HERDING LIVESTOCK TO MARKET

[Quast65]

It seams that you were looking at an older version.

I see, thnx, I recommend that you put the link to the most recent version also in the first post of the thread

[Kruemelchen]

.

into "alternative_roadtype_list" of a road should come the standard label, that this road then works as a replacement for. It means, vehicles of a standard label will change into the label of the first road, that has the standard label in its "alternative_roadtype_list"

So, if you want to remap all IAAN vehicles to, say, SCPR, then it needs this property:

Code: Select all

alternative_roadtype_list: [IAAN]

Otherwise, the vehicles will map to the first road supporting the standard label (if neither SCPR nor SCPH are available, if we let these take precedence), which most likely would break compatibility with SCPR or SCPH, unless the other roadtype set supports these two roads

This could partially be solved by using standardised labels for the roads as well. It would be RAAN for public or IAAN for non-public bumpy roads. (The second letter can be anything, i.e. S for stock route)
However, then it might get overwritten by other roadsets with a road using the same label

[RoyalExamination9410]

Could we also do caravans as well? Its camel trains could be used to ferry people and goods all around. People also rode them individually.

[Quast65]

.

So, what is the difference then between using the "alternative_roadtype_list"-method and the "roadtypetable"-method?

[Kruemelchen]

So, what is the difference then between using the "alternative_roadtype_list"-method and the "roadtypetable"-method?

I am sorry, I was a bit short in my explanation

1. the roads in a standardised roadtype set have to put the appropriate standard labels (used by vehicles, i.e. RABN) in the "alternative_roadtype_list". This way, all standardised vehicles will be supported in a game, when a suitable road is available.

This means, road set authors would use their own labels based on the standard scheme, but do not need to create roads for every possible vehicle type.
Let's say, you create a road "RABN", then all vehicles of RABN type will automatically run on this road, plus all roads in the "powered_roadtype_list". But RAAN type vehicles would not be available in the game, unless you create a road with the label "RAAN". However, if you do not provide this road but still want these vehicles to be available, you would want to add "RAAN" to the "alternative_roadtype_list" of the RABN road. In concequence, both RABN and RAAN vehicles would drive on the RABN road.
(Technically speaking, all RAAN vehicles would turn into RABN vehicles)

2. the roadtypetable is only needed in GRFs with vehicles in them. Road sets do not need it.

Defining alternatives for vehicle types in the roadtypetable gives vehicle set authors the power to change the type of their vehicles according to the availability of roads. Let's say, your vehicles are of RAAN type, but there is no RAAN road available. Then the vehicle set author can choose to set RABN as alternative in the roadtypetable. In effect, RAAN vehicles would turn into RABN vehicles and run on the RABN road.

The point is, if there is no road set which used standardised labels in the game, the RAAN/RABN/... vehicles can turn into ROAD vehicles, if defined as alternative in the roadtypetable of the vehicle GRF. This way, GRF authors can support both the standardised scheme and the old approach (of only having ROAD vehicles)


... I hope, this made it clear
alternative_roadtype_list is for roads to be compatible with vehicles, and the roadtypetable is for vehicles to be compatible with roads.

[GarryG]

I'm confused .. in the AuzFarmRoads .. what will I need?

Seems like I replace

Code: Select all

"roadtypetable"

with

Code: Select all

"alternative_roadtype_list: [IAAN]"

and also add

Code: Select all

stock: [SCPH, SCPR, IAAN, ROAD]

And in the Vehicle codes change it to

Code: Select all

road_type: stock

Cheers

[Quast65]

I'm confused .. in the AuzFarmRoads .. what will I need?

Give it a bit more time Garry
Getting close

alternative_roadtype_list is for roads to be compatible with vehicles, and the roadtypetable is for vehicles to be compatible with roads.

I understand!
Final question:
- If one uses the roadtypetable-method, does the vehicle only become compatible with the first road in the roadtypelabellist that is available in the Roadset-GRF, or to all roads in the list that are available in the Roadset-GRF?
(assuming that none of the roads are compatible/powered with each other).

[Brickblock1]

I understand!
Final question:
- If one uses the roadtypetable-method, does the vehicle only become compatible with the first road in the roadtypelabellist that is available in the Roadset-GRF, or to all roads in the list that are available in the Roadset-GRF?
(assuming that none of the roads are compatible/powered with each other).

It will become available to the first one in the list.

[Quast65]

.

.

I did a bit of testing, to really get this clear for myself.

This is what I think happens when you use the Alternative_Roadtype-Method:
- The method relies on that the vehicle-GRF uses the standardised label scheme. The road-GRF doesnt have to have labels from the standardised label scheme for its roads.
- The roadtype of the vehicle (i.e. that is a label from the standardised label scheme) CHANGES to the label of the FIRST road in the code of the road-GRF that has that original standardised label in its alternative_roadtype_list.
- The vehicle will now also be able to drive on roads that are in the powered_roadtype_list of that road (and be bought in their depots).
- If a road is disabled via parameter, then the vehicle will get the label of the NEXT road that has its original standardised label in its alternative_roadtype_list.
- If no more roads are available, then the vehicle cannot be purchased anymore.
- If you disable a road, via parameter, in a running game. And at that time you had a vehicle for example running on another powered-roadtype, then the game will crash.
As there are no more suitable roads available for that vehicle.
- This method is handy to "update" existing road-GRFs to the standardised label scheme, as you only have to add an alternative_roadtype_list to the appropriate roads.

The same as above is with the roadtypetable-method, with the difference that the possible changes of the label are set from within the vehicle-GRF and that it relies on the road-GRF to use the standardised label scheme for the labels of its roads, the vehicles dont have to have labels from the standardised label scheme.
This method is handy to "update" existing vehicle-GRFs to the standardised label scheme, as you only have to make some changes to the roadtypetable.

Is this correct?


Could the "mixing" of both methods cause a possible conflict?
Lets say:
I have a vehicle with non-standard-label XXXX and it has standard-label IAAN in its roadtyptable which it will adapt to if that road is available.
I have two different road-grfs, one that has a roadtype with IAAN set as its actual label and one that has a roadtype with IAAN in its alternative_roadtype_list and that has YYYY as its own label.
What happens?
Will the vehicle change to label IAAN first and that causes it to end up as YYYY? Will it stay IAAN? Or could this cause a crash, as it possibly keeps looping from IAAN to YYYY?

[Kruemelchen]

Sounds correct to me.

Could the "mixing" of both methods cause a possible conflict?
Lets say:
I have a vehicle with non-standard-label XXXX and it has standard-label IAAN in its roadtyptable which it will adapt to if that road is available.
I have two different road-grfs, one that has a roadtype with IAAN set as its actual label and one that has a roadtype with IAAN in its alternative_roadtype_list and that has YYYY as its own label.
What happens?
Will the vehicle change to label IAAN first and that causes it to end up as YYYY? Will it stay IAAN? Or could this cause a crash, as it possibly keeps looping from IAAN to YYYY?

The vehicle will take the first label, that is available. If the first label in the roadtypetable is IAAN and that road type exists, then it will stay IAAN.
Alternative_roadtype_list only steps in, if there is no road of that label.

[Quast65]

Thnx for clearing that all up and for your and Brickblock1's work on making the standard!

[GarryG]

Thanks all for helping me with these projects.
Hope either later this afternoon or tomorrow give these a try.
Hope others are also benefiting from this as well.

Cheers all

[Quast65]

Thanks all for helping me with these projects.
Hope either later this afternoon or tomorrow give these a try.
Hope others are also benefiting from this as well.

Cheers all

Please wait with doing this on your own.
I have to work tonight, but will try to guide you through the process when I get back.
Can you post your most recent sourcecode for the AuzFarmRoads?
Then I can check what needs to be deleted and what needs to be added/changed.

[GarryG]

Please wait with doing this on your own.
I have to work tonight, but will try to guide you through the process when I get back.

No hurry as most likely be Friday before I can do anymore as today shopping day and Thursday I hope go train riding. Friday thru till next Tuesday I be staying home so have time to work on projects.

Can you post your most recent sourcecode for the AuzFarmRoads?
Then I can check what needs to be deleted and what needs to be added/changed.

I haven't done anything to it since the 8th except add version number.
Thanks you heaps.

[Quast65]

Right, back from work, lets do this!

I haven't done anything to it since the 8th except add version number.

Not exactly true, there is something you have added to the roadtypetable

Code: Select all

Horse: [SCPH, SCPR],
tractor01: [SCPH, SCPR],
Horse2: [SCPH, SCPR],

but no worries, we'll fix that along the way




We are going to use the Alternative_Roadtype-Method, as you then also can use that to easily make certain vehicles compatible with the rural/grassy/dirt roads in your other roadsets.

What we are going to do is giving your vehicles a standardised label, then we will add an alternative_roadtype_list to your roads, and finally we clean some code up.

1.
We are going to give your vehicles standardised label IAAN, according to the Standardized Road/Tramtype Scheme:
https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/U ... rsion_6.29
It stands for:
I = Industrial Site Surface (yes, farmstuff also counts as industrial)
A = Vehicle
A = Rough (Dirt) Terrain
N = No Energy Source

We do that by changing:

Code: Select all

road_type: SCPR;

to

Code: Select all

road_type: IAAN;

for the three vehicles.

2.
Now we are going to link them to your roads by using the alternative_roadtype_list in your roads.
It's already there, but disabled, change:

Code: Select all

//		alternative_roadtype_list:   ?;

to

Code: Select all

alternative_roadtype_list:   ["IAAN"];

for both roads.

3.
Let's clean your code up a bit.
As stated in some posts earlier, the roadtypetable only applies to vehicles and not to roads.
So, change:

Code: Select all

//roadtype translation table 
roadtypetable { ROAD,/* TTD */
	IAAN, SCPH, SCPR, /* Farm Roads */
	HRSE, HRSC, /* this set */
	OFFR, SAND, /* country roads */
	HAUL, /* hauling road */
	DIRT, GRAV, ASPT, /* spool */
	OLD_, SETT,  ASP0, ASP1, ASP2, /* ratt */
	AUZB, AUZC, AUZD, AUZE, AUZ5, AUZF, AUZ1, AUZG, AUZ4, /* AuzRattRoads */
	ORD0, ORD1, ORD2, ORD3, ORD4, SRD0, SRD1, SRD2, ARD0, ARD1, ARD2, ARD3, ARD4, ARD5, WRD0, WRD1, URD0, URD1, IRD0, IRD1, /* U&RaTT */
	CONC, TOWN, B_RD, A_RD, /* Timberwolfs Roads */
	BIKE, BRIC, NL30, NL50, NL5F, NL60, NL80, NL10, NL12, /* Dutch Road Project */
	CSRD, PTRD, ATRD, PCRD, ACRD, /* Auge's Basic Roadset */
 	ACLK, AR11, AR12, AR13, AR14, AR21, AR22, AR23, AR24, ELSP, ALSP,
        ELRD, ELA1, ELA2, ELA0, ALA0, FUEL, COBB,
        COB2, COB3, COB4, BEAC, ISR1, ISR2, AUZ2, AUZ3,
        AUZ6, AUZ7, AUZ8, AUZ9, AUZ0, AUZA, AUZY, AUZZ, YARD, COAL,
        AER0, AER1, AER2, UER1,
Horse: [SCPH, SCPR],
tractor01: [SCPH, SCPR],
Horse2: [SCPH, SCPR],

}

to just

Code: Select all

//roadtype translation table 
roadtypetable { IAAN

}

This should do the trick...
If I am correct, in a game with only this GRF and nothing else, you should only be able to buy the 3 vehicles in depots of those two roads, and not in the depot of the basic-road.
You can still buy the regular vehicles also in the two roads.
Regular vehicles still drive on all roads, the 3 vehicles will only drive on the two farm-roads.

Let me know if this works, if so, then we can look on how we can make some other dirt/grassy/farm-suitable roads (in your other GRFs) also compatible with your vehicles.

If the vehicles still drive on the basic road (and possibly also still can be bought there), then there is a possible issue with the powered_roadtype_list.
So no worries, that should easily be fixable, but lets see if this is good enough already
I'm off to bed

[GarryG]

Hope you slept well?

I bit late getting home as missed the first bus by about 10 minutes and had to wait 2 hours for next one. Normally when get medication from Pharmacy take about 10 to 15 minutes but they was busy and took just over 30 minutes .. bumma.

Anyway .. I tried those codes. It worked .. tractor and the horses could not be purchased in other depots only those connected to the 2 farm roads.

BUT roads that the farm roads can cross the tractor and horses will travel on those roads.

The highway the farm roads will not cross even if do it manually and the tractor will not cross or drive on the highway.

If they had a destination then they should not want to go along other roads unless it shorter.

Good they not cross highways. To them to cross highways that where bridges come in handy.

Here the updated game file and source.

Cheers pal

[Quast65]

Morning!

No, its not working as intended (yet).
I can still buy the 3 vehicles in the depot of the regular road and they also still drive onto it.

1. TEST IT OUT FIRST WITH ONLY THIS SINGLE GRF IN A GAME! NOTHING ELSE, NO OTHER ROADGRFS OR WHATEVER.

2. You have made more changes that necessary:
Turn this:

Code: Select all

item(FEAT_ROADTYPES, item_country_asphalt_road2, 02) {
	property {
		label:                       "ROAD";
		powered_roadtype_list:       ["IAAN", "A_RD", "ACLK",	"ACRD",	"AER0",	"AER1",	"AER2",	"ALA0",	"ALSP",	"AR11",	"AR12",	"AR13",	"AR14",	"AR21",	"AR22",	"AR23",	"AR24",	"ARD0",	"ARD1",	"ARD2",	"ARD3",	"ARD4",	"ARD5",	"ASP0",	"ASP1",	"ASP2",	"ASPT",	"ATRD",	"AUZ0",	"AUZ1",	"AUZ2",	"AUZ3",	"AUZ4",	"AUZ5",	"AUZ6",	"AUZ7",	"AUZ8",	"AUZ9",	"AUZA",	"AUZB",	"AUZC",	"AUZD",	"AUZE",	"AUZF",	"AUZG",	"AUZY",	"AUZZ",	"B_RD",	"BEAC",	"BIKE",	"BRIC",	"COAL",	"COB2",	"COB3",	"COB4",	"COBB",	"CONC",	"CSRD",	"DIRT",	"ELA0",	"ELA1",	"ELA2",	"ELRD",	"ELSP",	"FUEL",	"GRAV",	"HAUL",	"HRSC",	"HRSE",	"IRD0",	"IRD1",	"ISR1",	"ISR2",	"NL10",	"NL12",	"NL30",	"NL50",	"NL5F",	"NL60",	"NL80",	"OFFR",	"OLD_",	"ORD0",	"ORD1",	"ORD2",	"ORD3",	"ORD4",	"PCRD",	"PTRD",	"ROAD",	"SAND",	"SCPH",	"SCPR",	"SETT",	"SRD0",	"SRD1",	"SRD2",	"TOWN",	"UER1",	"URD0",	"URD1",	"WRD0",	"WRD1",	"YARD"];
//		alternative_roadtype_list:   ["IAAN"];
}
}

Back into:

Code: Select all

item(FEAT_ROADTYPES, item_country_asphalt_road2, 02) {
	property {
		label:                       "ROAD";
		powered_roadtype_list:       ["ROAD", "SCPH", "SCPR"];
}
}

The only thing that this hidden roadtype ROAD is needed for in this GRF, is to make the two farmroutes compatible with regular basic road.
Nothing more.


*In road SCPH
replace:

Code: Select all

//		powered_roadtype_list:       ["IAAN", "SCPH", "SCPR"];
		powered_roadtype_list:       ["IAAN", "A_RD", "ACLK",	"ACRD",	"AER0",	"AER1",	"AER2",	"ALA0",	"ALSP",	"AR11",	"AR12",	"AR13",	"AR14",	"AR21",	"AR22",	"AR23",	"AR24",	"ARD0",	"ARD1",	"ARD2",	"ARD3",	"ARD4",	"ARD5",	"ASP0",	"ASP1",	"ASP2",	"ASPT",	"ATRD",	"AUZ0",	"AUZ1",	"AUZ2",	"AUZ3",	"AUZ4",	"AUZ5",	"AUZ6",	"AUZ7",	"AUZ8",	"AUZ9",	"AUZA",	"AUZB",	"AUZC",	"AUZD",	"AUZE",	"AUZF",	"AUZG",	"AUZY",	"AUZZ",	"B_RD",	"BEAC",	"BIKE",	"BRIC",	"COAL",	"COB2",	"COB3",	"COB4",	"COBB",	"CONC",	"CSRD",	"DIRT",	"ELA0",	"ELA1",	"ELA2",	"ELRD",	"ELSP",	"FUEL",	"GRAV",	"HAUL",	"HRSC",	"HRSE",	"IRD0",	"IRD1",	"ISR1",	"ISR2",	"NL10",	"NL12",	"NL30",	"NL50",	"NL5F",	"NL60",	"NL80",	"OFFR",	"OLD_",	"ORD0",	"ORD1",	"ORD2",	"ORD3",	"ORD4",	"PCRD",	"PTRD",	"ROAD",	"SAND",	"SCPH",	"SCPR",	"SETT",	"SRD0",	"SRD1",	"SRD2",	"TOWN",	"UER1",	"URD0",	"URD1",	"WRD0",	"WRD1",	"YARD"];

with:

Code: Select all

		powered_roadtype_list:       ["A_RD", "ACLK",	"ACRD",	"AER0",	"AER1",	"AER2",	"ALA0",	"ALSP",	"AR11",	"AR12",	"AR13",	"AR14",	"AR21",	"AR22",	"AR23",	"AR24",	"ARD0",	"ARD1",	"ARD2",	"ARD3",	"ARD4",	"ARD5",	"ASP0",	"ASP1",	"ASP2",	"ASPT",	"ATRD",	"AUZ0",	"AUZ1",	"AUZ2",	"AUZ3",	"AUZ4",	"AUZ5",	"AUZ6",	"AUZ7",	"AUZ8",	"AUZ9",	"AUZA",	"AUZB",	"AUZC",	"AUZD",	"AUZE",	"AUZF",	"AUZG",	"AUZY",	"AUZZ",	"B_RD",	"BEAC",	"BIKE",	"BRIC",	"COAL",	"COB2",	"COB3",	"COB4",	"COBB",	"CONC",	"CSRD",	"DIRT",	"ELA0",	"ELA1",	"ELA2",	"ELRD",	"ELSP",	"FUEL",	"GRAV",	"HAUL",	"HRSC",	"HRSE",	"IRD0",	"IRD1",	"ISR1",	"ISR2",	"NL10",	"NL12",	"NL30",	"NL50",	"NL5F",	"NL60",	"NL80",	"OFFR",	"OLD_",	"ORD0",	"ORD1",	"ORD2",	"ORD3",	"ORD4",	"PCRD",	"PTRD",	"ROAD",	"SAND",	"SCPH",	"SCPR",	"SETT",	"SRD0",	"SRD1",	"SRD2",	"TOWN",	"UER1",	"URD0",	"URD1",	"WRD0",	"WRD1",	"YARD"];

So, remove the completely unnecessary line // powered_roadtype_list: ["IAAN", "SCPH", "SCPR"];
As that is inactive with the // in front of it anyway.
But more importantly remove "IAAN" from the powered_roadtype_list!!!!!
It should ONLY be in the alternative_roadtype_list of that road.



*In road SCPR
remove

Code: Select all

"IAAN"

from its powered_roadtype_list



Please make these changes (and pretty please with sugar on top, only these changes ) and recode, then I can check and see if some more tweaks need to be made.
There is just a bit more tweaking and testing to do and then I will try to summarise what the powered_roadtype_list and alternative_roadtype_list do and should be used for.
But I can already tell you that roadtype-labels for vehicles that use the standardised label scheme (in this case IAAN), should ONLY be placed in the alternative_roadtype_list of a road and nowhere else in the code of a road!

[GarryG]

I have a look at this after diner and see if can send it back to you in a few hours.

Those // I was trying different ideas cause I could buy the tractor in any depot. So then I moved the AuzFarmRoads and placed it before the AuzrattRoads and the AuzAnimalsBikesAndPeople and it worked .. could not buy the tractor in other depots.

I shall return here soon

Cheers

[Quast65]

I was trying different ideas

Yeah, I see, I understand that you are eager to also help, but at the moment please dont do that
I have a plan to do things step by step and so will eventually try to make clear to you (and me also) how everything works, so that you can impliment it in other GRFs (or expand this one)
Then you can experiment as much as you want

[GarryG]

eah, I see, I understand that you are eager to also help, but at the moment please dont do that

ok .. I go make some hedges and ambulance and things until I can come back to this ..

Some things we learning here could get used in AuzAnimalsBikesAndPeople to keep the animals on the right track.
Be nice if the animals can only be purchased in the Barn Depots and start their journey on the farm roads before they start blocking traffic .

Appreciate what your doing .. cheers pal.

Now my turn to go to bed since I have awoken you.