Use for 3D?

badmonkey · Post by **badmonkey** » 04 Feb 2006 01:25

I've been enjoying OTTD for a couple of months now and want to contribute something. Though I have done pixel graphics in the past (back in the SimCity days), I can't take their tedium anymore. Today, I do a lot of 3D modelling.

So, is there any decent use of 3D in the game? Perhaps using rendered images for the 32BPP portions? I'd like to get some opinions, desires and feedback before wasting time going into bad directions.

Thanks all.

Brianetta · Post by **Brianetta** » 04 Feb 2006 02:03

Just take a look around this forum. You should get a clear picture of where graphics are, and where they are heading. The blender thread is a good place to start.

Moriarty · Post by **Moriarty** » 04 Feb 2006 09:19

Maybe a summation for an entire 42 page thread would save some time. I know I've never bothered reading it all.

badmonkey: Try the "Artists Information (new and Experienced artists alike)" sticky (top of this board). Much easier reading

Brianetta · Post by **Brianetta** » 04 Feb 2006 12:08

Moriarty wrote:Maybe a summation for an entire 42 page thread would save some time. I know I've never bothered reading it all.

I skipped the middle twenty or so...

MeusH · Post by **MeusH** » 04 Feb 2006 16:55

Moriarty wrote:Maybe a summation for an entire 42 page thread would save some time. I know I've never bothered reading it all.

badmonkey: Try the "Artists Information (new and Experienced artists alike)" sticky (top of this board). Much easier reading

http://wiki.openttd.org > Graphics developement, maybye?

Sellu · Post by **Sellu** » 05 Feb 2006 19:31

Is there any concrete results in coding that 32 bit environment besides the menus?

MeusH · Post by **MeusH** » 05 Feb 2006 20:01

http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/32bpp

charlieg · Post by **charlieg** » 06 Feb 2006 11:20

I think there could be scope for adapting OpenTTD to use 3D way in the future, but that's way in the future and I would be surprised to see any 3D usage pre-1.0 release.

badmonkey · Post by **badmonkey** » 07 Feb 2006 06:48

Thanks for the answers everyone. I had been stabbing around with the search,but not getting very far. I'm still hunting down any kind of advice on building a rendering rig. I've been experimenting though, so if I come up with some rigs for ceartain square configurations (ie: 4x4, 2x1) I'll post them in a common 3D file format.

Alltaken · Post by **Alltaken** » 11 Feb 2006 08:04

what software do you use?

model to your software's grid lines, they are a standard size likely.

one tile in OTTD = 12.5mx12.5m = 2x2 grid units in your software.

if you don't use Blender, we will scale later before rendering.

Alltaken

badmonkey · Post by **badmonkey** » 11 Feb 2006 08:43

So the submitted files should just be meshes and not renders? I thinkg it's a good idea to unify the render for consistency. I take it jpeg is ok for texture mapping... then again, if we're using face coloring...

I've also been having trouble finding a target polycount (polys per square?). Do you have any idea what that should be?

Thanks for your help. I'm using Maya, BTW.

Crazy Vaclav · Post by **Crazy Vaclav** » 11 Feb 2006 08:53

badmonkey wrote: I've also been having trouble finding a target polycount (polys per square?). Do you have any idea what that should be?

Will this matter? I mean, as it is not actually 3d models that will be used in the game, but pictures of 3d models. Or have I gotten it all wrong?

badmonkey · Post by **badmonkey** » 11 Feb 2006 09:18

From what I understand, you got it right. Even for pre-rendered graphics, you should have a target polycount for consistancy though. Think of it as a target level of detail (LOD). I'm winging it currently at about 200/square for some three to four story buildings with minimal texture mapping, but mine are far from finished or even presentable product. I could bring it down using texture maps or I could use flat shading and crank it up. Some folks have posted early renders which has helped a lot.

Some renders I've seen:
http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... r&start=40
http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... &start=100
http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... &start=160
http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... &start=220
http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... ght=render
http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... ght=render

So far a lot of the tips and such mentioned in other threads have been good, but a lot of it is more game targeted than modeller targeted. I'd love to see a thread of tips and tricks that people have been using so far in their 3D software of choice. There's proably some buried in many threads that I haven't found using the search tool yet.

Better yet, after some experience at it, I hope to contribute to the wiki (which needs much love currently).

Red*Star · Post by **Red*Star** » 11 Feb 2006 10:35

Nothing against thinking about LOD, but is in the OTTD case LOD ~ polycount?
Imagine spherical fuel tanks: A sphere needs much more polygons to look like a sphere than a cube or prism, and in OTTD many houses and other meshes use these geometrical objects as base objects.

Alltaken · Post by **Alltaken** » 11 Feb 2006 12:17

The detail level needs to be "great looking" when 12.5m x 12.5 meters equals these sizes (64,128,256 pixels wide). NO POLYCOUNT. use any polygons you want to use.

Disclaimer: the edges of these tiles are incorrect, and should not be used as templates

it should not be "more" detailed, unless you wish to waste time, and it should not be less detailed than 256 if you wish your graphics to be scalable upwards beyond 64 pixels wide.

currently the game only goes up to 64 pixels wide, however we are intending the scale of buildings to be refactored (zoomed in more) thus we think 256 pixels wide being the maximum zoom level, will be more than sufficient.

I will update the artist information accordingly.

Alltaken

badmonkey · Post by **badmonkey** » 11 Feb 2006 21:46

My question for LOD stemmed from the idea of doing a unified render of the files. Thus it's really a matter of what kind of files will eventually be submitted (submitting meshes and not images). As you can see, my thinking comes from a purely 3D content realm (first person shooters, RTS). It's been some work getting my mind back into the 2D pre-rendered way of doing things. Thanks for your patience and info during the learning curve.

From what I now understand, it looks like we'll be submitting blend files. Is that right?

Red*Star · Post by **Red*Star** » 11 Feb 2006 22:47

Yupp.

(Maybe it's also possible to do creating 3D stuff under another app than blender and then export dxf-files which a blender user can then import and texturize. At least I hope so, because I'm working with 3DSMax.)

badmonkey · Post by **badmonkey** » 12 Feb 2006 06:20

You could use MD3 or MD5 (id/quake formats) as an intermediate format. Export MD5 modes (with textures) which Blender can import. I would suggest MD3 to avoid all of that skeleton rigging in MD5. You can grab Max exporters at http://www.quake3bits.com/htm/tools_utilities.htm.

Alltaken · Post by **Alltaken** » 12 Feb 2006 09:27

OBJ import and Export (if your software supports it properly) is actually the best way to do-so.

Blender imports OBJ very very well, this format includes textures that are UV mapped.

Alltaken

Red*Star · Post by **Red*Star** » 14 Feb 2006 17:19

I've looked recently, but unfortunately my version of 3D Studio Max (it's the 5.0) cannot export to obj files. So I am really overthinking if I currently feel to get involved into a maybe bothering because of not working import-export sessions *rolleyes*...

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