FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development
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- EXTspotter
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
You'll need a tractor with the slipway - boats can't beach themselves like that!
- andythenorth
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
Fortunately I have several tractors, but they won't be needed here. They go on a different tile (the beach tile, not drawn). The slipway will have a lift cradle (not drawn) running on the rails (drawn), hauled by a winch (not drawn).EXTspotter wrote:You'll need a tractor with the slipway - boats can't beach themselves like that!
So much to draw

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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
I like that slipway. Good work!

You haven't seen TopGear I suppose. As long as the transmission works boats should be able to get up there on their ownEXTspotter wrote:You'll need a tractor with the slipway - boats can't beach themselves like that!

Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
Sure they can. Wait for high tide, float on over the slipway, wait for tide to roll out.EXTspotter wrote:You'll need a tractor with the slipway - boats can't beach themselves like that!
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
Is someone coding tidal seas then? [/ducks]DaleStan wrote:[...snip...]Wait for high tide, float on over the slipway, wait for tide to roll out.

FIRS Industry Replacement Set (released) | HEQS Heavy Equipment Set (trucks, industrial trams and more) (finished)
Unsinkable Sam (ships) (preview released) | CHIPS Has Improved Players' Stations (finished)
Iron Horse ((trains) (released) | Termite (tracks for Iron Horse) (released) | Busy Bee (game script) (released)
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Unsinkable Sam (ships) (preview released) | CHIPS Has Improved Players' Stations (finished)
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- Zhall
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Re: newgrf proposal: FIRS Industry Replacement Set
Sapphire united wrote:... and a cow in a meat grinder as in postal 2...cmoiromain wrote:maybe you should add cow corpses on the roof to make it look more realistic![]()
very pretty, well done!
Now thats lul!
...........
What about the meat packing process is family friendly? They take cows, kill them, and cut them up into peices. Ok, lets shelter little johnny and tell him that the ratburgers he's eating a mcdonalds arent made from a compinations of 300 or 400 cattle from 4-5 different countries and tell him that that 100% beef is all soy, which most of it is....
Family friendly...


still a lul
Formerly known as Sapphire United.
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- George
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Re: newgrf proposal: FIRS Industry Replacement Set
You can disallow house demolition by player / townandythenorth wrote:This raises an interesting question. Some town 'industries' from the FIRS list might be better implemented as 'houses' (please if you don't understand the distinctions from a newgrf perspective, stay out of this conversation).OzTransLtd wrote:A list of FIRS industries that are planned to be located within town and city boundaries, including accepted and produced cargo types.andythenorth wrote: ... I can add information to the FIRS site, what information and format would be most useful ...
However what criteria should be used to decide implementing as a 'house' or an 'industry'? What are the factors:
- town buildings may relocate as the town grows, this could disrupt player's existing routes
you can disallow closure if there is no required industry nearbyandythenorth wrote:- industries may close if not served with cargo. This could leave towns unable to accept certain types of goods.
Hoses can control the number of houses of the required type / class in the townandythenorth wrote:This could be solved with code. Houses do not close in the same way.
the only problem with industries is a space to build. Bank styled industries remove howses to be buildandythenorth wrote:- it's possible to code for a certain mix of houses in a town. It's more difficult to do this with industries (there is the distance varaction among other things, but using these well is not trivial conceptually or in the implementation).
Specify what you need and we'll find a wayandythenorth wrote:- what else?? I haven't coded any houses before, so I am looking for input

a houseandythenorth wrote:So how should this work in FIRS? Here are some examples:
- Gas Station accepts fuel oil (also food, goods). Presumably there won't be many gas stations in a typical town. Players will likely build routes with tank trucks to a RV station next to the truck station. Will be annoying if the RV station stops accepting fuel oil due to industry relocation. So seems like an industry, not a house?
Both houses and industries can control itandythenorth wrote:- Retail Market is envisaged graphically as a market square as found in many towns worldwide. These don't often relocate, so in that respect are industry-like. However it would be desirable to control their number (one per town) and location (near the middle of town), so also house-like?
same hereandythenorth wrote:- General Store seems to be straightforward: it's a house and there can be n per town (minimum one), located wherever.
yesandythenorth wrote:- Waste Collection Point. If needed at all, seems best to implement as a house.
IMHO, every industry, that can be coded as a house should be coded that way.
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
??? what do you mean by that?Zephyris wrote:I think houses are the best (functionally) way to code some of these industries, although maybe not practically, a couple of things to think about:
* I would have a look at some existing house newgrf's code, especially the north american city set - this has some "landmark" buildings which, IIRC, cannot be demolished by the player, ai or the town so "stay still".
* Any town building "industry" will not appear on maps...
Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
A town building can never appear as a colour coded industry on the mini-map, it would make it hard to find rare industries coded as town buildings...
Re: newgrf proposal: FIRS Industry Replacement Set
the most important difference to consider (imho) is that industries can be funded by a player and spawn a message when they appear randomly. and players cannot remove them without cheating. most newgrf-abilities apply to both industries and housesGeorge wrote:a houseandythenorth wrote:So seems like an industry, not a house?
- planetmaker
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
Concerning the cargos of this set:
Lumber (WDPR) is defined only as piece goods type cargo while for the existing ECS type cargo it's buld AND piece goods. I'm not yet quite sure where, but this might lead to some funny consequences like bulk wagons loading the lumber. Well... if you count wood wools as a wood product too, and allow that, the bulk property might be justified, too.
Basically what I want to argue: consider to also add the bulk property to the wood products in order to not break compatibility (and make it easier for vehicle sets). It's certainly not a biggy, but small things are which make life nasty
Lumber (WDPR) is defined only as piece goods type cargo while for the existing ECS type cargo it's buld AND piece goods. I'm not yet quite sure where, but this might lead to some funny consequences like bulk wagons loading the lumber. Well... if you count wood wools as a wood product too, and allow that, the bulk property might be justified, too.
Basically what I want to argue: consider to also add the bulk property to the wood products in order to not break compatibility (and make it easier for vehicle sets). It's certainly not a biggy, but small things are which make life nasty

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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
I'll let FooBar answer this one - no strong feelings from me either wayplanetmaker wrote:Basically what I want to argue: consider to also add the bulk property to the wood products in order to not break compatibility (and make it easier for vehicle sets). It's certainly not a biggy, but small things are which make life nasty

FIRS Industry Replacement Set (released) | HEQS Heavy Equipment Set (trucks, industrial trams and more) (finished)
Unsinkable Sam (ships) (preview released) | CHIPS Has Improved Players' Stations (finished)
Iron Horse ((trains) (released) | Termite (tracks for Iron Horse) (released) | Busy Bee (game script) (released)
Road Hog (road vehicles and trams) (released)
Unsinkable Sam (ships) (preview released) | CHIPS Has Improved Players' Stations (finished)
Iron Horse ((trains) (released) | Termite (tracks for Iron Horse) (released) | Busy Bee (game script) (released)
Road Hog (road vehicles and trams) (released)
- planetmaker
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
Hm... I just see that it's not the only deviation from previous definitions, but another two - they were just put differently in the newgrf wiki.
Nevertheless I'd advocate to keep the existing definitions, even though personally I prefer your (re-)definitions.
Code: Select all
GOOD Good 0004 Express FIRS: Cclass 0024 Express, Piece goods
FRUT Fruit 0090 Bulk, refrigerated FIRS: Cclass 0084 Express, refrigerated
WDPR Wood Products 0030 Bulk, piece goods FIRS:Lumber 0020 Piece goods
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
Darn...andythenorth wrote:I'll let FooBar answer this one - no strong feelings from me either wayplanetmaker wrote:Basically what I want to argue: consider to also add the bulk property to the wood products in order to not break compatibility (and make it easier for vehicle sets). It's certainly not a biggy, but small things are which make life nasty
Dunno what to say to this. To be honest I have no clue what difference it makes. My first impression is: "any vehicle set should be able to handle this properly regardless of this slight deviation". But as always the matter might be a bit more complicated.
In that respect I say that the bulk carrier is badly coded. A hopper should never carry piece goods. Like a boxcar should never carry bulk.planetmaker wrote:like bulk wagons loading the lumber
IMO Wood Products 0030 Bulk, piece goods is a major flaw in the ECS scheme. Either something is bulk or something is piece goods, but not both.
All in all, we have to see how it works out. After all it's an easy change if it doesn't work out properly with major vehicle sets.
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
Well. The original is called "Wood Products" but has the same WPRD cargoID. Wood products could also be wood pallets or alike which is a rather granular thing. Or it could be lumber as you defined it.FooBar wrote:In that respect I say that the bulk carrier is badly coded. A hopper should never carry piece goods. Like a boxcar should never carry bulk.planetmaker wrote:like bulk wagons loading the lumber
I disagree, as described aboveIMO Wood Products 0030 Bulk, piece goods is a major flaw in the ECS scheme. Either something is bulk or something is piece goods, but not both.

But well... let's see. Though I see not much point in deviating from what's there, either - AND keeping the same name (cargo ID).
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- andythenorth
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
Drawing the right building for this wharf is a right pain in the arse. Should have been simple, but five versions looked wrong so far. This one's will be alright though - when it's finished....
http://www.flickr.com/photos/9131581@N0 ... 6/sizes/l/
Needs a simpler version of the sheds in this picture:http://www.flickr.com/photos/9131581@N0 ... 6/sizes/l/
FIRS Industry Replacement Set (released) | HEQS Heavy Equipment Set (trucks, industrial trams and more) (finished)
Unsinkable Sam (ships) (preview released) | CHIPS Has Improved Players' Stations (finished)
Iron Horse ((trains) (released) | Termite (tracks for Iron Horse) (released) | Busy Bee (game script) (released)
Road Hog (road vehicles and trams) (released)
Unsinkable Sam (ships) (preview released) | CHIPS Has Improved Players' Stations (finished)
Iron Horse ((trains) (released) | Termite (tracks for Iron Horse) (released) | Busy Bee (game script) (released)
Road Hog (road vehicles and trams) (released)
Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
Murphys lawFooBar wrote:...
Darn...
Dunno what to say to this. To be honest I have no clue what difference it makes. My first impression is: "any vehicle set should be able to handle this properly regardless of this slight deviation". But as always the matter might be a bit more complicated.
...


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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
Finally this harbour shed is done...
Started on a beach for small boats to land at, don't know if I can be arsed to finish it though
cheers,
Andy
Started on a beach for small boats to land at, don't know if I can be arsed to finish it though

cheers,
Andy
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FIRS Industry Replacement Set (released) | HEQS Heavy Equipment Set (trucks, industrial trams and more) (finished)
Unsinkable Sam (ships) (preview released) | CHIPS Has Improved Players' Stations (finished)
Iron Horse ((trains) (released) | Termite (tracks for Iron Horse) (released) | Busy Bee (game script) (released)
Road Hog (road vehicles and trams) (released)
Unsinkable Sam (ships) (preview released) | CHIPS Has Improved Players' Stations (finished)
Iron Horse ((trains) (released) | Termite (tracks for Iron Horse) (released) | Busy Bee (game script) (released)
Road Hog (road vehicles and trams) (released)
Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
Uhm, won't that make the wharf only buildable on a very specific setup of terrain? And that makes it hard to appear on random maps...
I'd say leave it out or change it to the same side as the rest of the wharf "sits on"...
I'd say leave it out or change it to the same side as the rest of the wharf "sits on"...
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set (not yet released!)
We can move it around in the layout. That's not traumatic to do. Is it worth having though? Partly I'm drawing it to force myself to learn how to draw rocks which I have to do for a quarry. And a beach could be reused for a resort hotel.Roujin wrote:Uhm, won't that make the wharf only buildable on a very specific setup of terrain? And that makes it hard to appear on random maps...
I'd say leave it out or change it to the same side as the rest of the wharf "sits on"...
FIRS Industry Replacement Set (released) | HEQS Heavy Equipment Set (trucks, industrial trams and more) (finished)
Unsinkable Sam (ships) (preview released) | CHIPS Has Improved Players' Stations (finished)
Iron Horse ((trains) (released) | Termite (tracks for Iron Horse) (released) | Busy Bee (game script) (released)
Road Hog (road vehicles and trams) (released)
Unsinkable Sam (ships) (preview released) | CHIPS Has Improved Players' Stations (finished)
Iron Horse ((trains) (released) | Termite (tracks for Iron Horse) (released) | Busy Bee (game script) (released)
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