Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

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Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Beul » 01 Jul 2012 05:01

When playing around with custom rail types and graphics for the eyecandy tunnels I got an idea that could be developed into an amazing newgrf: Cablecars


Everything in this screenshot is real, and fully functioning. You can check it out for yourselves with the attached GRF.
What I basically did is define a new rail type and provide fake sprites for the tracks, over, and underlay, and supply only the catenary sprites. The wires in the screenshot are the standard wires from openGFX. The pylons/poles are from the dutch trackset and drawn by Pruno.
The 'car' is some random electric engine from the dutch train set.
cablecar.PNG
cablecar.PNG (352.35 KiB) Viewed 9914 times
cablecar2.PNG
cablecar2.PNG (333.7 KiB) Viewed 9914 times
With specially drawn graphics (higher, maybe even 2-legged pylons, thicker cables, cablecar engines) this could become a real nice, real passenger distributing transport type, specifically well suited for mountainous maps.

Suggestions and contributions will be highly appreciated. Have fun!

Update 01.07.2012:

-NUTS trains that are powered on the Universal or electrified rail type will now also run on cable ways.
-Cablecar construction will only be available if there are vehicles present that can run on them.
-Will produce fatal error if Openttd version is lower than 1.1.0
-Will conditionally apply maintenance cost
Attachments
cablecar.grf
(6.52 KiB) Downloaded 2493 times
Last edited by Beul on 01 Jul 2012 20:41, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Supercheese » 01 Jul 2012 05:16

When building a cablecar depot and checking the trains, there doesn't appear to be any usable Cablecar vehicle on Arcric or Desert climates, and in Temperate only the electric trains show up... :?

I'm using OTTD 1.2.1.
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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Beul » 01 Jul 2012 05:21

Supercheese wrote:When building a cablecar depot and checking the trains, there doesn't appear to be any usable Cablecar vehicle on Arcric or Desert climates, and in Temperate only the electric trains show up... :?

I'm using OTTD 1.2.1.
Yes I only allowed for electric vehicles to go up the cables. I thought steamers and diesels would look a bit silly :mrgreen: . (allthough electric was not designed with this in mind either ofc).

I will add a new version in witch normal trains can also be built later today.
(note that this is a pretty much code-only grf, and does not contain any custom engines yet)

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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Supercheese » 01 Jul 2012 06:06

Beul wrote:Yes I only allowed for electric vehicles to go up the cables. I thought steamers and diesels would look a bit silly :mrgreen: . (allthough electric was not designed with this in mind either ofc).

I will add a new version in witch normal trains can also be built later today.
(note that this is a pretty much code-only grf, and does not contain any custom engines yet)
Ah, I see, that would do it. T'would be nice to have special cable cars, but I suppose that's for a later version of the GRF.
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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Quast65 » 01 Jul 2012 06:57

Absolutely great out of the box thinking!! :bow:
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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Purno » 01 Jul 2012 08:08

This is pretty epic!
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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by FooBar » 01 Jul 2012 08:22

Absolutely brilliant! Why didn't I think of this? I'm usually one to think outside the box (the bounding box, that is).

Of course you need custom vehicles with this on a dedicated railtype that doesn't allow any other vehicles, as suspending a 84 tonne train engine from a cable is a bit silly. But it's a great proof-of-concept and has the potential to become one of the best functional eye-candy that we have!

It would be great to have some iconic vehicles with this, like the Roosevelt Island tramway of New York, but also some regular stock from for instance Doppelmayr.

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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by kamnet » 01 Jul 2012 08:28

FooBar wrote:Absolutely brilliant! Why didn't I think of this?
I actually thought of it months ago, but I figured with SwissFan91 working on TARS, he would get to it when it was time to polish off those graphics. You could also throw in another railtype for funicular railroads, also.

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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by SwissFan91 » 01 Jul 2012 08:33

No no no. I (ME) thought of this months ago 8) :lol:

Now, I've PM'd Beul with some ideas for where to take this. In my reckoning - we need the following graphics:

- Stations
- Overhead wires that look more like pylons
- Trains that look like cable cars (possibly with an illusion that makes them look like they're connected to the wire)
- Some invisible signals and invisible depots.

What do people think?

We also need to tackle to idea of bridges and tunnels - could an invisible bridge be drawn? But then I guess we'd have floating pylons..

Also - I think we need to be clear on the definition of 'cable cars'. I'm thinking more this and this, whereas I guess some of you are thinking more of the San Francisco Cable Car type thing?
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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by kamnet » 01 Jul 2012 08:40

Ummm... is it just me, or is this NewGRF broken? I just downloaded it twice, couldn't get it to load. Decompiled it through grfcodec and both the nfo and spritesheet are empty.

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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by kamnet » 01 Jul 2012 08:51

SwissFan91 wrote:- Some invisible signals and invisible depots.
Not possible without it affecting all train signals and depots. For depots, might not be so bad if you combine it with a NewObject set that covers up the depots with whatever style of building you want (something I've thought about off-and-on for two years now), but no way at all with signals unless you ONLY play with this set. But, if the signals are invisible, how do you know where they are and what they're doing?
SwissFan91 wrote:- could an invisible bridge be drawn?
Not without replacing one of the rail bridges, that goes for default TTD/OpenTTD as well as any of the sets which offer bridge replacements.
SwissFan91 wrote:Also - I think we need to be clear on the definition of 'cable cars'
Probably better to rename it "Aerial Lift".
Last edited by kamnet on 01 Jul 2012 09:46, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Bob_Mackenzie » 01 Jul 2012 08:57

Not possible without it affecting all train signals and depots. For depots, might not be so bad if you combine it with a NewObject set that covers up the depots with whatever style of building you want (something I've thought about off-and-on for two years now), but no way at all with signals unless you ONLY play with this set. But, if the signals are invisible, how do you know where they are and what they're doing?
Isn't it possible to have a depot specific to the rail type? UK fine scale tracks certainly does

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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Transportman » 01 Jul 2012 09:40

Bob_Mackenzie wrote:
Not possible without it affecting all train signals and depots. For depots, might not be so bad if you combine it with a NewObject set that covers up the depots with whatever style of building you want (something I've thought about off-and-on for two years now), but no way at all with signals unless you ONLY play with this set. But, if the signals are invisible, how do you know where they are and what they're doing?
Isn't it possible to have a depot specific to the rail type? UK fine scale tracks certainly does
That is possible. See the specifications.

Differentsignals and bridges fore one specific track are not possible (yet), those are the same for all tracks.

EDIT: Different signals for different tracks are possible since OpenTTD r24367, thanks to michi_cc
Last edited by Transportman on 02 Jul 2012 06:40, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by kamnet » 01 Jul 2012 09:44

Oops, you are correct. :oops: Too late/early in the date for me. Carry on, then! :D

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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Beul » 01 Jul 2012 10:22

SwissFan91 wrote:No no no. I (ME) thought of this months ago 8) :lol:
I was actually surprised not to see in anywhere else. I did have a good look at your thread as I "expected" it there. Great minds think alike I guess. 8)
kamnet wrote:I actually thought of it months ago, but I figured with SwissFan91 working on TARS, he would get to it when it was time to polish off those graphics. You could also throw in another railtype for funicular railroads, also.
see above :mrgreen:
Now, I've PM'd Beul with some ideas for where to take this. In my reckoning - we need the following graphics:

- Stations
- Overhead wires that look more like pylons
- Trains that look like cable cars (possibly with an illusion that makes them look like they're connected to the wire)
- Some invisible signals and invisible depots.
Exacly what I thought. Agree with all points
We also need to tackle to idea of bridges and tunnels - could an invisible bridge be drawn? But then I guess we'd have floating pylons..
Well, also thought about that allready but that does not seem to be possible (yet).
Also - I think we need to be clear on the definition of 'cable cars'. I'm thinking more this and this, whereas I guess some of you are thinking more of the San Francisco Cable Car type thing?
I was thinking along the lines of the first two links indeed. Cable cars that I would really like to include are: http://tablemountain.net/, http://www.swissworld.org/en/switzerlan ... wPage%5D=4, http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... ndeck.html and of course a lot of classicaly shaped cars like the ones from your urls's
kamnet wrote:Ummm... is it just me, or is this NewGRF broken? I just downloaded it twice, couldn't get it to load. Decompiled it through grfcodec and both the nfo and spritesheet are empty.
First of all it is coded in NML, so decompiling will not work. Will send you a zip of my files though. Secondly I haven't added a version check yet, but I think I used some fearures that require 1.2.1 or higher. Could that be the problem? Anybody else having trouble loading it?
kamnet wrote:
SwissFan91 wrote: but no way at all with signals unless you ONLY play with this set. But, if the signals are invisible, how do you know where they are and what they're doing?
Well invisible signals would be great, maybe I can manipulate the sprites in a way that they are made visible when making them invisible. :roll: That is one weird sentence, I hope you understand what I mean though. Could later include that and make a parameter setting out of it.
kamnet wrote:
SwissFan91 wrote:- could an invisible bridge be drawn?
Not without replacing one of the rail bridges, that goes for default TTD/OpenTTD as well as any of the sets which offer bridge replacements.
Unfortunately you are correct here. I think I will put that at the bottom of the priorities list.
kamnet wrote:
SwissFan91 wrote:Also - I think we need to be clear on the definition of 'cable cars'
Probably better to rename it "Aerial Lift".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cable_car: Aerial lift

Main article: Aerial lift
Aerial lifts where the vehicle is suspended in the air from a cable:
An aerial tramway consists of a cabin suspended from a cable, pulled by another cable.
A gondola lift consists of a loop of cable that is strung between two or more stations, usually over intermediate supporting towers, from which cars are suspended.
A ropeway conveyor or material ropeway is a subtype of gondola lift, from which containers for goods rather than passenger cars are suspended.
Chairlifts where open chairs are hauled above the ground by means of a cable.


Maybe I am reaching a bit to far now, but I would be great to make separate types like with normal rail and e-rail. I would sugest:
- Aerial lift: large and double decker cabins
-Areal tramway: medium sized cabns
-gondola: (very) small cabins and chairlifsts, maybe some small goods vehicles as well.

I think this would also look a lot better than suspending that huge 17-tonne cabins and chairlift from the same cables.

EDIT: Thanks for all the kind words

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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Digitals » 01 Jul 2012 11:23

I thought that one day someone would do this kind of GRF, but frankly I'm amazed! It's really good! Is regular in screenshots they have grass? You could put grass with a little snow, so that makes her more realistic ... But it was your decision :)
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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Beul » 01 Jul 2012 11:30

Digitals wrote:I thought that one day someone would do this kind of GRF, but frankly I'm amazed! It's really good! Is regular in screenshots they have grass? You could put grass with a little snow, so that makes her more realistic ... But it was your decision :)
Snow aware tiles are also planned for stations. As I already mentioned though, this grf does not include any 'new' graphics at this point in time except for the pylons by Pruno.

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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by kamnet » 01 Jul 2012 12:13

Beul wrote:
kamnet wrote:Ummm... is it just me, or is this NewGRF broken? I just downloaded it twice, couldn't get it to load. Decompiled it through grfcodec and both the nfo and spritesheet are empty.
First of all it is coded in NML, so decompiling will not work. Will send you a zip of my files though. Secondly I haven't added a version check yet, but I think I used some fearures that require 1.2.1 or higher. Could that be the problem? Anybody else having trouble loading it?
Decompiling works, I just needed to grab the latest version of grfcodec which understands the updated code.

And, yes, if you're using features in for 1.2.1, that could be the problem, I was testing it with the latest ChillCore Patch Pack. A shame, because a sprite like this would absolutely SHINE with the More Height Levels patch. If there's no way you can develop this without using the newer features, then you should throw in some code to that warns users it is not compatible, rather than not having it show up at all and leaving the user wondering if something broke.

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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by SwissFan91 » 01 Jul 2012 12:38

@kamnet - surely it won't be too long (tm) that the patchpack is updated to 1.2.1 compatibility?
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Re: Cablecar GRF, fully functioning!

Post by Beul » 01 Jul 2012 14:25

Update:

-NUTS trains that are powered on the Universal or electrified rail type will now also run on cable ways.
-Cablecar construction will only be available if there are vehicles present that can run on them.
-Will produce fatal error if Openttd version is lower than 1.2.0

Download in first post
Last edited by Beul on 01 Jul 2012 15:02, edited 1 time in total.

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