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Posted: 28 Aug 2004 09:48
by Daan Timmer
fine
sorry, kinda forgot
was kinda busy
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 29 Aug 2008 19:53
by Purno
Massive bump.
Purno's Drawing Tutorials got a quick revision, mentioning the most important things which were wrong for ages (such as the much blamed old inverted DOS palette or something). It's basicly still the old tutorials with a few comments about the things that were wrong. And a few excess pages which were irrelevent were left out of the index (they still exist though). I finally have put myself to do this little update.
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 29 Aug 2008 20:07
by michael blunck
Purno wrote:the much blamed old inverted DOS palette
But now you´re showing only the Win Palette, which isn´t that straightforward for artists, simply because colour tones aren´t consecutively arranged (grey colours are shifted in between), and it lacks a couple of colours from the DOS palette altogether.
You should emphasize to use the DOS palette for drawing (as I´ve done numerous times) and only switch to the Win palette when encoding by grfcodec (
grfcodec -m0 -e ....).
regards
Michael
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 29 Aug 2008 20:09
by Purno
So what was wrong with the old palette then? I'm confused now.
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 29 Aug 2008 20:30
by michael blunck
Didn´t you write it yourself?
It was mirrored twice, resp turned by 180°. O/c, in a first attempt this wouldn´t matter much, as long as people would restrict themselves to simply choosing colours. But OTOH, all colour indices are wrong, which would be bad when people are beginning to code more advanced features into their .nfos/.grfs, e.g. recolouring CBs.
Just follow the link I gave. There´s also another nice DOS palette by minime (?) in that thread, IIRC.
regards
Michael
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 29 Aug 2008 22:28
by DJ Nekkid
hi P ...
may i suggest that on the EMU-page (
http://users.tt-forums.net/purno/PDT/re ... orial.html) you should swap the sprites, as that is the correct order from a coders perspective
Code: Select all
^
| / --> \ | / <-- \
and not
^
| / <-- \ | / --> \
if that made sense
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 29 Aug 2008 22:44
by FooBar
michael blunck wrote:You should emphasize to use the DOS palette for drawing...
But if you use the Win palette, your grfs always looks the same whether its a dos or a win grf, simply because you don't use the colours which are present in the dos palette, but not in the win palette. Right?
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 30 Aug 2008 08:44
by Purno
Done, added a page plus a little note on some tutorials.
FooBar wrote:michael blunck wrote:You should emphasize to use the DOS palette for drawing...
But if you use the Win palette, your grfs always looks the same whether its a dos or a win grf, simply because you don't use the colours which are present in the dos palette, but not in the win palette. Right?
Aye, I'm getting more and more confused now. If the DOS and WIN palette differ, how does that influence the choice of what palette to use? And if the DOS palette should be used, how come the WIN palette is 'advertised' on the Wiki?
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 30 Aug 2008 09:07
by eis_os
Advertised?
It's only because I collected all informations about the window palette once and made a nice graphic
Yes, the window palette has less colors, generally grfcodec should convert DOS to Windows too. Use the one you Game has, otherwise you have to convert always...
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 30 Aug 2008 09:21
by Purno
But the windows version of TT is currently more common, isn't it? Especially since OpenTTD *needs* the windows version, doesn't it?
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 30 Aug 2008 09:28
by michael blunck
Purno wrote:But the windows version of TT is currently more common, isn't it? Especially since OpenTTD *needs* the windows version, doesn't it?
Simply
take a look on the DOS and the Win palettes and then tell me which would be more appropriate for "drawing".
Needless to say that grfcodec would be able to do the conversion Win -> DOS and DOS -> Win.
regards
Michael
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 30 Aug 2008 09:37
by Rubidium
Purno wrote:But the windows version of TT is currently more common, isn't it? Especially since OpenTTD *needs* the windows version, doesn't it?
When you run OpenTTD with TTD Windows' original graphics then you would need the Windows paletted NewGRFs, however when you run OpenTTD with TTD DOS' original graphics you should use the DOS paletted NewGRFs or it won't look pretty.
When you have the original graphics from both versions you can even tell OpenTTD which version to take at the command line (and soon also in openttd.cfg).
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 30 Aug 2008 11:51
by FooBar
The windows one, because it doesn't contain colours which are available only in one of the two versions.
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 30 Aug 2008 15:09
by michael blunck
FooBar wrote:
mb wrote:
Purno wrote:If the DOS and WIN palette differ, how does that influence the choice of what palette to use?
But the windows version of TT is currently more common, isn't it? Especially since OpenTTD *needs* the windows version, doesn't it?
Simply take a look on the DOS and the Win palettes and then tell me which would be more appropriate for "drawing".
The windows one, because it doesn't contain colours which are available only in one of the two versions.
Wrong.
regards
Michael
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 30 Aug 2008 15:14
by FooBar
michael blunck wrote:Wrong...
..because?
Or is this some kind of game where you only get to know if your answer is wrong or right, but not why your answer is wrong?
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 30 Aug 2008 17:58
by michael blunck
FooBar wrote:[...] is this some kind of game where you only get to know if your answer is wrong or right, but not why your answer is wrong?
Did you probably checked the link I gave above?
regards
Michael
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 30 Aug 2008 21:55
by thgergo
michael blunck wrote:FooBar wrote:
Wrong.
regards
Michael
The answer is more than Right, than Wrong, he said he uses the windows one, becouse it doest contain any colours what DOS one hasnt. Apart from that, I thought the two palettes is same just the colours mixed to different place before, good to know the truth:)
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 31 Aug 2008 10:26
by FooBar
michael blunck wrote:Did you probably checked the link I gave above?
Yes I have and I actually saved the image for future reference. So thanks for that.
So I assume you're pointing to this:
"Because the DOS palette is the more coherent one, I´m using it for drawing"
If you're using the palette as an image in your working files to pick colours from, then yes, but I could as well reorder the colours of the Windows palette to something I like to pick colours from. Internaly I let Photoshop use the correct palette to save the file.
I could as well use one of these things for drawing:
Re: Purno's Drawing Tutorials [now online]
Posted: 31 Aug 2008 10:44
by mart3p
I agree with FooBar, it seems pointless working with the DOS palette, if the extra colours it provides are changed when the grf is converted to windows. I would rather work with the windows palette where no colours get changed during conversion to DOS.
Could you explain why that palette and also the DOS palette posted
here, have some colours that differ from those in the DOS palette output from GRFCodec? I have found the following anomalies:
Code: Select all
Index | palette colour | palette colour
| DOS palette.png | from GRFCodec
----- | --------------- | --------------
32 - 252, 212, 0 - 252, 208, 0
35 - 72, 44, 4 - 76, 40, 0
44 - 252, 252, 128 - 252, 248, 128
6A - 72, 44, 4 - 72, 40, 4
7C - 128, 56, 40 - 120, 56, 40
AF - 208, 184, 255 - 200, 176, 248
B2 - 64, 0, 4 - 60, 0, 0
B9 - 252, 84, 0 - 252, 80, 0
BD - 252, 196, 0 - 252, 192, 0
D0 - 108, 176, 64 - 124, 200, 76
D3 - 204, 240, 252 - 200, 236, 248