[OTTD] Hamburg scenario 2048x2048 Development thread

[Argus]

So I finally gave up and started generating random industry with the idea of deleting it later. I would have to set up a location for free and I don't want that.

[ebla71]

I guess I didn't notice this missing object last time.

This is supposed to be the "Patos Island Ferry" from the "Auz Airport and Boating Objects" NewGRF.

Strangely, in my setup, it still shows up correctly?!?

[ebla71]

Here, without much further ado, the latest version of the scenario v0.71

Tried to fix all the street types that got messed up (thanks to Argus for looking at this with argus eyes ) and worked a little bit further on the "decoration" but pretty much complete now - or at least I definitely want to play this scenario now after working on it since mid-December 2022

Will possibly start to manually place industries next week, so last chance to suggest modifications before it will be "locked" to XIS

[ebla71]

Couldn't resist, so started to place industries

There should already be some working chains, for example fishing grounds on the Elbe river to fishing harbour to hotels in Hamburg city center.

Also some agricultural industries to abattoir and to famous Astra brewery of St. Pauli as well as the abundant fruit plantations in the "Altes Land" to food processing plant.

Some others do not have either the supplying or receiving end yet, like dregging sites and quarries but these will follow later.

So far almost exclusively focused on the southern side of the Elbe river.

Changed the starting year to 1900 to make sure there are vehicles available. With Polroad please note that these are often set to passenger as default, so you might get an error message that "station in not reachable", in which case you first need to change the freight while in depot to something non-passenger, then you can also add goods stations to the schedule.

Industry set is XIS and all industries are "locked", meaning that they will neither close but also no new ones appear. Furthermore, the industry placement is guided by real-world locations, not attempt was made than connections are indeed economically viable.

Just allow yourself unlimited credit with the "special menue" and also regularly "rewind time" since distances are pretty long.

The scenario is mostly aimed at building a real-world network, not beating an economic model or racing against time. You can do that if you like, but you'll need to adjust the game yourself and also please don't ask me for such modifications, as I am simply not interested in that.

[ebla71]

Placed a lot of industries to the Hamburg scenario during the weekend, which is now in version v0.91

As you can see, there are mostly agricultural industries in the periphery and heavy industries in the harbour area, which calls for use of ships

Many industry chains have evolved now, for example the copper- and zinc-based industries. Note that since there are no mines in the area, everything is either fed by port industries or recycling material such as scrap metal.

Next will be the iron- and aluminium-based chains and finally the chemical ones, which are a bit complex, so needs a lot of checking that all chains can run through completely.

Not sure if I need to mention again, but industry set in XIS with no open/no close/no fund - just play with what's there and I'm sure it will still keep you busy for ages

[Argus]

The availability of vehicles was already there before, I had no problem with it, I liked the early start more.
But okay, I understand, let's go out a little to accommodate those who don't like such early times
Navíc, některý průmysl, který jsi tam dal, je pravděpodobně opravdu až z okolí roku 1900
But could you please release a version where you keep the earlier start? If not, I'll edit it in the editor, no problem
By the way, we no longer have the same version of Sport objects, or Water objects and some fences... Really hell with that Auzind

[ebla71]

The availability of vehicles was already there before, I had no problem with it, I liked the early start more.

Had to move the starting date from about 1850 to 1900 since the ships from "Unsinkable Sam preview-28" only become available at that later date and they are more or less essential to move around large amounts of bulk goods in the harbour area.

For example, the only source of iron ore and coal is the bulk terminal at Sandauhafen and you need to supply it to other industries like the oil extractor at Neuhöfer Hafen to obtain oil, since there are no oil fields or oil rigs in the region.

Actually, with regard to coal, this is not completely true, as there is a little and surprising exception, but I leave that to the players to discover and explain If you find it, please post a screenshot of that region here with a "cryptic answer" for others to continue guessing

You can also use the river ships from "redFish 0.4" where most of them become available in 1870 but you'll definitely miss something then, at "Unsinkable Sam" ships are really beautiful and deserve a lot more attention.

On the road vehicle side, much less restrictions, most horse-drawn ones are available from the early 1800s and the latest high-capacity introduction is the "HCP steam tractor" in 1860.

Narrow-gauge trains, as for example used in sand pits, also from 1860, and GETS trains from 1880 to 1890, so overall a starting date of 1900 seems to be a good compromise to me.

But could you please release a version where you keep the earlier start? If not, I'll edit it in the editor, no problem

If you want to "rewind the time" to an earlier starting date, this can easily be done in game using the STRG-ALT-C "special menue" with option "Change date" where I never had any interferences or crash, or in the scenario editor before starting a new game.

Therefore, I really don't want to confuse people further with additional versions, as already now there are three planned, the "basic terrain", the "decorated but no industries one", and the "complete one".

By the way, we no longer have the same version of Sport objects, or Water objects and some fences... Really hell with that Auzind

Definitely "version hell"

The main problem is that neither version number nor filename see to have changed but still some NewGRFs from the Auz series are different and you can only tell from a fingerprint list.

I downloaded those available from the in-game content service first, then updated and then put some newer versions from the development thread on top of that but still it does not seem to fix all issues

Could you post a picture of what's not displaying properly or missing?

Navíc, některý průmysl, který jsi tam dal, je pravděpodobně opravdu až z okolí roku 1900

Sorry, but the only word of Czech(?) that I speak and that already covers possibly 20-30% of my basic needs is "pivo"

[Argus]

Sorry, I'm translating via Google and I accidentally put the original here.
Also, some of the industry you put there is probably really only from around 1900
Ah, ships, I forgot they are somewhat limited in Redfish, I'm using Shark now, this new set already has quite large capacity ships at the start
By the way, I found out via Google maps that there are also two breweries in Harburg. I think there will be one in Hamburg as well.
If it bothers me a lot, I'll change the time, no problem I just thought the change was unnecessary because I didn't realize the problem with the ships since I haven't used the Redfish in a long time.
As far as the objects are concerned, the only thing missing so far is what I already reported. Unfortunately, I haven't had time to take a good look around yet, but most bugs are discovered during the game anyway, so hopefully I'll find something out during the week.

[ebla71]

Sorry, I'm translating via Google and I accidentally put the original here.

No worries - already assumed something like this.

Also, some of the industry you put there is probably really only from around 1900

Actually, some of the industries only appear in game around 1930s or 1940s, like the "oil extractor".

However, you can still place them in the scenario editor by hand and then they "persist" when you start a game in the sense that they remain and produce even before their "official" introduction date - tried that with the oil extractor.

Also, GETS seems to offer all cargos from the very beginning, did not experience any problems from the vehicle side, either. The limit is really when the first loco appears.

Ah, ships, I forgot they are somewhat limited in Redfish, I'm using Shark now, this new set already has quite large capacity ships at the start

The problem with the 1900 starting date is actually not with Redfish but with Unsinkable Sam, which offers ships only from 1900.

By the way, I found out via Google maps that there are also two breweries in Harburg. I think there will be one in Hamburg as well.

If you look at the new scenario, there is the Astra brewery near St. Pauli, which is a favorite of mine

As far as the objects are concerned, the only thing missing so far is what I already reported. Unfortunately, I haven't had time to take a good look around yet, but most bugs are discovered during the game anyway, so hopefully I'll find something out during the week.

Still have no clue where the different versions came from and how to easily tell them apart. Maybe need to provide a "bundle" with scenario file and NewGRFs in a ZIPped archive?

[Argus]

Yes, for newbies it will probably be better to pack newgrf in the zip.
I didn't notice that Unsinkable itself starts this late because I'm just using it as an add-on set due to the still missing passenger ships. However, by then players should at least have Redfish.

[ebla71]

Almost completed placement of industries to the Hamburg scenario now and happy to present to you the latest version v0.92

In total, there are now more than 240 industries placed at real-world locations and with all industry chains now complete, as far as I can tell

Consider the scenario more or less finished now and would really like to get your feedback before I upload it to the in-game download service.

But for the weekend, I'll finally give it an extended try myself and play, finally

[Argus]

I look forward.
By the way, I don't know about you, but it's even a long weekend here.
Missing objects will most likely be the same again.

[ebla71]

By the way, I don't know about you, but it's even a long weekend here.

Yes, Monday is "International Workers Day" and therefore public holiday also in my part of the galaxy

Missing objects will most likely be the same again.

I guess unless the NewGRF author or somebody with much more experience of the internals of those comes to aid, it will not be possible to resolve

[Argus]

The 3rd part of the Dutch Addition set is in an outdated version, it already has version 3.

[Argus]

Uch
Unfortunately, I didn't notice this right away, URatt 0.8 apparently has a broken compatibility with the Polish set.
Cars cannot drive on the paved stone road from Uratt, only on the one from Polroad.
And now I look at it, probably nowhere from URatt.
I would have reported this betrayal a long time ago, but I usually turn Polroad off.
If Polish roads are closed, cars drive on URatt roads. Otherwise, they will "escape" to Polish.
The Timberwolf vehicle set has a similar problem. I hope this problem only affects older vehicles. Fortunately, most of the map is mainly Polish roads.

[Argus]

So I started here. So far it's a village outside of Hamburg. When do I connect it? And yes, I set the cities to grow. Very slow
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Wilhe ... 0vMGZyX3Qw
When GETS doesn't have a subway, I put V4 there.

[ebla71]

Unfortunately, I didn't notice this right away, URatt 0.8 apparently has a broken compatibility with the Polish set.
Cars cannot drive on the paved stone road from Uratt, only on the one from Polroad.
And now I look at it, probably nowhere from URatt.
I would have reported this betrayal a long time ago, but I usually turn Polroad off.

You're right - there is a problem with compatibility between U&Ratt 0.8 and Polroad v55

It can be fixed in the Polroad settings by set parameters Enable custom road types OFF

But that means I have to re-assign all the roads again

So no playing again today, back to the scenario editor ...

"Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better."

[ebla71]

So I started here. So far it's a village outside of Hamburg. When do I connect it? And yes, I set the cities to grow. Very slow
When GETS doesn't have a subway, I put V4 there.

Very happy you enjoy playing it and get to work. Also good choice of subway.

However, as the 5th largest district/borough of Hamburg, the people of Wilhelmsburg strongly disagree with you about being called "villagers"

[Argus]

The scenario seems to be well playable so far. I allowed industry to grow, but I only allowed subsidies. And the prices are original, so I won't have the money for it right away.
I turned it on anyway just to supplement the string if needed.
The game scenario is quite easy, but that's not the point.

[Argus]

So I started here. So far it's a village outside of Hamburg. When do I connect it? And yes, I set the cities to grow. Very slow
When GETS doesn't have a subway, I put V4 there.

Very happy you enjoy playing it and get to work. Also good choice of subway.

However, as the 5th largest district/borough of Hamburg, the people of Wilhelmsburg strongly disagree with you about being called "villagers"

I think that today the inhabitants of certain districts of Prague, which used to be villages, would also give me a few slaps
Well, well, so far it's a small town that is not yet connected with Hamburg