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 Post subject: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 5:13 pm 
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Engineer
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Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:22 pm
Posts: 7
We badly need diagonal roads! They would be damn awesome! Who's with me? Shouldn't be hard to make 'em considering there's already the diagonal rail, right? :rolleyes:


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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 5:19 pm 
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Tycoon
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Posts: 7199
one would assume that everything that is "not hard" would actually have been done in the past 5 years...

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 5:24 pm 
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Tycoon
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Zvezda wrote:
Shouldn't be hard to make 'em

I'm looking forward to your patch to that extent. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 5:36 pm 
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Tycoon
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FooBar wrote:
Zvezda wrote:
Shouldn't be hard to make 'em

I'm looking forward to your patch to that extent. ;)

Yeah, me too. 5 days from now seems reasonable, what say you FooBar?

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 5:51 pm 
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Engineer
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Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:22 pm
Posts: 7
Not being a programmer i don't know how much time it would take, but if there's diagonal rails, why not diagonal roads?


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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 5:55 pm 
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Tycoon
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Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 7:09 am
Posts: 5237
Zvezda wrote:
Not being a programmer i don't know how much time it would take, but if there's diagonal rails, why not diagonal roads?


Former United States Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld wrote:
There are known knowns; there are things we know we know.
We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know.
But there are also unknown unknowns – there are things we do not know we don't know. ”

regards
Michael

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 6:03 pm 
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Tycoon
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Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2009 7:25 pm
Posts: 2619
Location: Kent
Another person incapable of using the search function...

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 6:21 pm 
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Engineer
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Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:22 pm
Posts: 7
Leanden wrote:
Another person incapable of using the search function...


Problem?


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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:29 pm 
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OpenTTD Developer
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Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2007 5:03 am
Posts: 4677
Location: home
Quote:
Problem ?
Only that you are not the first with this request by a long shot, and if you tried searching you'd have known a bit more about why it does not exist yet.

@Hyronymus: I feel generous, he's new here, let's make it 2 weeks. Should be sufficient.


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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:32 pm 
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Tycoon
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Skype: XeryusTC
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Actually, there is an ancient patch for it out there. You just have to like playing with a revision that is over 3 years old ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:34 pm 
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Tycoon
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Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2009 6:36 pm
Posts: 2379
Location: Alberta, Canada
Come on guys, this is easy. As Zvedza says, there are diagonal rails. There are diagonal statio.. oh. There are diagonal tunne... oh. There are diagonal airpor.. oh. Maybe we should all just turn our chairs and monitors diagonally, that'll be fine.

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:36 pm 
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OpenTTD Developer
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Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 9:21 am
Posts: 1303
Zvezda wrote:
Leanden wrote:
Another person incapable of using the search function...


Problem?


Although a misplaced remark of him (what is the use of "bashing" a new user, and second-hand moderator is not really allowed on this forum), what he is trying to say is that a search on the forum would have given you a few hits that might interest you:

From 2004 I bring you: viewtopic.php?f=29&t=7104
From 2008 I bring you: viewtopic.php?f=32&t=40585
From 2011 I bring you: viewtopic.php?f=33&t=56411 (half-way there is some talk about diagonal roads)

Another word of the wise: don't walk around too much with words like "shouldnt be too hard". If you don't know how a system works, sure, it is easy to think. And I understand your thinking in this. But it is always better to ask: "would this be hard?", then to state: "shouldnt be too hard". It is mostly received as offending by the people who do know it is hard. Just my 2 penny ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:39 pm 
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Tycoon
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Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:49 pm
Posts: 3653
SwissFan91 wrote:


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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:40 pm 
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Tycoon
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Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:14 am
Posts: 7199
Yexo wrote:
SwissFan91 wrote:

and this is in trunk because it's so easy :p

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:45 pm 
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Tycoon
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Joined: Mon Dec 28, 2009 9:47 am
Posts: 11104
Location: Rijeka, Croatia
Zvezda wrote:
Leanden wrote:
Another person incapable of using the search function...

Problem?


I think Leanden was referring to that idiot Donald Rumsfeld... :lol:

michael blunck wrote:
Zvezda wrote:
Not being a programmer i don't know how much time it would take, but if there's diagonal rails, why not diagonal roads?


Former United States Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld wrote:
There are known knowns; there are things we know we know.
We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know.
But there are also unknown unknowns – there are things we do not know we don't know. ”

regards
Michael

_________________
Leon

Image Image Image Image
"... all I ask is a tall ship and a star to steer her by..." - John Masefield


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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:48 pm 
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Tycoon
Tycoon

Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2011 6:34 pm
Posts: 2655
Leanden wrote:
Another person incapable of using the search function...


Let's be honest, the forum search is not the best search there is. Even I am incapable of using the default search function, but luckily Google helps me find what I want to find.

On topic: While it would be nice, it is not just something you make. The coding part already has been said that it will not be easy, but also the part before coding is not going to be easy I think. Things like speed on diagonal roads, how to handle diagonal roads sharing a tile with diagonal tracks (allow/disallow?), level crossings with diagonal tracks, diagonal crossings with other roads. All those things have to be considered even before any coding is done. And those aren't simple Yes/No questions, allowing for example level crossings with tracks, someone needs to provide graphics for those crossings. And all NewGRFs that change the look of level crossings also have to be updated, and are their authors still active and willing to do that?

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 8:25 pm 
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Tycoon
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Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 2:23 pm
Posts: 4707
Location: Lost in Music
It's not a question of 'hard'. It can't actually be done in a sane way. Rubidium pointed out why to me recently; the issue was obvious in hindsight, and I felt a little stupid. :)

There will be prizes for the first person who figures it out (other than Rubidium). It's not a coding issue, it's a graphics / use of tiles issue.

A clue is: 2 would need 4.

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 8:39 pm 
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OpenTTD Developer
OpenTTD Developer

Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 9:21 am
Posts: 1303
Nothing that can't be solved:

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 8:51 pm 
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Tycoon
Tycoon

Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 12:14 am
Posts: 7199
imho the game plan should be:
  1. finalize airport state machine specs
  2. extend the implementation of the state machines to handle articulated vehicles, and allow setting entry points/directions into the state machine.
  3. specify a "follow track" callback to hook into the pathfinder, e.g. getting a pair of entry/exit points, and returning a penalty
  4. merge "new objects" and "state machines" into a new class "traffic objects"
  5. implement diagonal roads, highways, two-lane roads with embedded tram, potentially double track rails as traffic object newgrfs

optionally, make objects draggable in X/Y/diagonal/area/other direction by a newgrf property.


each of these steps individually should already be considered "hard"...

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 Post subject: Re: Diagonal roads!
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 8:53 pm 
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Tycoon
Tycoon

Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:49 pm
Posts: 3653
Eddi wrote:
[list=1][*]finalize airport state machine specs
There were some plans to automatically generate the holding pattern (also for existing airports). This should be done first


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