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Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 18 Jan 2008 14:32
by rbenevid
Haiya-Dragon wrote:Found a small typo.. The waiting window for the station shows 'fiber crops', where as the local rating section shows 'fibre crops'.
Also, after a small test run (aka just letting the game run and see what happens), I noticed that after a few years pretty much all industries start closing down at the same time (well this is obvious since only a few are being serviced). It seems the cement works, oil wells and brick works survived it though, as the map is littered with them and virtually nothing to bring to them
So the closing down check might be broken on them, or is it intended behaviour?
Conditions for closure seems very harsh in the beginning. Even when serviced, lots of industries, even primary ones (which seems more stable than secondary ones in normal OTTD), close very early (first 3 or 4 years).
You have to use more than one train in each line, even for short distances, to reach the service rating limit (around 75%). It's hard to do it in more than a couple of lines early on, when you're short on cash.
just my 2 cents
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 18 Jan 2008 16:34
by George
rbenevid wrote:Conditions for closure seems very harsh in the beginning. Even when serviced, lots of industries, even primary ones (which seems more stable than secondary ones in normal OTTD), close very early (first 3 or 4 years).
It is either a bug in OTTD or you are mistaken. No industry should close during first
5 years.
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 18 Jan 2008 17:20
by rbenevid
I have a save in which a mine closes in 1953 (game started in 1950). Iquitos Iron Mines always closes in february 1953.
I may be doing something wrong, mixing beta versions perhaps.
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 18 Jan 2008 18:52
by George
rbenevid wrote:I have a save in which a mine closes in 1953 (game started in 1950). Iquitos Iron Mines always closes in february 1953.
I may be doing something wrong, mixing beta versions perhaps.
mines should close only when they are 10 years old.
It looks like it was saved before beta 4 was applied, because it reports 0 months left, while with beta 4 it should report 1 months left. Could you generate a new game and test it? If you can reproduce the problem in a new game, please report it as a bug.
Note. Beta 4 has a problem with Iron mine that reports "industry will close in 24 months" instead of "new ore bed found". I plan to upload a fix tomorrow.
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 18 Jan 2008 20:43
by rbenevid
Started another game. So far so good, no weird closures.
How is "cargo transported" calculated? (I know it's not a GRF thing)
It's not that easy to mantain 75%. There's an iron mine that's being serviced by ships and there's always at least one ship waiting. Cargo transported barely keeps at 75%. Station rating never reaches 70%. Are they connected (industry and station ratings)? Ships are somewhat new (I'm in 1956) but I haven't built statues yet.
One strange thing I noticed: in all machinery industries (iron mine, vehicles, steel mill), remains was always "0 months (0-undef)". This is not normal, is it?
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 18 Jan 2008 21:04
by George
rbenevid wrote:One strange thing I noticed: in all machinery industries (iron mine, vehicles, steel mill), remains was always "0 months (0-undef)". This is not normal, is it?
Yes, and not only in machinery vector. 0 means it does not plan to close.
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 19 Jan 2008 01:22
by rbenevid
George wrote:rbenevid wrote:One strange thing I noticed: in all machinery industries (iron mine, vehicles, steel mill), remains was always "0 months (0-undef)". This is not normal, is it?
Yes, and not only in machinery vector. 0 means it does not plan to close.
Oh, nice. I thought it was months until depleting the mine. Silly me.
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 11:53
by Roujin
[using OpenTTD nightlies]
I'm having a real hard time trying to keep alive sand pits serviced by lorries. There are always lorries waiting at the loading station, but the transported percentage is only around 66%. Production goes down until the sand pit closes.
I also have a coal mine serviced by lorries, and this one works better - production is at 21% (normal).
I'd really like how that percentage is calculated. Does it also have something to do with the distance (and thus time) the cargo is being transported until its destination? That could be a reason why the sand pit closes down on me, but not the coal mine (the sand is transported over a longer distance). Or because the sand pit generally produces more than the coal mine?
Anyway it's the second (of two) sand pits in this game that closed down on me while being served by lorries...
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 12:13
by Roujin
ok,
now I am really depressed.
After the screenshots i made, i borrowed money from the bank so i could build another sand pit. I built it nearer to my glass works this time. I directed my whole fleet of sand trucks to the new sand pit. And in less than a year after founding, it was closed again.
It actually only lives half a year. It starts with 6% then goes down to 5%, then 4%, 3% and then 0%(closure).
How am i supposed to keep it alive?
edit: btw, I'm using no outdated grfs...
ECS Town vector beta 4 (11 Jan 2008)
ECS Basic vector beta 4 (11 Jan 2008)
ECS Machinery vector beta 4 (11 Jan 2008)
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 12:26
by Rainer
Hi Roujin,
Roujin wrote:
edit: btw, I'm using no outdated grfs...
ECS Machinery vector beta 4 (11 Jan 2008)
in fact you do: new Machinery vector is date Jan 20th 2008.
cu
Rainer
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 12:38
by Roujin
Thanks for the info, downloading the newest version right now.
But i doubt it will have any effect on how the sand pits act, because they are part of the basic vector...
edit: yep, as expected, newly founded sand pit still closes down in ~a half year. Please tell me it's a bug and not intended behavior
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 14:08
by rbenevid
It must be a bug, I think they should be protected in the first 2 years or something.
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 15:54
by Roujin
And even if it were out of protection.. why is servicing with a fleet of trucks so big that there's always a queue waiting too less to keep it alive?
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 16:38
by George
rbenevid wrote:It must be a bug, I think they should be protected in the first 2 years or something.
They should be protected for 10 years. It is a bug. I can confirm it (and it happens to all the mines).
Belugas: Could you have a look? It looks like this code
Code: Select all
499 * 18 02 0A 21 81 93 00 FF 02
00 80 00 04
81 80 05 1F
01 80
500 * 14 02 0A 22 81 93 00 FF 01 82 80 00 1F 02 80
501 * 14 02 0A 22 81 18 08 FF 01 8E 80 00 DF 22 00
502 * 14 02 0A 2D 81 93 00 FF 01 00 80 00 04 8D 80
503 * 26 02 0A 71 81 9C 00 FF 04
21 00 00 7F
2D 00 80 B2
8E 80 B4 D8
22 00 D9 FF
00 80
somehow drops the var 93 below 04 and that forces the industry to close.
BTW, industry prop 14 is set to 5 for mines, but they have a production of 6, 12 tonnes a month (should be 5 or 10).
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 18:13
by Snail
George, I saw that the Italian translation of your ECS vectors is still incomplete. I can help you finish it if you gave me the original English text.
Machinery Vector Date
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 18:26
by wallyweb
Machinery Vector Dates
-
Download page says 20 Jan 2008
- Un-tarred windows file says 13/01/08
Which one is correct?
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 19:08
by George
Snail wrote:George, I saw that the Italian translation of your ECS vectors is still incomplete. I can help you finish it if you gave me the original English text.
Yes, I plan to focus on translations as soon as I fix all these bugs and update the wiki (And yes, Wally did not do it yet
).
Re: Machinery Vector Date
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 19:09
by George
wallyweb wrote:Machinery Vector Dates
-
Download page says 20 Jan 2008
- Un-tarred windows file says 13/01/08
Which one is correct?
the file was created on 13-th, while I forgot to upload it and uploaded it only on 20-th. The correct GRF date is 13-th.
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 21 Jan 2008 20:21
by wallyweb
Thank you for the information on the dates.
George wrote:... update the wiki (And yes, Wally did not do it yet
).
I am trying to do this in an orderly process.
I am currently working in the Town Vector where the Tourist Centers have been done.
I am now looking at the factory.
There is an inconsistency. The wiki says the factory accepts wood products.
I have just loaded
all the latest vectors in a game and I see the factory accepting steel, glass and dyes, but I do not see it accepting wood products.
Is the wiki wrong or will this be changed in the grf?
Another question:
The wiki says "The industry can't process only glass or wood products nor glass and wood products without steel."
This implies that the Machinery Vector must be loaded as well as the Wood Vector and/or the Basic Vector. In other words, If a player loads only the Town Vector and the Basic Vector, delivering Glass to the factory will have no effect. Is this correct?
Re: ECS implementation by George: ECS vectors. Beta 4 11/01/2008
Posted: 22 Jan 2008 05:00
by George
Mine closure bug should be fixed now.