More diesel_smoke patch

Jango · Post by **Jango** » 08 Apr 2006 22:49

is there any harm having a moderate version (x2?) of this added to trunk?

openttd will progress much quicker if little features and gui improvements (for example) can be added quickly without too much fuss.

SirkoZ · Post by **SirkoZ** » 08 Apr 2006 22:54

No... If developers don't add patches made by the players, no matter how good, they don't get into "trunk".

BTW - why only x2? It's configurable, so you can have all 3 variations. Besides - it's all the same equation with 0 or 1 or 2 being the 2^n with which smoke densities are divided.

Jango · Post by **Jango** » 10 Apr 2006 08:48

only because otherwise it becomes "YAPO" - yet another patch option. Sometimes the wealth of options is just annoying to the end user. It needs the programmer to choose something generally acceptable in the case of a non-important patch like this

SirkoZ · Post by **SirkoZ** » 10 Apr 2006 12:30

Jango wrote:only because otherwise it becomes "YAPO" - yet another patch option. Sometimes the wealth of options is just annoying to the end user. It needs the programmer to choose something generally acceptable in the case of a non-important patch like this

Look now - stop bothering me with your unimportant requests - if you like current setting of non-smoke, just use it, without the patch, ok?

P.S.: In other, more gentle words - the whole idea of this patch is to have a lot of smoke (not too much though) for a diesel train, that carries long, heavy load. Have you seen any such trains in real life, Jango? Because one of such, here, on the sunny side of Alps, was the inspiration for this patch.

And please, don't tick me off with your forcedly thrown together abbreviations.

Jango · Post by **Jango** » 10 Apr 2006 15:19

SirkoZ wrote:
Jango wrote:only because otherwise it becomes "YAPO" - yet another patch option. Sometimes the wealth of options is just annoying to the end user. It needs the programmer to choose something generally acceptable in the case of a non-important patch like this
Look now - stop bothering me with your unimportant requests - if you like current setting of non-smoke, just use it, without the patch, ok?

P.S.: In other, more gentle words - the whole idea of this patch is to have a lot of smoke (not too much though) for a diesel train, that carries long, heavy load. Have you seen any such trains in real life, Jango? Because one of such, here, on the sunny side of Alps, was the inspiration for this patch.

And please, don't tick me off with your forcedly thrown together abbreviations.

actually this was an abbreviation which Celestar coined because he was realising that the patch option screen was becoming a mess of different options which didn't really need to be there.

I have no particular like or dislike of the use of the patch, and I was trying to support you in the sense that It'd be good to see this kind of patch in the main code. But in order to see patches become successfully integrated into the OpenTTD code, it becomes necessary to trim and to make idealogies consistent.

Your average user does not particularly want to be able to edit the amount of smoke generated, but that does not mean that the amount of smoke generated shouldn't be more realistic. - i suspect that we may have got our wires crossed, i was not saying that you shouldn't produce the patch, i was saying that allowing the user to adjust the amount of smoke shouldn't be necessary.

SirkoZ · Post by **SirkoZ** » 10 Apr 2006 16:34

Ok, all nice and all, but why can one not chose all kinds of different settings?
I'm sorry, but in this case you, Jango, and maybe also celestar are talking in favor of all the people, that just go around anything bumping around without actually reading the obvious and available "writing on the wall".

Sure, I can make 2 (the least) the default settings or even remove configurability, but I think - why would it not be possible to tweak the gane for maximum enjoyement. OpenTTD could therefore have a subsection with sliders, so "infinite" number of more exotic patch settings can be put there which some will appreciate a lot...

White Rabbit · Post by **White Rabbit** » 10 May 2006 21:47

Why not have even more options for longer steam trails and more frequent puffs, like TTDP? While there's a difference between steam/smoke generated by this patch and default OTTD, I still think there's not nearly enough of it, and the patch doesn't compare with the Patch, if you know what I mean...

Singaporekid · Post by **Singaporekid** » 11 May 2006 02:47

You could try changing the value in openttd.cfg

White Rabbit · Post by **White Rabbit** » 11 May 2006 07:16

Change it to what? I've got it set to 0 and increasing the value decreases the amount of smoke.

Singaporekid · Post by **Singaporekid** » 11 May 2006 07:30

White Rabbit wrote:Change it to what? I've got it set to 0 and increasing the value decreases the amount of smoke.

-1.
Holy crap that was easy

SirkoZ · Post by **SirkoZ** » 11 May 2006 16:14

White Rabbit wrote:Why not have even more options for longer steam trails and more frequent puffs, like TTDP? While there's a difference between steam/smoke generated by this patch and default OTTD, I still think there's not nearly enough of it, and the patch doesn't compare with the Patch, if you know what I mean...

Duelly noted.

White Rabbit · Post by **White Rabbit** » 11 May 2006 21:40

SirkoZ wrote: Duelly noted.

Hurry, and you can get it done before richk comes back!

Singaporekid wrote: -1.
Holy crap that was easy

Have you even tried your own solution? The minimal value of the smoke patch is 0. Values below that will be reset to 0.

SirkoZ · Post by **SirkoZ** » 12 May 2006 01:27

White Rabbit wrote:
SirkoZ wrote: Duelly noted.
Hurry, and you can get it done before richk comes back!

Yes...I think I might just get it on time.

Singaporekid · Post by **Singaporekid** » 12 May 2006 03:29

Of course I have.

White Rabbit · Post by **White Rabbit** » 12 May 2006 10:08

Singaporekid wrote:Of course I have.

Ok, I didn't think of the patch in the IN, since it's over a thousand revisions behind the latest mini IN and I'm no longer playing with it. The smoke patch I'm using is the one in the mini IN, and its minimal value is 0 both within OTTD's patch configuration window and in the .CFG file.

Changing the value to less than 0 will make OTTD automatically reset it to 0 when you run the game. Or are values below 0 supposed to be possible, Sirkoz?

SirkoZ · Post by **SirkoZ** » 12 May 2006 10:17

No, the possible values are 0, 1 and 2.

SirkoZ · Post by **SirkoZ** » 13 Dec 2006 20:22

Tis' the season, so after some 2000 revisions - here it is - my patch again synchronised with the nightly/source - revision 7490 (the Mini_IN update is not provided because the patch is already included there - if needed, PM me).

Post by **Rubidium** » 17 Jan 2007 15:00

Drawback of this patch is that this would make it a server-enforced variable, so a client cannot decrease the amount of smoke to make his/her client is less loaded.

It furthermore reduces the amount of vehicles you can have on a map, which can become a problem for network games.

SirkoZ · Post by **SirkoZ** » 17 Jan 2007 18:33

I see.
I must mention here, that I tried to play some of the OpenTTD COOP save games with around 1000 diesel/steam trains running at any time and it ran fine. How many vehicles does my patch "steal" from the array?

Is there any way to make the patch client-side?

Bjarni · Post by **Bjarni** » 17 Jan 2007 18:42

SirkoZ wrote:I see.
I must mention here, that I tried to play some of the OpenTTD COOP save games with around 1000 diesel/steam trains running at any time and it ran fine. How many vehicles does my patch "steal" from the array?

one for each steam/diesel cloud anywhere on the map.

SirkoZ wrote:Is there any way to make the patch client-side?

Yes, but you will not like this. You will need to split eyecandy effects from vehicles, that affects the game. Overloading the eyecandy one will not affect the game while overloading the vehicle will.

Say we got close to the limit of vehicles in a game. One player (A) got really intense smoke from his steam trains, so he takes up say 20 vehicle space for each locomotive. Another guy (B) only use 8 vehicle slots for each steam locomotive. Eventually B will build a new vehicle and the game will allow him to do so because it can find free vehicle slots. The same goes for the server, so they both build the new vehicle. A already used all his slots for steam and the game will fail to build the vehicle and now we got a game, where all clients will not have the same amount of vehicles in the game -> desync.

I really can't see any easy way out of this one and splitting the vehicles and the "eyecandy vehicles" is a massive job.

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