zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Discuss, get help with, or post new graphics for TTDPatch and OpenTTD, using the NewGRF system, here. Graphics for plain TTD also acceptable here.

Moderator: Graphics Moderators

User avatar
planetmaker
OpenTTD Developer
OpenTTD Developer
Posts: 9293
Joined: 07 Nov 2007 22:44
Location: Sol d

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by planetmaker » 14 Jan 2014 13:49

juzza1 wrote:If I understood you correctly: You want to reduce the size of the 2x sized GUI icons (not to be confused with the NewGRF "OpenGFX BigGUI") included with zBase to that of the original. If so, there is no simple way to do this, because as you said, the GUI is hard coded into zBase, and base sets do not support parameters. The easiest way to achieve something similar to this is to use OpenGFX BigGUI with zBase and, and set its size to 1.5x from the NewGRF parameters. 1x scaling uses the default graphics defined by the current base set, which means you will still get the 2x sized GUI of zBase. This behaviour isn't really what you would expect, and as such, it's marked as an issue at the OpenGFX BigGUI devzone (http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/3599).
zBase indeed does provide 2x scale GUI icons. IMHO that's something which should be changed so that it also provides the 1x size icons. Maybe Zephyris can provide us with those; then I'll be happy to change it :)

However, even when you want to reduce the size of your GUI icons now, you can use OpenGFX+ BigGUI and set the desired GUI size to 1x (or 1.5x) instead of 2x.

EDIT: and I realize that Juzza mostly wrote that already :D

FreeZeee
Engineer
Engineer
Posts: 8
Joined: 13 Jan 2014 21:37

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by FreeZeee » 14 Jan 2014 17:26

Problem solved :-D! I don't know why, but i have lower resolution in game (640x480) than my phone can (800x480), so i change resolution abd it's better :-D!

Mr_Rata
Engineer
Engineer
Posts: 25
Joined: 08 Oct 2010 11:20
Location: Spain

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Mr_Rata » 07 Apr 2014 16:52

Great gob ! please continue update.
I would like new water and coastline,now is too boring

Nimrod
Engineer
Engineer
Posts: 1
Joined: 16 Sep 2014 14:58

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Nimrod » 16 Sep 2014 14:59

Any reason why the rugby pitches have been changed to American Football ones?

Timmiej93
Engineer
Engineer
Posts: 2
Joined: 09 Oct 2014 16:00

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Timmiej93 » 09 Oct 2014 16:03

Hi guys,

I am just new to OpenTTD and I was wondering if development on zBase is still going on, or if another graphics set has become the standard.
I noticed the last update on the graphics set is about a year ago (I believe) and posts in this topic have been few and far between. What's going on?

Tim

User avatar
Digitalfox
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
Posts: 704
Joined: 28 Oct 2004 04:42
Location: Catch the Fox if you can... 15 years and counting!

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Digitalfox » 09 Oct 2014 16:07

Timmiej93 wrote:Hi guys,

I am just new to OpenTTD and I was wondering if development on zBase is still going on, or if another graphics set has become the standard.
I noticed the last update on the graphics set is about a year ago (I believe) and posts in this topic have been few and far between. What's going on?

Tim
As complete as Zbase no there isn't...

It's a shame it's no longer developed...

Besides some sprites still missing, there's a lot of alignment errors, like terrain, canals, houses and foundations...

It would be awesome if someone could pick the work on, because personally as huge fan and player of TTD for the last 20 years, more than half of my life, this is a "tragedy", this was that big push to modernize TTD as modern video-game in graphics field, this could bring a whole new range of gamers who expect "modern" graphics and at the fisrt look at TTD and it's 8bpp sprites just ignore it (Minecraft is the only BIG exception).

We can only hope Zephyris someday resumes work on this set :cry:

Zephyris if your reading this and somehow you want to comeback to this set, I'll gladly help you, with testing and alignments fixes!

Zephyris 2 years ago, I remember not that many people supporting this grf or using it, but that number has grown and grown, more and more screenshot's show people using it!

What do you say to give it a second shot? :wink:

Alberth
OpenTTD Developer
OpenTTD Developer
Posts: 4740
Joined: 09 Sep 2007 05:03
Location: home

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Alberth » 09 Oct 2014 16:48

I wouldn't expect that to happen, given the time frame.

Alignment errors are easy to fix, it just needs someone to notice them, and change the numbers probably by a small amount.
The sprite aligner tool can help you with the change. Once you're happy, change the number in the source code in the same way, and submit the change in an issue at the zbase project.

Edit: There are no magical "someone"s that improve things, it just needs a caring user that wants to improve his/her game experience.
Being a OpenTTD developer does not mean I know what I am doing.
Also, other OpenTTD developers may have different opinions.

User avatar
Digitalfox
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
Posts: 704
Joined: 28 Oct 2004 04:42
Location: Catch the Fox if you can... 15 years and counting!

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Digitalfox » 09 Oct 2014 17:08

Alberth wrote:I wouldn't expect that to happen, given the time frame.

Alignment errors are easy to fix, it just needs someone to notice them, and change the numbers probably by a small amount.
The sprite aligner tool can help you with the change. Once you're happy, change the number in the source code in the same way, and submit the change in an issue at the zbase project.

Edit: There are no magical "someone"s that improve things, it just needs a caring user that wants to improve his/her game experience.
Well hope is the last thing to die right? :D

Can't speak for others, I in my case, that's what I did and do, I compile my own Zbase with some fixes and changes (like the last commit on OpenGFX+8bpp), but my knowledge is limited when it comes to the scripts that were used to generate the NML I use.
For example the terrain is misaligned http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/4387 no easy fix, unless "someone" with permission and knowledge on the situation!

"someone" in this case does have to have some general knowledge on graphics creation and modification, in my case I lack it and can't contribute in a meaningful way that advances this grf! That's why I'm trying to "compel :wink: " "someone" and I'll help as much as my knowledge permits.

Alberth
OpenTTD Developer
OpenTTD Developer
Posts: 4740
Joined: 09 Sep 2007 05:03
Location: home

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Alberth » 09 Oct 2014 17:33

Hang out in the #openttdcoop.devzone channel, and submit fixes for issues that you can fix. Getting access rights is mostly showing you deliver quality work.

As for knowledge-able persons, I don't think there is anyone around that is knowledgeable with time on his hands to change things, or it would have been done already. Zbase is pretty prominently available if you like that area. A better strategy is to assume no magical someone exists, and see things you don't know as a opportunity to learn about them. Even if you don't solve the problem in the end, you've learned about stuff.

Fixing may be slow, but hey, zbase hasn't been changed at all for the last two years, so who's counting?
Being a OpenTTD developer does not mean I know what I am doing.
Also, other OpenTTD developers may have different opinions.

Timmiej93
Engineer
Engineer
Posts: 2
Joined: 09 Oct 2014 16:00

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Timmiej93 » 09 Oct 2014 20:20

Digitalfox wrote: As complete as Zbase no there isn't...

It's a shame it's no longer developed...

Besides some sprites still missing, there's a lot of alignment errors, like terrain, canals, houses and foundations...

It would be awesome if someone could pick the work on, because personally as huge fan and player of TTD for the last 20 years, more than half of my life, this is a "tragedy", this was that big push to modernize TTD as modern video-game in graphics field, this could bring a whole new range of gamers who expect "modern" graphics and at the fisrt look at TTD and it's 8bpp sprites just ignore it (Minecraft is the only BIG exception).

We can only hope Zephyris someday resumes work on this set :cry:

Zephyris if your reading this and somehow you want to comeback to this set, I'll gladly help you, with testing and alignments fixes!

Zephyris 2 years ago, I remember not that many people supporting this grf or using it, but that number has grown and grown, more and more screenshot's show people using it!

What do you say to give it a second shot? :wink:
I absolutely agree with you. I got into Train Fever a while back, but that doesn't go into depth enough for me, so I started looking around what was available. Of course I ended up on OTTD, but Youtubing and googling it, I saw the graphics, and was repelled. It was just like something from another era. Thank god I still started playing it. I think I've been looking for an alternative game for Train Fever for at least a month, before deciding to try OTTD.

About the graphics set, the only thing that kinda bugs me is the lack of level crossing barriers, and seeing other people on 32bpp graphic sets do have them. I love Level crossings :3

Eddi
Tycoon
Tycoon
Posts: 7415
Joined: 17 Jan 2007 00:14

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Eddi » 09 Oct 2014 22:55

Timmiej93 wrote:It was just like something from another era.
that's because it is.
You might not exactly be interested in Ferion, but if you are, have fun :)

User avatar
Zephyris
Tycoon
Tycoon
Posts: 2826
Joined: 16 May 2007 16:59

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Zephyris » 13 Oct 2014 07:36

I am still around, just don't have the time to any major projects at the moment! Do remember that even getting zBase to it's basic current state was over a month of full time work :)

All the graphics were designed very carefully, with smart use of object rendering and texture library files to make it as modular and easy to update as possible. Eg. If you can design a better grass texture then just save the changes then run the bat script that re-renders all the graphics... It was also setup so that, wherever possible, the sprite alignments are simple to determine and are shared among all sprite sets with the same organisation. If you do try to make some updates to this set then I think you will find it is nice to work with.

Re. missing sprites; which ones are missing? I thought it was all complete?

Brumi
President
President
Posts: 904
Joined: 18 Jul 2009 17:54

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Brumi » 13 Oct 2014 17:14

Zephyris wrote:Re. missing sprites; which ones are missing? I thought it was all complete?
Some toolbar buttons are missing:
Attachments
zbase.png
zbase.png (44.12 KiB) Viewed 2735 times

User avatar
planetmaker
OpenTTD Developer
OpenTTD Developer
Posts: 9293
Joined: 07 Nov 2007 22:44
Location: Sol d

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by planetmaker » 13 Oct 2014 17:24

I don't yet have a complete list, but there's much to do, as OpenTTD now has zoom capability for GUI elements, thus the complete GUI sprites are also needed in 1x, 2x and 4x zoom.

What I know showing too small (thus using OpenGFX icons) compared to zBase's currently used 2x sprites:
- the main toolbar buttons for story board, goal list, the 4 vehicle types, the toolbar switch (when window is too small)
- town list happyness indicators
- exclusive transport rights icon
- debug window title bar decoration (visible only for newgrf developers)
- left / right arrow
EDIT:
- autoreplace active icon
- autoreplace not active icon
- vehicle group income indicators: n/a, loss, moderate, good. See http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/ope ... 21a7dc034b

Funnily we could actually also use all font sprites in those 3 sizes now.

User avatar
Digitalfox
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
Posts: 704
Joined: 28 Oct 2004 04:42
Location: Catch the Fox if you can... 15 years and counting!

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Digitalfox » 13 Oct 2014 18:58

A few misalignment/bugs:

Look at the black:
1.png
1.png (118.64 KiB) Viewed 2702 times
8.png
8.png (35.87 KiB) Viewed 2702 times
9.png
9.png (14.01 KiB) Viewed 2702 times

User avatar
Digitalfox
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
Posts: 704
Joined: 28 Oct 2004 04:42
Location: Catch the Fox if you can... 15 years and counting!

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Digitalfox » 13 Oct 2014 19:00

Foundations:
3.png
3.png (111.34 KiB) Viewed 2706 times
5.png
5.png (377.27 KiB) Viewed 2706 times
7.png
7.png (427.56 KiB) Viewed 2706 times

User avatar
Digitalfox
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
Posts: 704
Joined: 28 Oct 2004 04:42
Location: Catch the Fox if you can... 15 years and counting!

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Digitalfox » 13 Oct 2014 19:01

Canals:
6.png
6.png (215.13 KiB) Viewed 2705 times
House:
2.png
2.png (130.86 KiB) Viewed 2705 times
Steel:
4.png
(892.5 KiB) Downloaded 6 times

User avatar
Digitalfox
Chief Executive
Chief Executive
Posts: 704
Joined: 28 Oct 2004 04:42
Location: Catch the Fox if you can... 15 years and counting!

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Digitalfox » 13 Oct 2014 19:05

Rivers:
10.png
10.png (543.37 KiB) Viewed 2702 times

Also what about player faces? :D

User avatar
planetmaker
OpenTTD Developer
OpenTTD Developer
Posts: 9293
Joined: 07 Nov 2007 22:44
Location: Sol d

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by planetmaker » 15 Oct 2014 20:23

I went through the zBase source files and checked where there are original zBase sprites used and where it falls back to OpenGFX' sprites. The list of GUI sprites missing a 32bpp equivalent I found turned out very long, actually much longer than I expected it to be:
http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/7228
I tried to find them in the graphics folders of zBase but didn't locate those GUI sprites there either (but maybe I just failed to find them).

User avatar
Zephyris
Tycoon
Tycoon
Posts: 2826
Joined: 16 May 2007 16:59

Re: zBase (32bpp base set by Zephyris)

Post by Zephyris » 22 Oct 2014 08:57

Wow, that is more sprites than I was expecting. I remember now that I only converted some of the GUI sprites to 32bpp as it ended upgiving a very inconsistent appearence having the GUI elements (windows, text, etc) in old 8bpp style and the icons as 32bpp. I think I would actually err towards removing all the 32bpp GUI elements for now!

In terms of the canal sprite alignment that is just a matter of hard work and tweaking to get it all sorted. It should definitely done by altering the alignnments rather than the graphics though, to ensure that any updates to the blend file renders in the future can be easily transferred to in-game.

I am not sure there is a better way to align the foundations, trying to make them look more 3D will always cause some alignment wierdness because it forces an optical illusion. The office block being completely misaligned is definitely my fault though :)

I am still waiting for internet access at home in my new place (so much for German efficiency) but once I do I think I will take a look at some updates.

Post Reply

Return to “Graphics Development”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 7 guests