Transport Tycoon Forums

Yes, I am testing the US Set for myself, and enjoying it so far. I have a couple of problems with passenger coaches being a bit too long and similar, but they are merely personal taste. I like how it plays so far, very challenging.

Raichase wrote: I have a couple of problems with passenger coaches being a bit too long

That's because US carriages fit together, or connect with black accordion corridors. We tried to replicate that.

Raichase wrote:and similar

Well, the heavyweight carriages pretty much all did look alike. We added some special-design trains in that era to add some variety. Later on, the standard carriages are more colorful, and there's more visual variety in the passenger locos also.

Raichase wrote: I like how it plays so far, very challenging.

I'm glad! One of the design specifications was for it to be noticeably more challenging, by raising the operating costs enormously. It's still perfectly possible to make mammoth profits, but you have to use a new strategy of loss-leaders - that is, run loss-making services because you can make profits on the next link of the vector, or to grow a city.

krtaylor wrote:

Raichase wrote: I have a couple of problems with passenger coaches being a bit too long and similar

He meant he also had problems similar to the too-long-heavyweights, not the passenger coached being too similar

Thanks for the reply, but can we avoid clagging the topic up . Thanks.

My current opinion of the USSet is a picture of a big thumbs up. So, I'll see if I like it enough to realise it (pun intended).

There. Completed the DB Set section and the trimmed down guide (which is really just the summary tables). Next on the block is editing the original Realism Guide (One I did ages ago based on the original vehicles, but never shared), and testing the US Set - Darn, that'll be hard work .

may I suggest that you save your otherwise very nice guide in pdf-format for the benefit of Linux-users and others that do not have Microsoft Word handy

I only have acrobat reader - would a HTML version help? I forgot to attach one to the first post (I meant to, honest ).

EDIT: Done just that - it's a HTM file that I had to zip to get onto the forums. If that doesn't work, I may just have to find something that can create PDF files .

Try http://www.openoffice.org , It can create .PDFs, as well as open .doc files, in the case that you need to.

Thanks very much, I'll download it now and post a pdf file .

Okay folks, I have finally gotten off my rear and updated the guide to bring it into line with the DB Set XL 0.81. I have also dug up all the info I have been gathering on the US Set, and hope to make a start on that after the next version is released.

Changes include:

Updated Passenger Locomotives
Added section about "Express Services"
Updated Passenger Train Sets
Updated Freight Locomotives
Added "Types of Freight" to bring it into line with DB Set XL 0.81.

Thanks to Uwe for helping with this version, with tips he sent me whilst he was also working on his version of the DB Guide. Cheers mate (expect to see his own version on his website soon).

Still trying to figure out how to get Open Office to give me a PDF file - best I can get is a HTML file....

Nice work

Raichase wrote: Still trying to figure out how to get Open Office to give me a PDF file - best I can get is a HTML file....

Don't you have "file -> export as PDF" ? Or a little button in your "function bar" (see attachment)

Good work!

However, I've never seen the BR612 in S-Bahn-Services. It's used for local and local express services. Some have been redesigned for IC-Services to replace the ICE TD.

Mikey79 wrote:Good work!
However, I've never seen the BR612 in S-Bahn-Services. It's used for local and local express services. Some have been redesigned for IC-Services to replace the ICE TD.

You're right, but as there is no type in the set to replace the BR 111 / BR 420 in these services, one can also use the BR 612, since it comes with the same coaches for fast (un)loading.

Also, I think there has been a typo in the section about freight locos - it should really be BR 182 instead of BR 181.

Finally, I have completed my own version of the realism guide, as Raichase already announced. You can get it here.

Uwe wrote: You're right, but as there is no type in the set to replace the BR 111 / BR 420 in these services, one can also use the BR 612, since it comes with the same coaches for fast (un)loading.

Ok, thats a good point. Some days earlier I thought that the BR 423/424/425 (one of them, as they are equal and just differ in some specifications) would be a good completion to the set - as long as they don't have the problems within the game they have in reality.

Uwe wrote: Finally, I have completed my own version of the realism guide, as Raichase already announced. You can get it here.

Also good work.

But some remarks and questions:
The BR 103 isn't in service since 2003.
Didn't the BR 103 just do IC-services from 1987 to 2003? I never saw them on IR-services.

The BR 232 was also used for local and medium passenger services until the early 1990ies.

Hmmmm, okay... just a few thoughts:

About the BR 612 in S-Bahn service:
It has never been and will never be in this service. Each unit has only two quite small doors which aren't suited for fast passenger exchange.

BR 103:
It was always in IC services, there was never a time when it did IR only. In the first year of the IR services, it was originally planned to only use orient-red 103 for these trains. But the IR network grew larger and that wasn't possible any longer. In addition to that, the BR 120 was never designed to replace the 103. So the 60 locos of the BR 120 wouldn't be enough to send 145 locos of the 103 out of service.
Actually there is still one almost planned IC service which is hauled by 103 245-7 during the weekend.

BR 111 for S-Bahn:
The S-Bahn service was a horror for the 111. Like the 110 this loco was designed for longer local or medium long distance trains. But definatly not S-Bahn which has to stop every 1-5 km and has to speed up fast.
Due to that, it was replaced by the BR 143 right after the Bundesbahn and Reichsbahn merged into the Deutsche Bahn AG. The 143 had better acceleration and it wasn't that unreliable for S-Bahn trains.
As of today, the 111 is only in use for medium to heavy local services.

BR 181 and freight:
This IS also a freight locomotive. It still is commonly used in german-france freight trains. Of course it is kind of weak, but those trains aren't that heavy anyways.

BR 232:
Yes, it was and still is used for passenger services. It is used for all kind of passenger trains: Local, IR and even IC. Today the are mainly used in IC services (besides the frieght of course!) as well as local trains when the BR 612 or 610 is out of service again

Which leads again to the 612:
This machine should be very unreliable, like the 605 (ICE-TD). At the moment, these trains again aren't allowed to use their tilting technology as well as some other small problems.

V100:
It has always been in local freight service. Actually this is the virtually only left service for these small diesels.

About the InterRegio trains:
When they started, the BR 103 was the main engine for these trains. But up till the mid 90's, the situation was different. The 103, 110 and 111 were the main engines for these services, with 218 and 232 on non-electrified tracks.
In DB AG years (after 1994), the situation changed completely. 103 and 120 were the only engines used for these trains (besides again 218 and 232). Before the IR service was completely canceled (let's say 2001-2002) and turned into IC, the 101 and 120 were the main engines. 103 was only available for rare backup.

And over all for the years 1947-1994:
Although there are of course fixed services for each engine, the Bundesbahn used what was available for the trains. The 110 wasn't a rare guest for hauling freight trains, while the E94 was quite common all the time in front of local trains.
There are many interesting train composition which were regular during these years. The 103 had very small local servce runs with 3 1920 DRG coaches. BR 150 hauled local trains with 1 or 2 silverfishes. The 140 was very common for local services too.

So be creative there

Anyways, great job for these guides! Let's just hope people read them carefully and start some nice networks.

Thankyou so much for the help 103er-fan, I can always rely on you to help me when I miss something (being an Aussie, I have a teensy bit of trouble with the DB Trains ). I'll go through and make those changes ASAP.

Thanks as well to Mikey79, and Uwe (damn, I missed that typo *again* ).

Also, thanks Jacke, I was trying to save it as a pdf - I didn't know there was a special action required. I'll look into that too .

Thanks again everyone!

You're welcome Raichase!
I think the primary goal should be, to iron out the remaining mistakes in the guides. Everybody can help out there and I am always glad when I can contribute something useful.

I just wanted to add something for the ICE 1:
There are two consists in use. The first version with 12 middle-coaches and the second variant with 14 middle-coaches. The last one is used for routes with more passengers. An ICE 1 usually never drives with more than 14 and less than 12 coaches.

103er-Fan wrote:About the BR 612 in S-Bahn service:
It has never been and will never be in this service. Each unit has only two quite small doors which aren't suited for fast passenger exchange.

That's correct, but in the game it uses S-Bahn coaches, so you might just use it, though in reality it would never happen. I guess we'll have to wait until Michael introduces some modern BR 42x type of train as a modern replacement for those services.

103er-Fan wrote:BR 103: It was always in IC services, there was never a time when it did IR only. In the first year of the IR services, it was originally planned to only use orient-red 103 for these trains. But the IR network grew larger and that wasn't possible any longer. In addition to that, the BR 120 was never designed to replace the 103. So the 60 locos of the BR 120 wouldn't be enough to send 145 locos of the 103 out of service.

So it is ok to use a BR 103 for IR services anyway. I also think that originally the BR 120 was meant to replace the BR 103, but these plans were scrapped after the technical problems with the BR 120, when only 60 were put into service.

103er-Fan wrote:BR 111 for S-Bahn:
The S-Bahn service was a horror for the 111. Like the 110 this loco was designed for longer local or medium long distance trains. But definatly not S-Bahn which has to stop every 1-5 km and has to speed up fast.
Due to that, it was replaced by the BR 143 right after the Bundesbahn and Reichsbahn merged into the Deutsche Bahn AG. The 143 had better acceleration and it wasn't that unreliable for S-Bahn trains.
As of today, the 111 is only in use for medium to heavy local services.

Well, the main problem is that there is no BR 143 in the set (and I really miss that one), but Michael will have his reasons for not including it. So, as the BR 111 is the only one that gets the S-Bahn coaches, it is the only useful engine for this type of service. Speaking of additions to the set, including double-deck coaches for local services would be useful as well.

103er-Fan wrote:BR 232:
Yes, it was and still is used for passenger services. It is used for all kind of passenger trains: Local, IR and even IC. Today the are mainly used in IC services (besides the frieght of course!) as well as local trains when the BR 612 or 610 is out of service again

Now show me the IC trains that are hauled by a BR 232 - there are not that many that it would matter, considering the possible number of IC trains on a TTDX map. So to me it is a freight only loco, at least in TTDX.

103er-Fan wrote:Although there are of course fixed services for each engine, the Bundesbahn used what was available for the trains. The 110 wasn't a rare guest for hauling freight trains, while the E94 was quite common all the time in front of local trains.
There are many interesting train composition which were regular during these years. The 103 had very small local servce runs with 3 1920 DRG coaches. BR 150 hauled local trains with 1 or 2 silverfishes. The 140 was very common for local services too.

While this is correct (I know about similar compositions of the Reichsbahn in East Germany), the situation in the game is a bit different. When setting up a new service, a fitting loco is chosen that sticks with this route all the time. In reality, engines would do this service on one day, and a competely different service a day later. As this cannot be modeled in the game, I think creativity in using engines is a bit limited to "use a suitable loco".

Anyway, thanks for all the comments, I'll change some of the descriptions in my guide accordingly.

Based on many years experience playing with the DBSet, and some helpful hints from several other guides including Rai's, I have finished the first version of a 'timeline' for the set (and the two expansions DB Double Deck and TRAXX).

It is intended as an accompliment as you go through the years, to guide you on what you can plan to expect.

Any alterations needed etc please let me know.