RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
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RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Since r1800, with experimentalfeatures.railvehmenu on you can now reverse a engine or wagon * and refit a vehicle consist or a wagon consist starting at a offset. As wagons generally aren't allowed to be reversed the result may vary and may not be fixable.
To open the rail vehicle menu, Ctrl-Click on an engine or wagon
(Note: experimentalfeatures engineconvert uses Ctrl-Drag and works too)
The third buttom may be used later with some kind of user controllable livery change, suggestion how a callback randombit function could work are welcome.
*articulated vehicles aren't supported
Happy Christmas
To open the rail vehicle menu, Ctrl-Click on an engine or wagon
(Note: experimentalfeatures engineconvert uses Ctrl-Drag and works too)
The third buttom may be used later with some kind of user controllable livery change, suggestion how a callback randombit function could work are welcome.
*articulated vehicles aren't supported
Happy Christmas
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
On IRC you mention you'd had some issues with my drawing code, anything I could help try and solve?
If my memory is right, the offsets used for the drawing code were only designed to account for one direction, and the offsets of the other direction with shortened vehicles is usually quite different which may be the issue you were talking about.
~ Lakie
If my memory is right, the offsets used for the drawing code were only designed to account for one direction, and the offsets of the other direction with shortened vehicles is usually quite different which may be the issue you were talking about.
~ Lakie
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Hi there Oskar! May i ask why articulated vehicles wont work? Is it a similar problem to the normal dead-end stuff?eis_os wrote:*articulated vehicles aren't supported
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Taking a guess here, but is it to do with the tender and loco being flipped individually but not the order changed (think about it and it makes sense).
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
OTOH, there are more articulated vehicles than just steamers with tenders.Ameecher wrote:[...] tender and loco being flipped individually
regards
Michael
Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Merry Christmas to Oskar with a big Thank You!
What if it could be coded as an engine?
In the image below, the reason the snowplow can be in the lead is because it is coded as an engine.
Now, what if that diesel had a steamer graphic and the snowplow had a tender graphic?
Would that work?
The only problem that I can see is that the steamer (diesel in the png) and the tender (plow in the png) could not exchange positions.
I think the image below demonstrates what Oskar means ...eis_os wrote:As wagons generally aren't allowed to be reversed the result may vary and may not be fixable.
Is this because the trailer part of the articulated vehicle is not an engine?articulated vehicles aren't supported
What if it could be coded as an engine?
In the image below, the reason the snowplow can be in the lead is because it is coded as an engine.
Now, what if that diesel had a steamer graphic and the snowplow had a tender graphic?
Would that work?
The only problem that I can see is that the steamer (diesel in the png) and the tender (plow in the png) could not exchange positions.
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
[flipping wagons]
[articulated engines]
regards
Michael
That´s because those wagons are not symmetric, i.e. they have different offsets in x depending on direction of travel.wallyweb wrote:I think the image below demonstrates what Oskar means
[articulated engines]
Yes. Only the first vehicle in a consist is an "engine" (TTD-wise). In consequence, flipping an articulated engine would need re-arrangement of the engine´s parts in exactly the way we do it already (manually) for that "travelling backward" feature.Is this because the trailer part of the articulated vehicle is not an engine?
regards
Michael
Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Actually there are more problems, a front engine can't be reversed as articulated vehicle because, well we share the state information with .currorderidx. This wasn't the best decision.
http://svn.ttdpatch.net/trac/browser/trunk/inc/veh.inc
This means you always have to guess if a engine belongs to a articulated vehicle, and the reversing is very problematical. I guess the system needs to be changed or the whole vehicle concept...
The question how to make the wagon symmetric again... (This may help to not break trains with very short vehicles as well)
http://svn.ttdpatch.net/trac/browser/trunk/inc/veh.inc
This means you always have to guess if a engine belongs to a articulated vehicle, and the reversing is very problematical. I guess the system needs to be changed or the whole vehicle concept...
The question how to make the wagon symmetric again... (This may help to not break trains with very short vehicles as well)
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Same here: Lots of thanks and very best regards!wallyweb wrote:Merry Christmas to Oskar with a big Thank You!
Carlo
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
interesting stuff.
as usual from you Oskar Best Regards and Merry Christmas to you.
as usual from you Oskar Best Regards and Merry Christmas to you.
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
No GRF Author any opinion about restyling livery change callback ideas? Odd...
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
No opinion, but great work, Oskar, as always
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
You'll need to wait until after Xmas ... we are rather busy at our end ...eis_os wrote:No GRF Author any opinion about restyling livery change callback ideas? Odd...
Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Patience. I haven't had a chance to reply before now.eis_os wrote:No GRF Author any opinion about restyling livery change callback ideas? Odd...
"Vehicle trigger 5: User requested re-randomization of random bits."
If you intend to allow user-re-randomization for all features, it might be better to use trigger 6 for all features. This definition would consume the final station trigger, so we should consider something to provide space for more trigger bits. An extended byte might be the answer, or introducing types 84/87 with some different format. Extended-byte causes some nastyness with bit 7; it would basically have to remain bit 7 in either byte or word mode, but this means that it's now smack in the middle of the trigger space, instead of off at one end.
OTOH, I don't know how hard it is to add a new action 2 type, and that seems to be the other option.
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Well, veh.newrandom can only hold 8bits anyway, so extended byte may not be that usefully anyway. The real question is, will there actually be any need for wasting a bit for such a feature. Long time ago such an button was requested. (The partly and wagon refit as well) as the style of building trains is completely different then in the past it may not be necessary now...
So at least a general reply, whether such a feature would be desirable...
Ohh, and I talk about rail vehicles, I don't think it would be good to let users let their road vehicles drive backwards...
So at least a general reply, whether such a feature would be desirable...
Ohh, and I talk about rail vehicles, I don't think it would be good to let users let their road vehicles drive backwards...
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Well. For my own work (german, austrian, swiss engines), I don´t need an explicit way for a livery change. This will be done "automagically" by coupling correct coaches during the proper time frame.
OTOH, I know that PikkaBird has introduced something like a "mock cargo" to help with engine refitting. Maybe this wouldn´t be needed any longer if you´ll introduce some means to change liveries explicitly.
regards
Michael
OTOH, I know that PikkaBird has introduced something like a "mock cargo" to help with engine refitting. Maybe this wouldn´t be needed any longer if you´ll introduce some means to change liveries explicitly.
regards
Michael
Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Being able to flip a lead engine is nice. It would be nicer to be able to flip an articulated engine (steamer + tender) too. Partial refits are just as easily handled by first dropping the wagons not to be refitted to another line in the depot window. Reversing the wagons is really cool. It would be even better if the coders could be given something to hook onto so that they can compensate for the alignment issues. Maybe then they could also give us trains that can reverse on their own at the end of a line while preserving the order of the consist too.eis_os wrote:So at least a general reply, whether such a feature would be desirable...
I agree ... We already have enough problems with articulated RV's that need to be fixed first. Mountain handling is just one small part ... there is trailer refitting too.Ohh, and I talk about rail vehicles, I don't think it would be good to let users let their road vehicles drive backwards...
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Note: I am not talking about removing the menu complete. About reversing I already have written the why you can't do it with articulated engines.
You couldn't refit a wagon without an engine yet, so you had the buy say 3 wagons, refit them, move them, buy the next 3 and then refit them and build together the whole thing.
A wagon can't currently be the front engine.
A vehicle array rewrite is the only real solution...
You couldn't refit a wagon without an engine yet, so you had the buy say 3 wagons, refit them, move them, buy the next 3 and then refit them and build together the whole thing.
A wagon can't currently be the front engine.
A vehicle array rewrite is the only real solution...
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Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
Yes, I understand. But honestly, who would refit a wagon w/o an engine to couple it to? OTOH, being able to refit, say 6 identical wagons, three of them to cargo "A" and the others to "B" would be simplified a bit with your proposal.eis_os wrote: [...] You couldn't refit a wagon without an engine yet, so you had the buy say 3 wagons, refit them, move them, buy the next 3 and then refit them and build together the whole thing.
OTOH, there aren´t much identical wagons in most sets to be able to refit them in this way. E.g., in DBXL for a mixed grain/livestock train you´ll need two different wagons anyhow.
regards
Michael
Re: RailVehMenu: Reverse the front and partly refit in depot
I haven't looked at DBXL in a while, but in many of the other sets I've used, box cars are refitable to most available cargoes which is important in the early years when more specialized wagons are not available yet. So, I can easily have a train with 10 box cars, all with the same livery, with 3 x goods, 2 x grain, 4 x wood, 1 x paper.michael blunck wrote:OTOH, there aren´t much identical wagons in most sets to be able to refit them in this way. E.g., in DBXL for a mixed grain/livestock train you´ll need two different wagons anyhow.
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