FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

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AlphaCentauriBear
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by AlphaCentauriBear »

Got it. Thank you.

How do you solve original game problem with passengers produced and consumed by all towns everywhere? Meaning one can build any kind of route length with any kind of transportation means. That leads to some transportation means to obviously become inferior which leads to very narrow and boring game.

With industries it is at least some choice out of few possibilities as they may not be everywhere on a map.
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kamnet
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by kamnet »

AlphaCentauriBear wrote: 18 Jan 2024 21:26 Got it. Thank you.

How do you solve original game problem with passengers produced and consumed by all towns everywhere? Meaning one can build any kind of route length with any kind of transportation means. That leads to some transportation means to obviously become inferior which leads to very narrow and boring game.

With industries it is at least some choice out of few possibilities as they may not be everywhere on a map.
Really, this isn't an original game problem at all. With the original game the ONLY true goal is to build the highest score by the year 2050. Passengers everywhere is just a means to that end. But, now as then, if it's not a goal you wish to pursue, you don't have to, you can play the game however it suits you. There's no real compelling reason to transport passengers everywhere, there also is no compelling reason to transport anything but passengers.
AlphaCentauriBear
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by AlphaCentauriBear »

Correct. The original goal is to accumulate money. What I am talking about is that many game means are quite inferior to reach this goal. Why would people do it? And then after numbers and numbers of plays it becomes quite similar.
I am not talking about people pursuing some other goals like develop an infrastructure or something like that.
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kamnet
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by kamnet »

AlphaCentauriBear wrote: 19 Jan 2024 01:21 Correct. The original goal is to accumulate money. What I am talking about is that many game means are quite inferior to reach this goal. Why would people do it? And then after numbers and numbers of plays it becomes quite similar.
I am not talking about people pursuing some other goals like develop an infrastructure or something like that.
No, the original goal is not to accumulate money. You can have more money than anybody else in the game and still not achieve a higher score than another player. Money was never the goal, money is just a tool. Lack of money is just another temporary obstacle until you obtain enough money to do something else in the game. If all you're doing is playing for money, yes, it's going to get really boring really quickly. You can get the same amount of thrill playing Cookie Clicker.

But nobody plays for the score anymore and it's so irrelevant that as of OpenTTD 13 you can disable the score screen completely. So, what is the purpose of the game? It's whatever you decide you want it to be. What challenge do you want out of the game? Whatever it is, decide what you want and then play the game to see if you can achieve it. And you keep playing until you decide you've achieved your goal or you get tired of trying to achieve it.
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by AlphaCentauriBear »

He he. You are right.
I should stop pushing it to be a sensible economical simulator.
😉
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andythenorth
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by andythenorth »

Game is mostly about tile density and scarcity. No matter how big your map, there will be contended areas if you build for long enough. That's the main economy.

Also this is the FIRS topic, we've drifted :D
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by Sols »

I love FIRS. Its a great addition and ramp in difficulty the game needs.
I was sad that the Extreme economy is FIRS v3 was canned.

But the point of this post, is whether its possible to create something within FIRS that would allow you to add or and change which industries are generated on any map?

For example, I would love to just use the Temperate Basic economy, but I find it bizarre that there isn't Wood or Oil industry chains, especially based on a UK economy as these are key in Scotland.
I'm being biased as I'm currently creating a 16k x 8k UK scenario, and wanted to implement FIRS into this but I don't feel like I could without these industries.
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Emperor Jake
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by Emperor Jake »

Sols wrote: 21 Jan 2024 11:05 I love FIRS. Its a great addition and ramp in difficulty the game needs.
I was sad that the Extreme economy is FIRS v3 was canned.

But the point of this post, is whether its possible to create something within FIRS that would allow you to add or and change which industries are generated on any map?

For example, I would love to just use the Temperate Basic economy, but I find it bizarre that there isn't Wood or Oil industry chains, especially based on a UK economy as these are key in Scotland.
I'm being biased as I'm currently creating a 16k x 8k UK scenario, and wanted to implement FIRS into this but I don't feel like I could without these industries.
Have you tried XIS? It's basically a continuation and expansion of the old FIRS Extreme economy. There is also a newer version called AXIS.

For your case I would recommend XIS as neither of the AXIS economies so far suits a UK economy particularly well. But it will come in the future :)
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by MrRB »

Hi all,

Quick question:

A year or so ago I last played OTTD and had everything installed the way I wanted it. Then my computer broke and had to start all over. Now I've added all the things I liked (and some more).
FIRS was one of the most important for me (I used version 3). However I also played with the gamescript: Neighbors are important, to challenge myself into making it harder for cities to grow.

The combo of FIRS 3 (extreme economy) and Neighbors worked well. The cargo requirements displayed well and gradually more and harder cargos and loads were added.

Now, since I had to start over, I updated all my NewGRFs and tried FIRS 4 and AXIS 2.2.0. Neither of these seemed to trigger the complex cargo requirements in the Neighbors are important script. There are only requirements for pax and mail.
Can anyone help me out with what I can do about this? Are there settings that can make them compatible maybe?

As a last resort, a viable option would be to replace the Neighbors are important script with another one, with similar settings/requirements. The thing is I have no clue which one would come even close.

Thanks very much for any help! :)
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by Argus »

This is a problem with scripts that are not being developed and therefore not updated for newer industries. Try XIS, it still seems to work.
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Vulpy
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by Vulpy »

OpenTTD 14.0b3 and FIRS 4.15.1. The General Store produces coal in the Temperate Basic Economy, which it doesn't do under 13.4.
FIRS TempBasic.PNG
(398.84 KiB) Not downloaded yet
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2TallTyler
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Re: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development

Post by 2TallTyler »

This is an OpenTTD bug which has already been fixed in the nightly version. We’ll probably see a beta4 before too long.
https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/12053
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