Questions related to the English master strings

[Joel A]

Actually I only have one question for now, but since I searched for an umbrella topic for all things master strings and couldn't find one (if there already is one after all, please direct me to it) I decided to create one myself. Feel free to re-use it if you have other questions of this kind, that's what it's for.

In my efforts to help make the Swedish translation complete I came across the following:

STR_CONFIG_SETTING_TRAIN_REVERSING
Disallow train reversing in stations: {STRING}

STR_CONFIG_SETTING_TRAIN_REVERSING_HELPTEXT
If enabled trains will not reverse in non-terminus stations, if there is a shorter path to their next destination when reversing

To me, it seems there's at least one word (and a comma) missing in the helptext, interpreting it like this: "If enabled, trains will not reverse in non-terminus stations, even if there is a shorter path to their next destination when reversing".
Otherwise, if the string is good as it is, what happens if the path to their next destination isn't shorter when reversing? They will reverse anyway?

[planetmaker]

If reversing trains is disallowed, they won't reverse ever (in stations), unless they hit the end of a line or waited too long in front of a red signal.

I think the addition of 'even' as you suggest might indeed improve the English original string, thanks for that suggestion.

[Joel A]

1. Should currencies really start with a capital letter in English? The Wikipedia Manual of Style (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia: ... Currencies) states that they should not, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's right. The websites Google Finance, Yahoo! Finance, XE.com and OANDA.com have them capitalized while fxtop.com and Oxford Dictionaries (http://oxforddictionaries.com/definitio ... n_english/) haven't.

2. Regardless, in my opinion all currencies should be written either in singular or plural: currently the STR_GAME_OPTIONS_CURRENCY strings for Russian Rubles (RUR) and Estonian Krooni (EKK) are in plural, while all the others are in singular. RUR and EKK in singular would be Russian ruble and Estonian kroon respectively. (On a side note, apparently RUR refers to the Russian ruble before the 1998 redenomination, and its current ISO 4217 code is RUB (1 RUB = 1000 RUR). I guess the strings should reflect the present situation, even though I assume most people start their games long before 1998).

[Dave]

I always refer to euros and dollars, and I'm a native English speaker. But that doesn't mean that's right either.

[oberhümer]

As another native English speaker, I'd say the in-game currency names should be non-capitalized and singular. Non-capitalized because they're not proper nouns*, and singular because they refer to the currency as such, not to a definite or indefinite amount of units of that currency.

*This part is shaky. It could be argued that references to the currency itself (as a unique item) should be capitalized as opposed to referring to a non-unique single unit of currency, but no need to overcomplicate.

[GunChleoc]

I have another question:

STR_LAND_AREA_INFORMATION_BUILD_DATE
{BLACK}Built: {LTBLUE}{DATE_LONG}

I need to mark gender in this, but there doesn't seem to be anything to tie the gender to. Is translating according to gender possible at all with this string?

If not, what is the thing having been built? I might get lucky and have all the things possibly built and referred to in this string share the same gender by coincidence.

[planetmaker]

I have another question:

STR_LAND_AREA_INFORMATION_BUILD_DATE
{BLACK}Built: {LTBLUE}{DATE_LONG}

I need to mark gender in this, but there doesn't seem to be anything to tie the gender to. Is translating according to gender possible at all with this string?

If not, what is the thing having been built? I might get lucky and have all the things possibly built and referred to in this string share the same gender by coincidence.

Gender is not possible there as no string containing gender follows. It's used when showing info on construction date of stations and depots for all vehicle types.

[Eddi]

can you give an example string where you think gender would be needed there?

[TERdON]

can you give an example string where you think gender would be needed there?

There is an implicit reference to whatever it was that is built, will have effects in languages doing adjective declinations.

E.g. in Swedish
"Byggt" (for a vehicle "ett fordon") "Byggt" (for a train "ett tåg") "byggd" (for a station "en station") "byggda" (plural)

[GunChleoc]

Exactly!

The string I am working on:

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{BLACK}Built: {LTBLUE}{DATE_LONG}

Masculine (e.g. a station was built):
{BLACK}Air a thogail: {LTBLUE}{DATE_LONG}

Feminine (e.g. a tree was built):
{BLACK}Air a togail: {LTBLUE}{DATE_LONG}

So, if I knew which objects this string possibly refers to, maybe I'll get lucky and there will be no feminine words.

[Eddi]

ok, a possible (but very elaborate) solution would involve "cases", but it will involve code changes, not just translation changes

instead of one string

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STR_BUILT :built: {DATE}

you introduce multiple strings:

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STR_BUILT :built: {DATE}
STR_TREE_BUILT:{STRING}
STR_STATION_BUILT:{STRING}

and in your translation you then use cases:

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STR_BUILT.masculine :Air a thogail: {date}
STR_BUILT.feminine :Air a togail: {date}
STR_TREE_BUILT :{STRING.feminine}
STR_STATION_BUILT :{STRING.masculine}

(i did not doublecheck the syntax, but it was something along those lines)

the code would have to be changed to use the STR_<whatever>_BUILT for each tile type then, which you'd have to discuss with a developer, whether that is a sensible change (should not be that difficult, as long as there is a string for every tile type the string-id can be calculated instead of given explicitly).

[GunChleoc]

Wouldn't it be simpler to just have something like:

Code: Select all

STR_TREE_BUILT: Built: {date}
STR_STATION_BUILT:  Built: {date}

Since we would have 1 string per item, it is already clear which item it is, and gender can be assigned to the phrase directly:

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STR_TREE_BUILT: Air a togail: {date}
STR_STATION_BUILT:  Air a thogail: {date}

===================================

On another note, here is a string I don't understand out of context:

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{WHITE}It changed powered-wagon state for '{1:ENGINE}' when not inside a depot

The German translation makes more sense and I'll take it from there, but maybe the string should be revisited and changed to something that is more clear?

===================================

And I have a problem with this string:

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STR_DEPOT_RENAME_TOOLTIP: {BLACK}Change name of depot
STR_DEPOT_RENAME_DEPOT_CAPTION: Rename depot

Is this a road vehicle or a train depot? I don't have an umbrella term in my language to cover both.

[planetmaker]

Wouldn't it be simpler to just have something like:

Code: Select all

STR_TREE_BUILT: Built: {date}
STR_STATION_BUILT:  Built: {date}

Since we would have 1 string per item, it is already clear which item it is, and gender can be assigned to the phrase directly:

Code: Select all

STR_TREE_BUILT: Air a togail: {date}
STR_STATION_BUILT:  Air a thogail: {date}

Both is actually feasible within the framework given. But Eddi's suggestion allows to easier change it by only addressing two strings.

On another note, here is a string I don't understand out of context:

Code: Select all

{WHITE}It changed powered-wagon state for '{1:ENGINE}' when not inside a depot

The German translation makes more sense and I'll take it from there, but maybe the string should be revisited and changed to something that is more clear?

the string name itself, which you omitted, gives the context; it will be shown in a red error box upon loading a savegame. Also, the English string should not be changed really as the technical term powered-wagon state" used in NewGRF development should remain cited correctly. It's something which nearly necessarily dilutes a bit in a translation; thus I chose to make it such that it's less technical and better generally understood in the German translation.

Code: Select all

STR_DEPOT_RENAME_TOOLTIP: {BLACK}Change name of depot
STR_DEPOT_RENAME_DEPOT_CAPTION: Rename depot

Is this a road vehicle or a train depot? I don't have an umbrella term in my language to cover both.

It can relate to any kind of depot, road or rail, ship yard or aircraft hangar (do the buttons for ship yard or aircraft hangar exist?)

Generally, it often helps to search for the string's name in the source code. It will tell you most often where it's being utilized - I think also when you don't programme yourself.

[GunChleoc]

On another note, here is a string I don't understand out of context:

Code: Select all

{WHITE}It changed powered-wagon state for '{1:ENGINE}' when not inside a depot

The German translation makes more sense and I'll take it from there, but maybe the string should be revisited and changed to something that is more clear?

the string name itself, which you omitted, gives the context; it will be shown in a red error box upon loading a savegame. Also, the English string should not be changed really as the technical term powered-wagon state" used in NewGRF development should remain cited correctly. It's something which nearly necessarily dilutes a bit in a translation; thus I chose to make it such that it's less technical and better generally understood in the German translation.

My problem here actually isn't with "powered-wagon state", but with "It changed". What does the "it" refer to? The German translation has "Changes", which is more clear.

Code: Select all

STR_DEPOT_RENAME_TOOLTIP: {BLACK}Change name of depot
STR_DEPOT_RENAME_DEPOT_CAPTION: Rename depot

Is this a road vehicle or a train depot? I don't have an umbrella term in my language to cover both.

It can relate to any kind of depot, road or rail, ship yard or aircraft hangar (do the buttons for ship yard or aircraft hangar exist?)

Generally, it often helps to search for the string's name in the source code. It will tell you most often where it's being utilized - I think also when you don't programme yourself.

Is it possible to split these into separate strings? The way it is now, any translation I can make is a bit awkward.

[GunChleoc]

On another note, here is a string I don't understand out of context:

Code: Select all

{WHITE}It changed powered-wagon state for '{1:ENGINE}' when not inside a depot

The German translation makes more sense and I'll take it from there, but maybe the string should be revisited and changed to something that is more clear?

the string name itself, which you omitted, gives the context; it will be shown in a red error box upon loading a savegame. Also, the English string should not be changed really as the technical term powered-wagon state" used in NewGRF development should remain cited correctly. It's something which nearly necessarily dilutes a bit in a translation; thus I chose to make it such that it's less technical and better generally understood in the German translation.

My problem here actually isn't with "powered-wagon state", but with "It changed". What does the "it" refer to? The German translation has "Changes", which is more clear.

Code: Select all

STR_DEPOT_RENAME_TOOLTIP: {BLACK}Change name of depot
STR_DEPOT_RENAME_DEPOT_CAPTION: Rename depot

Is this a road vehicle or a train depot? I don't have an umbrella term in my language to cover both.

It can relate to any kind of depot, road or rail, ship yard or aircraft hangar (do the buttons for ship yard or aircraft hangar exist?)

Generally, it often helps to search for the string's name in the source code. It will tell you most often where it's being utilized - I think also when you don't programme yourself.

Is it possible to split these into separate strings? The way it is now, any translation I can make is a bit awkward.

Speaking of which, these strings:

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STR_NEWGRF_BROKEN_POWERED_WAGON :{WHITE}It changed powered-wagon state for '{1:ENGINE}' when not inside a depot
STR_NEWGRF_BROKEN_VEHICLE_LENGTH :{WHITE}It changed vehicle length for '{1:ENGINE}' when not inside a depot

sound like they are for trains only. Am I assuming correctly?

[planetmaker]

Code: Select all

STR_NEWGRF_BROKEN_POWERED_WAGON :{WHITE}It changed powered-wagon state for '{1:ENGINE}' when not inside a depot
STR_NEWGRF_BROKEN_VEHICLE_LENGTH :{WHITE}It changed vehicle length for '{1:ENGINE}' when not inside a depot

sound like they are for trains only. Am I assuming correctly?

The "it" refers to the NewGRF causing the error and behaving faulty.

The first string can only appear for a train, the illegal length change could also occur for road vehicles.

[Eddi]

Wouldn't it be simpler to just have something like:

Code: Select all

STR_TREE_BUILT: Built: {date}
STR_STATION_BUILT:  Built: {date}

Since we would have 1 string per item, it is already clear which item it is, and gender can be assigned to the phrase directly:

Code: Select all

STR_TREE_BUILT: Air a togail: {date}
STR_STATION_BUILT:  Air a thogail: {date}

well, the idea was that the "Built: " text appears only once in the language file, so it's easier to change/translate. In general, copy-pasting the same string 14 times to have a string for every tile type is something you want to avoid in programming.

[GunChleoc]

Thanks for all your answers!

I agree, both not reduplicating code and not having to translate the same thing umpteen times is generally a good idea. Languages can sometimes throw a spanner in the works though

ETA: Bug in source string?

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STR_ERROR_TOO_MANY_BUS_STOPS : {WHITE}Too many bus stops

It's called "Bus station" everywhere else. Should the string be changed?

ETA: found two more: STR_ERROR_DRIVE_THROUGH_CORNER, STR_ERROR_DRIVE_THROUGH_JUNCTION

[GunChleoc]

I have another question regarding one of the new strings.

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STR_CONFIG_SETTING_DEMAND_SIZE_HELPTEXT
Setting this to less than 100% makes the symmetric distribution behave more like the asymmetric one. Less cargo will be forcibly sent back if a certain amount is sent to a station. If you set it to 0% the symmetric distribution behaves just like the asymmetric one.

I do not understand the second string - when does cargo get sent back?

[FLHerne]

I have another question regarding one of the new strings.

STR_CONFIG_SETTING_DEMAND_SIZE_HELPTEXT
Setting this to less than 100% makes the symmetric distribution behave more like the asymmetric one. Less cargo will be forcibly sent back if a certain amount is sent to a station. If you set it to 0% the symmetric distribution behaves just like the asymmetric one.

I do not understand the second string - when does cargo get sent back?

When a cargo is set as 'symmetric' - usually passengers and mail - a station that produces that cargo will always have an amount sent back to it from other stations.
E.g. you send some mail from point A to point B, the cargo-routing thing is then forced to send at least [some ratio] of that amount to A from other places.

@devs: Is that right? If not, could you explain how it really works?