Stop using CGTextures

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Jupix
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Stop using CGTextures

Post by Jupix »

From their license statement:
It is NOT permitted to:
[ ... ]
Release the Textures or derivative products under Open Source Licences
In short, we can't use their stuff for content that is intended to be distributed with ottd, or under GPL.

We need to replace all textures from them with open ones.


This goes for the following works, if you know of others, post them here:
Factory: http://jupix.info/openttd/gfxdev-repo/i ... file&id=22
Printworks: http://jupix.info/openttd/gfxdev-repo/i ... =file&id=9
#################
maquinista
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by maquinista »

This means to code (again) more sprites?

IMHO, this should be applied to new models only.
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by Michi_cc »

maquinista wrote:IMHO, this should be applied to new models only.
You're advocating for copyright infringement then?

The sprites in question say they are GPL licensed. Now the GPL is a "viral" license, which means if the blender file is GPL, all derivatives (i.e. renders) are automatically GPL as well, including the used textures. This is a direct violation of the license terms of those textures.

If I were Jupix, I'd even simply delete those sprites complete from the repository, as he'd be legally responsible if somebody from CGTextures would complain or even press charges.

-- Michael Lutz
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by maquinista »

Solution: just remove the textures in the models, and replace them with a link to CGTextures.

The sprite could be rendered again if someone downloads the texture again from CGTextures.

There are some wagons of Spainset, and some textures used are not present in ZIP files, but I have linked them.
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by ChillCore »

maquinista wrote: Solution: just remove the textures in the models, and replace them with a link to CGTextures.
Better solution: keep model and simply re-texture?
-- .- -.-- / - .... . / ..-. --- .-. -.-. . / -... . / .-- .. - .... / -.-- --- ..- .-.-.-
--- .... / -.-- . .- .... --..-- / .- -. -.. / .--. .-. .- .. ... . / - .... . / .-.. --- .-. -.. / ..-. --- .-. / .... . / --. .- ...- . / ..- ... / -.-. .... --- --- -.-. .... --- --- ... .-.-.- / ---... .--.

Playing with my patchpack? Ask questions on usage and report bugs in the correct thread first, please.
All included patches have been modified and are no longer 100% original.
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by Michi_cc »

maquinista wrote:Solution: just remove the textures in the models, and replace them with a link to CGTextures.

The sprite could be rendered again if someone downloads the texture again from CGTextures.
A rendered sprite is a derivative product, as such the license terms already quoted earlier apply. Your solution thus is a non-solution. Either the textures need to be replaced by other textures, or the model and sprites may not be released under GPL (or any other open source license), which still makes them unsuitable for an open source licensed graphics pack.

-- Michael Lutz
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FooBar
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by FooBar »

I agree that there is no reason to throw the model away.
For now I'd mark those entries with something like "model license: <whatever the current license is>; texture license: none (copyrighted)". And not have those entries in a megapack (either current or future grf format). Then somebody can still take the model and retexture it, and then re-release it under the original license for inclusion in the pack.

The situation is unfortunate though. It will be a lot of work figuring out what sprites use CGT. And then even more work replacing those textures with open source ones. Compared with this, the change to grf format is just a minor inconvenience...
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by maquinista »

Michi_cc wrote:
maquinista wrote:Solution: just remove the textures in the models, and replace them with a link to CGTextures.

The sprite could be rendered again if someone downloads the texture again from CGTextures.
A rendered sprite is a derivative product, as such the license terms already quoted earlier apply. Your solution thus is a non-solution. Either the textures need to be replaced by other textures, or the model and sprites may not be released under GPL (or any other open source license), which still makes them unsuitable for an open source licensed graphics pack.

-- Michael Lutz
If I remember, CGtextures allows derivative works of their textures, but not the redistribution of the textures.
Attachments
licenses2.png
This is my idea.
(6.93 KiB) Downloaded 3 times
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FooBar
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by FooBar »

maquinista wrote:If I remember, CGtextures allows derivative works of their textures...
But they don't. See the first post.

However, your vision outlined in the image is correct. It's just that the 'derivative texture arrow' does not apply to CGT.
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planetmaker
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by planetmaker »

maquinista wrote: If I remember, CGtextures allows derivative works of their textures, but not the redistribution of the textures.
No need to remember. Jupix quoted the relevant part:
Jupix wrote:From their license statement:
It is NOT permitted to:
[ ... ]
Release the Textures or derivative products under Open Source Licences
In short, we can't use their stuff for content that is intended to be distributed with ottd, or under GPL.
In other words: there is no single way we can and may use them here.
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by maquinista »

Use of the Textures is only allowed under the following conditions:
- Private or commercial use
- Use in 2D or 3D computer graphics, movies and printed media
- Incorporation in computer games, 3D models
- Selling 3D models bundled with modified versions of the textures, when the texture is customized for the 3D model


It is NOT permitted to:
- Sell or distribute any of these textures in an unmodified form, or where the derived product you are selling or distributing is a Texture or a collection of Textures. IN OTHER WORDS: Do not sell or distribute any of these textures (modified or not) by itself or in a texture pack, material, clipart, website theme or scrapbooking pack!
- Bundle the images with software such as paint programs, 3D programs, photo-kiosk software.
- Reselling or redistributing the images at 'print on demand' services (mugs, t-shirts, mouse mats, etc)
- Use the textures in graphic design themes or templates sold to multiple customers on digital market places (this includes templates of websites and business cards and e-cards).
- Selling or redistributing skins for laptops, phones and other devices, created with images from CGTextures.
- Stockpile images with the goal of making a local texture library.
- Using a special program (spider, leecher) or script to automatically download all Textures on the CGTextures website. Users who try to mass download will be banned from the website automatically.
- Interfere with the security or otherwise abuse, disrupt, place excessive loads on, or attempt to gain unauthorized access to the CGTextures website or any system resources or networks connected to this website.
- Release the Textures or derivative products under Open Source Licences
We can release the sprites under GPL license, not the texture itself.

PD: Why not ask this to CGtextures?
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Jupix
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by Jupix »

maquinista wrote: We can release the sprites under GPL license, not the texture itself.
The last line in the quote you posted explicitly states we can't.

You can ask them all you want. They can even say yes, but the fact remains, releasing works that are derived from their bitmaps is a violation of their license.

As was said earlier, all we need to do is retexture.
#################
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by Rubidium »

maquinista wrote:Why not ask this to CGtextures?
Because their license clearly states that what has been done is not allowed. Actually contacting them and explaining everything might be an even worse step if there is money behind CGtextures and they start a lawsuit.

Nevertheless: the license is like "you may do A..B if not doing any X and not doing Y and not doing Z)", or differently put: "if you do X you may not do A..B", "if you do Y you may not do A..B", "if you do Z you may not do A..B". You highlight A..B and X, however we are talking about Z. Since you are creating a derivativion of the texture, and releasing that derivation under GPL (an Open Source License) you are doing Z. The result is that you may not do A..B, i.e. you may use it.

I really hope you do get what the license is stating. Replacing the textures with some other texture that is more willing to have its derivative under an Open Source License is the way to go; there is no need to scrap everything, just thing one thing that's troublesome.
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by maquinista »

IMHO, the "derivative works" are packages of textures, not the derived sprites.

But If You want restart the project again, I will accept it, I don't have problem.

If someone needs help on coding sprites, I can try to explain him some coding tricks.
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by Lord Aro »

FooBar wrote:The situation is unfortunate though. It will be a lot of work figuring out what sprites use CGT. And then even more work replacing those textures with open source ones. Compared with this, the change to grf format is just a minor inconvenience...
At the moment, the only known user of CGTextures is Varivar, and a quick look through his stuff on the repo shows that (i think) only the factory and printing works have used these
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Jupix
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by Jupix »

maquinista wrote:IMHO, the "derivative works" are packages of textures, not the derived sprites.
Derivative works are simply works that use other works, doesn't matter how that usage occurs. In this case we're actually double-infringing since we're distributing both a derivative work and the actual raw material.
But If You want restart the project again, I will accept it, I don't have problem.
This is hardly restarting anything. Re-texturing is merely a step which we were preparing for when we insisted on having sources available for everything.
#################
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planetmaker
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by planetmaker »

The FAQ of that page was brought to my attention: http://www.cgtextures.com/content.php?action=faq
Can I create materials for my render program using images from CGTextures and redistribute these materials?
No. You are not allowed to redistribute materials created with images from CGTextures.

May I use your textures to make a (commercial) computer game?
Yes--with the exception of Open-Source projects. See below.

May I use these textures in my Open Source (Creative Commons, GPL, etc) project?
No. These textures may not be used in Open-Source projects. The licenses are not compatible. Almost all Open-Source licenses allow redistribution of the materials, and redistribution is not allowed for these textures.
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by Alltaken »

This is a silly argument.

Retexture the model and it's solved, so we can all move on! This is not a big deal!

Just don't use that website again in the future. There are many other websites with textures out there.
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by Varivar »

Lord Aro wrote: At the moment, the only known user of CGTextures is Varivar, and a quick look through his stuff on the repo shows that (i think) only the factory and printing works have used these
Hello,

I'm the creator of these sprites and thus the initiator of this problem. At the time I created these graphics, CGTextures wasn't very clear about the usage of their textures in opensource projects, but now I see that the usage of these textures is illegal.

Unfortunately most city buildings I created use one or more textures from CGT. The trucks and trees don't use textures from CGT at all. Fortunately these textures can be easily replaced, since they are mostly common textures, like concrete or bricks.


I will replace them by textures from http://www.burningwell.org, which uses a public domain license, and re-render them. This way the original 3d models won't be wasted. This texture migration will probably take some weeks, since I'm not having too much time.
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Re: Stop using CGTextures

Post by Yexo »

Thanks Varivar for doing the best solution possible :bow:
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