Transport Tycoon Forums

sevenfm wrote:I like the idea, but why industry generates lots of passengers even if they are not supplied?
For example, if I deliver 5 passengers/month it will still generate 100 passengers/month, more than a small town early in the game.
It should be named "Man cloning industries"

Perhaps the industries are using the livestock to generate human clones?

It is like soylent green, but a'rebours

OK, I will try to fix passenger generation.
But have no idea, how to fix same name issues reported earlier.

McZapkie wrote:OK, I will try to fix passenger generation.

I tried also manpower in SPI, and the amount of passengers generated is scaled to amount of delivered passengers, don't know if exact numbers of arrived/generated match, but it looks more realistic. The sources of the SPI set are available in NML.

sevenfm wrote:I tried also manpower in SPI, and the amount of passengers generated is scaled to amount of delivered passengers, don't know if exact numbers of arrived/generated match, but it looks more realistic. The sources of the SPI set are available in NML.

Manpower function of SPI was originally ported from this grf so I prefer to look at the original code I uploaded v.3.0 with tweaked passenger production, but I need to keep balance between so called realism and issues with symmetric cargodist.

MlemandPurrs, I checked code for food factory - steel works as production booster (is needed for food cans).
If you don't want such function, enable fruits, grain and livestock.

Hello!
Great that the project not abandoned.
Before you made some fixes, may I add some
suggestions or bugs I noticed:
1. "New coal seam found..." for industries that not coal mine.
2. Is there a way to protect industries that have pax sevice only, from closing?
3. Do you take into account some CargoDist parameters? Especially distant related one.
Sometimes it looks like "workers" mostly travel between industries regardless of nearby towns.
4. There's a popular patch "Town generation factor" that adjust pax generation of towns.
I don't know whether it is possible to check presence/value of some particular settings of the game
from GRF code, but it would be nice to control pax generation by this way. Or maybe it would
be easier to inject above patch (I believe it's only 2-3 lines of code) in you GRF and add own parameter?

5. Finally, is there a chance to involve _secondary_ industries in?

Thank you again for your Manpower. I don't imagine this game
without it and CargoDist (though CargDest is better).

stb wrote: 1. "New coal seam found..." for industries that not coal mine.
2. Is there a way to protect industries that have pax sevice only, from closing?
3. Do you take into account some CargoDist parameters? Especially distant related one.
Sometimes it looks like "workers" mostly travel between industries regardless of nearby towns.
4. There's a popular patch "Town generation factor" that adjust pax generation of towns.
I don't know whether it is possible to check presence/value of some particular settings of the game
from GRF code, but it would be nice to control pax generation by this way. Or maybe it would
be easier to inject above patch (I believe it's only 2-3 lines of code) in you GRF and add own parameter?
5. Finally, is there a chance to involve _secondary_ industries in?

1. Which kind of industries have such issue?
2. there is already forest camp with such feature, but generally it create unwanted effects, for example if unwanted industry is near passenger station, it would capture passengers and newer perish.
3. Generally symmetric cargodist is counter-productive in case of manpower, idle industry produce few passengers and will have no chance to get enough crew, whereas industry on full speed would suck most of passengers, it is hard to balance between. I recommend to break passenger symmetry to about 60...80%, just play with this parameter and test how it works.
4. Patches are C++ language, grfs are nml, it doesn't mix.
5. There is a hard coded limit of 3 cargo in and 2 cargo out, so not all secondary industries can be ever involved into manpower. Additionally, it would give opportunity to abuse workers by sending them from primary to secondary industry and back

Hi there,

1. Grain producing farms definitely. Maybe copper/iron mines, not sure (not played for the couple of months).
2. Currently, I save a game often and reload if an industry with a pax service (but not primary cargo yet) is
about to close. It's annoying, though not vitally. Regarding unwanted industry: is there any reason to place a station nearby
if its not planned for future use?
3, 4, 5. My fault. GRF's don't have any control over pax routing. CargoDist does. Yes?

P.S. One more idea. What about redirecting Farmstead to produce Food instead of Grain? Farm has much more output of Grain.
And let Shop to accept not only Food but Fruit as well? In this case, Farm, Farmstead, Fruit Plant, Food Plant and Shop/Houses cargo chain
looks more balanced.

McZapkie wrote:5. There is a hard coded limit of 3 cargo in and 2 cargo out, so not all secondary industries can be ever involved into manpower. Additionally, it would give opportunity to abuse workers by sending them from primary to secondary industry and back

Isn't it currently possible to abuse workers by sending them between two primary industries, for example between coal mine and farm?

Yes, because there's no way to prohibit workers travelling between industries, lets leave them as they are.

I think that reducing pax generation of industries, would have some effect for CargoDist. I hope it will try to send
_most_ of pax to other towns to keep symmetry of town generated pax. And with "Effect of distance on demands" option
industries will recruit most of workers from nearby towns and, on the whole, pax transit would look more realistic.
Though there's a chance that close industries might exchange workers.


Also, there's no much problem with secondary industries working with pax. For example,
currently, Steel Mill has 2 in (coal and iron ore) and 1 out: steel. So it has extra space for pax.
Fruit could be redirected to Shop, so Food Plant would accept only Livestock and Grain.
And so on for other industries. Only Factory becomes like some metal workshop: it will accept only Steel and Copper.

What about boosting primary industries with Goods like it done already for Grain Farms?

Of course it is possible to send passengers from one mine to another, but it is "perpendicular" to existing links. Moreover, code is pretty complicated now due to plenty of options, and I prefer not mix it up. You can imagine, that factory is almost fully automated and doesn't need so much crew, whereas mines or farms need plenty of workers.
Sending goods to mine? It shift this simply grf into FIRS area. I would rather prefer to make manpower version of FIRS than add new options to this project.

Hi there,

After a long break, I tried OpenTTD (with the latest version of JGR pack and Manpower) and found
it is impossible to raise crews for normal industry production. I examined and found that sometimes pax's don't
get off at an industry station. I set CargoDist accuracy to max value (64) but it didn't help.
Could you upload the previous version of Manpower here, please?

stb wrote: I examined and found that sometimes pax's don't
get off at an industry station. I set CargoDist accuracy to max value (64) but it didn't help.

Distribution accuracy have rather nothing to do in such case.
You should rather decrease "amount of returning cargo in symmetric mode", values in range 50..75% seems to be sufficient.