, MTR1, MTR2, MTR3, MTR4, MTR5, MTR6
Alt: MAC3

MTR4 (Metro, With Grass Roof)(150km/h)(Visible Catenary)
Pow: MTR0, MTR1, MTR2, MTR4, MTR5, MTR6
Alt: MAB3, MAC3

MTR5 (Metro, With Concrete Roof)(150km/h)(Visible Catenary)
Pow: MTR0, MTR1, MTR2, MTR4, MTR5, MTR6
Alt: MAB3, MAC3

MTR6 (Metro, With Fake Airport Concrete Roof)(150km/h)(Visible Catenary)
Pow: MTR0, MTR1, MTR2, MTR4, MTR5, MTR6
Alt: MAB3, MAC3

INVI (Invisible Tramlanes)(300km/h)(No Catenary)
Pow: INVI
Alt: EAAN

Brickblock1 wrote: 16 May 2023 09:04 Hi

you'll have to add MAA3 to the alternative_tramtype_list for MTR 0, 1 and 2.

Your invisible track is also missing EABN, and EACN in its list.

I also think the standard will have to be amended to add both catenary and ground power for your three last types. I think Z would be the best fit as it is already used by the railtype standard.

Your implementation also seams a bit weird since MAB3 isn't compatible with MAC3 which is should

Quast65 wrote: 16 May 2023 10:26 This I would like to debate a bit...
I would like my highspeed metro-track to be reserved ONLY for highspeed vehicles, to prevent the clogging up of traffic.
Is there a way to do this, following the standard?

Brickblock1 wrote: 16 May 2023 13:52 .

Quast65 wrote: 16 May 2023 15:18

Brickblock1 wrote: 16 May 2023 13:52 .

How do you envisage the look of a track that is suitable for MAA3 vehicles?
Is it in your mind something like the MTR0-track (track on ballast)?
Or more like I see it, more as just a track on bare ground, with a very low max speed?

Brickblock1 wrote: 16 May 2023 16:02 .

Kruemelchen wrote: 16 May 2023 18:01 So I would recon, for vehicles this could look like this:

Code: Select all

RAAE = very light rail = early trams, max 30kph etc.
RABE = 600/750V system = majority of standard trams
RACE = interurban 600/750V system = modern high speed trams
RADE = 1500V system = very high speed light rail

However, RADE would be out of standard

----

In the case of metro trains though, I don't know, if this differentiation even exists

Kruemelchen wrote: 16 May 2023 18:01 One solution could be to have two high speed tracks, of which one would a general high speed track and also allows MAB3,
and the other being a specialised track only allowing MAC3.

In theory, we have the speed letter [*X**] for the speed of tracks, however, that is not usable to distinguish vehicles.

Brickblock1 wrote: 16 May 2023 19:09 btw Quast65 any change of adding a parameter to completly isolate the metro tracks from the regular tram tracks? Currently loading your set with another standardized set will couse issues as only some trams would show up on your metro and regular tracks. By adding this as a parameter you would avoid these issues.

Brickblock1 wrote: 16 May 2023 19:09 This would be an option, it doesn't add much which isn't already possible with just A, B and C tho. Since trains which shouldn't be able to run on MAC3 can just use MAA3. Doing it the way it is right now also gives more power to the vehicle author. Using the speed letter for this seams complicated as the terrain one basically already does the same.

Quast65 wrote: 16 May 2023 19:58 I dont understand?
The whole idea of the roofed metrotracks is that they can also be used by all tramvehicles (for if you want to make underground tramsystem, with highspeed).
That's why MTR4, MTR5 and MTR6 are powered in RAIL and ELRL.
No regular tramvehicles can ever show up on other metrotracks.

Kruemelchen wrote: 16 May 2023 22:05 Well, in theory the "stability" letter should differentiate, how heavy the tram is, meaning, how much support it needs. So a C-tram would be a heavy tram, whereas an A-tram would be a very light one, which can run on unsupported rails.
This corresponds roughly with speed, as heavier trams tend to be bigger and faster.

Kruemelchen wrote: 16 May 2023 22:05 Since (at least in JGRPP) we now have waypoints, it's not a big problem of "sorting" trams according to their speed within a tram network.
Which is why, we came to the conclusion to ignore speed for vehicles.

I still think, though, it should be possible for track authors to define a road or track for special cases, that only allows A-vehicles or C-vehicles. This shouldn't be the rule, but it should be something, that is somewhat thought of (and it is nothing that would need more letters than A, B, C).

Brickblock1 wrote: 17 May 2023 05:56 I understand that but have you considered it might cause issues if your set is loaded with one that provides RAAN, those vehicles would then not be able to run on your metro tracks which would cause confusion. That's why I wanted the option to dissable it so that none of the regular trams work instead of only some.

RAAN, RABN, RACN
RAAE, RABE, RACE
RAAG, RABG, RACG
RAAZ, RABZ, RACZ

PAAN, PABN, PACN
PAAE, PABE, PACE
PAAG, PABG, PACG
PAAZ, PABZ, PACZ

Kruemelchen wrote: 16 May 2023 22:05 .

 A | Unsupported | AB
 B | Regular support| ABC
 C | Highspeed rail | BC

 A | unsupported | A
 B | Regular support | ABC
 C | Highspeed rail | C

Quast65 wrote: 17 May 2023 11:48 Ahhh, I see.
As the roofed Metro-tracks are meant to be suitable for all "regular" tramvehicles, then cant I just simply add lables like:

Code: Select all

RAAN, RABN, RACN
RAAE, RABE, RACE
RAAG, RABG, RACG
RAAZ, RABZ, RACZ

to the alternative_tramtype_list of those 3 roofed metrotracks?

And also:

Code: Select all

PAAN, PABN, PACN
PAAE, PABE, PACE
PAAG, PABG, PACG
PAAZ, PABZ, PACZ

And should I also include the I-versions (Industrial Site)?

Quast65 wrote: 17 May 2023 11:48 With regards to the discussion about the terrain/stability.
Could all of this not be easily fixed by changing the powered roadtypes from:

Code: Select all

 A | Unsupported | AB
 B | Regular support| ABC
 C | Highspeed rail | BC

to

Code: Select all

 A | unsupported | A
 B | Regular support | ABC
 C | Highspeed rail | C

As I also cant imagine "normal" trams (like those for public transport) running on unsupported tracks as they would be too heavy.
And they should not be allowed on highspeed, for them being too slow.
Regular support should still allow all 3.

What was the reasoning to have AB and BC?
I am trying to understand why that option is needed.

 A | Slow | AB
 B | Medium| ABC
 C | Fast | BC

 S | Very slow | 
 A | Slow | SAB
 B | Medium| ABC
 C | Fast | BCF
 F | Very fast |

Brickblock1 wrote: 17 May 2023 12:52 MAA3 issue

item(FEAT_TRAMTYPES, item_MAA3, 00) {
	property {
		label:                       "MAA3";
		alternative_tramtype_list:       ["MAB3"];
}
}

item(FEAT_TRAMTYPES, item_MAA3, 00) {
	property {
		label:                       "MAA3";
		alternative_tramtype_list:       ["MAB3"];
}
}

item(FEAT_TRAMTYPES, item_MAA3, 00) {
	property {
		label:                       "MAA3";
		powered_tramtype_list:       ["MTR0", "MTR1", "MTR2", "MTR4", "MTR5", "MTR6"];
		alternative_tramtype_list:       ["MAB3"];
}
}

Quast65 wrote: 17 May 2023 15:00 Ok, if I understand it correctly, the way for my set to behave like I want it to, but still be within the standard-scheme is to:
- Put MAA3 in the alternative_roadtype_list instead of MAB3, for all tracks (except highspeed roofless one offcourse)
- Keep MAC3 in the alternative_roadtype_list of the highspeed roofless one
- Somehow remap/"downgrade" MAB3 to MAA3
correct?

Brickblock1 wrote: 17 May 2023 16:10 For dutch metros this would mean changeing MAB3 to MAA3.

Quast65 wrote: 17 May 2023 16:15 But that would mean that (some) of my tramvehicles aren't compliant to the standard-scheme anymore...

Quast65 wrote: 17 May 2023 16:15 Have you read my edit to my previous post?