[Univ] GRVTS (v1.4) and [OTTD] eGRVTS (v1.0)

Discuss, get help with, or post new graphics for TTDPatch and OpenTTD, using the NewGRF system, here. Graphics for plain TTD also acceptable here.

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PikkaBird
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by PikkaBird »

Zephyris wrote:I have not added the power/weight values for this set, your assumption that the default vehicle stats are being used is correct. I should be able to add some in the near future, it seems worthwhile now realistic acceleration is in trunk! I would be very grateful for any advice on values for these statistics - do any sets work particularly well (which I could model values around)?
The best advice I can give is to find real-world trucks and busses of similar vintage, and use their stats. FWIW, for trucks I'd use values in the region of;
1920 - 40hp, 5t
1950 - 100hp, 8t
1990 - 300hp, 15t
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by hertogjan »

For the buses, PikkaBird's HOVS bus set performs quite well, and I always use it when playing with the road vehicle acceleration patch on.

For the standard buses and trucks, I have "guessed" the following values, which are hardcoded in the realistic acceleration patch. The values are not wildly guessed, but they are such that the vehicles in question reach their maximum speed even when fully loaded (at least they should).

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                       weight (kg)  power (hp)
MPS Regal Bus                 8000         100
Hereford Leopard Bus          9500         190
Foster Bus                   10500         290
Foster MkII Superbus         12000         400
1st generation truck          9000         150
2nd generation truck         12000         260
3rd generation truck         13500         380
The trucks of the default vehicle set hence all have the same weight and power rating, regardless of their cargo. This means a slight disadvantage for the vehicles that transport heavy cargo (e.g. bulk goods like coal, grain, iron/copper ore, etc.). This effect is the largest on inclined roads: Heavier vehicles will have more difficulty climbing a mountain. So perhaps for the GRVTS you should give the vehicles carrying heavy cargo and the articulated vehicles more power.
The values in this table are more or less in the region of comparable buses in the HOVS set and PikkaBird's suggestion in the previous post, although my values seem to be slightly higher (i.e., "my" vehicles are slightly heavier and more powerful). Unfortunately, I do not know how TTDPatch implements the weight and power for the default vehicle set (which should have been defined somewhere, since TTDPatch also contains realistic acceleration for road vehicles, as far as I know). Maybe you can try to obtain these values and use them as a suggestion as well?

As for the other properties: According to the grf specifications, one can also set the maxTE ratio and air drag coefficient for road vehicles (Action 0 properties 18 and 19). However (unlike power and weight), not setting the values for maxTE and air drag will give the vehicles default values, which works well most of the time (except maybe that you may want to lower the air drag coefficients for extremely fast buses, but as far as I have seen these are not included in GRVTS).
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by Zephyris »

Awesome, thanks for the help guys! I will be finishing exams next week then will get on it!
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by Thief^ »

I've just been playing around with OpenTTD again and tried this grf.

Is it just me or are the passenger tram running costs a little out? The first tram is £9/year and the last is £1,195/year!
For comparison, the busses go from £159/year to £703/year. Should there be an extra "0" on the end of the running cost of some or all of your 1-floor trams? They'd still be far cheaper than the busses to run, but they wouldn't be able to make a profit carrying 1 person any more.

EDIT: Corrected prices, I was using daylength x4.
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Zephyris
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by Zephyris »

When I include the powers and weights I'll check the running costs, see what's going on...

*edit* The source spreadsheet for the statistics is correct, something fishy must be going on... Last exam tomorrow!
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by Thief^ »

Good Luck :)
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by Zephyris »

Power and weight have been added, but I can't clear this running costs bug:

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The first bus:
    3 * 62	 00 01 18 01 00 00 BB 00 02 20 03 19 04 2D 06 0F 07 05 08 60 09 1B 0A 48 4C 00 00 13 05 14 1A 0E FF 0F 12 10 FF 11 2E 12 17 15 18 16 00 00 00 00 17 00 1A 00 1B 00 1C 02 1D 01 00 1E 08 01
The first tram:
   74 * 62	 00 01 18 01 47 00 00 00 02 20 03 14 04 2F 06 0F 07 05 08 50 09 13 0A 48 4C 00 00 13 0A 14 18 0E FF 0F 14 10 FF 11 1F 12 00 15 14 16 00 00 00 00 17 00 1A 00 1B 00 1C 03 1D 01 00 1E 08 01
So according to me the relevant chunks are:

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Bus:  09 1B 0A 48 4C 00 00
Tram: 09 13 0A 48 4C 00 00
Corresponding to running costs of:

Code: Select all

Bus:  £337/month
Tram: £238/month
But (in OpenTTD, medium running cost multiplier) this gives:

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Bus:  £168/month
Tram: £12/month
Why's it not working :'( have I done something stupid?
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by LordAzamath »

A little correction..
Bus: 337$/month
Tram: 238$/month
And bus is correct there.. 168£=336$
if the tram 10-multiplier would apply...
120£=240$

so only problem is currently tram's missing 0 there.. Maybe an OpenTTD's bug..
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Zephyris
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by Zephyris »

Well for now I'll assume its a bug! New version in the first post, version 1.1.

New features:
Weight and power for realistic acceleration.

Bugs fixed:
White line on Foster Pioneer Bus _ view.
Tweaked running costs (trams still have problems in OpenTTD).
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by DaleStan »

Zephyris wrote:But (in OpenTTD, medium running cost multiplier) this gives:

have I done something stupid?
Besides not testing in TTDPatch? Or, if you have, not giving the results?

TTDPatch (prior to r1896, anyway) is still the definitive NewGRF host. And even if it weren't, there are three things that could be broken:
Your code.
TTDPatch.
OpenTTD.

If Patch and Open both do the same thing, then it's probably your code. If the two hosts do different things, then it's probably the host that's not behaving the way you expected.
To get a good answer, ask a Smart Question. Similarly, if you want a bug fixed, write a Useful Bug Report. No TTDPatch crashlog? Then follow directions.
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by LordAzamath »

TTDPatch-win32-nightly-r1907 says...

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Stanley T1 (1 car passenger) running costs: $24/year
AH Mk1 (1 car passenger) running costs: $36/year
Bradley Multi (1 car passenger) running costs: $374/year
So it perhaps is a bug in your code still.. Though I can't think of how.. :P
PS: And I stopped the propaganda to support Dave Worley since he got a nice new red hat now.[/color]
I know I have a BBCode error in my signature but I really cba to fix it.
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by DaleStan »

Is there any chance that you're resetting those properties later in the GRF?
To get a good answer, ask a Smart Question. Similarly, if you want a bug fixed, write a Useful Bug Report. No TTDPatch crashlog? Then follow directions.
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by Zephyris »

Hmmm, they shouldn't be, all the action0s are together at the start of the grf... Seems the most likely explanation though, i'll have a look!
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by lobster »

i have a small question: as you can see here, there's train sets going back as far as the 1830's. are there any plans, or will there be - because of this - a plan or any plans, to accompany this idea with for instance horse carriages? t'would be most awesome, i'd say. :)
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by Zephyris »

I would be interested in doing so! Which set is that? It would have to be OpenTTD only though (using the additional vehicle ids now available)...
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by lobster »

t'is the NARS, and still in development. so yeah, you have some time to research. :wink: and indeed, t'would be OTTD only. but i feel that, if this set supported that, it would be considered as the "standard RV" set for OTTD, it being generic *and* pre-1921 compatible.
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by Zephyris »

Running cost bug fixed, version 1.2 available for download in the first post.
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by LordAzamath »

So what was wrong with the tram running costs?
PS: And I stopped the propaganda to support Dave Worley since he got a nice new red hat now.[/color]
I know I have a BBCode error in my signature but I really cba to fix it.
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by andythenorth »

lobster wrote:...there's train sets going back as far as the 1830's...
Zephyris wrote:I would be interested in doing so! Which set is that? It would have to be OpenTTD only though (using the additional vehicle ids now available)...
I'm playing with the CanSet which has narrow gauge trains back to 1903, and standard gauge a few years after. Its fun to try and work with only NG trains, but a couple of small road vehicles would be useful, it would be great if GRTVS could offer that.

Lack of trams / buses in towns is the most noticeable from a gameplay perspective - all my town ratings are appalling because there's no way to provide rail service without putting in some major infrastructure.

Anything else would be eyecandy - but welcome, for example, steam trucks or traction engines + trailers

GRVTS is really nice by the way, completely changes for the better the use of road vehicles in the game.
Last edited by andythenorth on 09 Jun 2008 18:02, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Generic Road Vehicle Set [Complete]

Post by DanMacK »

I've drawn model T trucks for a set Pikka and I have been working on, they're just not coded yet. Also on the list of to-do's is horse wagons.
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