TARS Towns development

[Purno]

Yikes! What sort of contagious disease did attack those poor houses?

regards
Michael

I'm addressing that. I guess it's better to draw big lumps of snow during the snow transition. Has anyone got any tips on doing so?

Shouldn't roofs have less snow than the landscape since houses have heating? Is a snow transition for roofs necessary?

[Andrew350]

Maybe just the edges of the roofs (above the overhangs) should have snow in the transitions. Only in full snow should the main (heated) part of the roof have any snow on it, otherwise it would usually just melt away (as Purno said).

[michael blunck]

Shouldn't roofs have less snow than the landscape since houses have heating?

I don´t think so. In older times, w/o thermal insulation (of the roof), thrifty heating was too marginal to melt snow on the roofs, especially in continental/alpine climate. In fact, the snow itself played an important role as thermal insulation. And with modern thermal insulation, the only source for melting snow on roofs are warmer temperatures from outside (mostly direct sun, but also warm air).

Is a snow transition for roofs necessary?

It´s not "necessary", but depends on the ideas of the artist.

In any way, the correct procedure to do it would be like this:

- when snow first starts to fall, it will cover the roof in full, not in "speckles" (s.a.), although as a very thin layer at first, but nevertheless, I´d make the full roof snow-covered,
- with more snow falling, one could try to draw the snow "thicker",
- when melting, snow usually slides down from the upper parts of the roof, with the last remnants usually hiding in some shady places (behind chimneys, dormers, roof edges, ...).

regards
Michael

[SwissFan91]

when snow first starts to fall, it will cover the roof in full, not in "speckles" (s.a.), although as a very thin layer at first, but nevertheless, I´d make the full roof snow-covered,
- with more snow falling, one could try to draw the snow "thicker",
- when melting, snow usually slides down from the upper parts of the roof, with the last remnants usually hiding in some shady places (behind chimneys, dormers, roof edges, ...).

This is my thinking, too. I may end up drawing all of my graphics having 'thick snow' in December/January.

[EDIT] Although, thinking about it, this approach may look odd in that, during the transition when first snow arrives, roofs will have a full covering while the ground tiles will only have a dusting..

[planetmaker]

when snow first starts to fall, it will cover the roof in full, not in "speckles" (s.a.), although as a very thin layer at first, but nevertheless, I´d make the full roof snow-covered,
- with more snow falling, one could try to draw the snow "thicker",
- when melting, snow usually slides down from the upper parts of the roof, with the last remnants usually hiding in some shady places (behind chimneys, dormers, roof edges, ...).

This is my thinking, too. I may end up drawing all of my graphics having 'thick snow' in December/January.

[EDIT] Although, thinking about it, this approach may look odd in that, during the transition when first snow arrives, roofs will have a full covering while the ground tiles will only have a dusting..

I agree, that will look odd, if the gardens have no snow while the adjacent grass has some. Though I also agree that the very fine snow patches as shown in the screenshot look a bit funky, too

And as I didn't mention it yet: what I see so far looks tasty

[Eddi]

i have a feeling your snowline-transition detection is one level too low. there's partially snowed houses on the same level as green grass, and fully snowed houses on same level as partially snowed grass, etc.

[Yoshi]

i have a feeling your snowline-transition detection is one level too low. there's partially snowed houses on the same level as green grass, and fully snowed houses on same level as partially snowed grass, etc.

I'll look over the code

[wallyweb]

From my tile grid newobject grf:

Code: Select all

// Action 2 for object
// Ground sprite = bare ground 3929 = 0F59
// <Sprite-number> * <Length> 02 07/09 <set-id> 00 <groundsprite> <buildingsprite> <xoffset> <yoffset> <xextent> <yextent> <zextent>
  // Flat
   24 * 17	 02 0F 00 00  8D 0F 00 00  00 80 00 80   00 00   0F 0F E5 // 00 FLAT grass 3981 0x0F8D
   25 * 17	 02 0F 01 00  C6 11 00 00  00 80 00 80   00 00   0F 0F E5 // 4550 desert 0x11C6
   26 * 17	 02 0F 02 00  8D 0F 00 00  00 80 00 80   00 00   0F 0F E5 // 3981 rainforest 0x0F8D
   27 * 17	 02 0F 03 00  C6 11 00 00  00 80 00 80   00 00   0F 0F E5 // 4550 snow 0x11C6

//=====================================================================================
// varAction 2 - Terrain Type check
// 0 normal, 1 desert, 2 rainforest, 4 on or above snowline
  // Flat
  158 * 26	 02 0F 5F 81 41 00 FF 04  00 00 00 00  01 00 01 01  02 00 02 02  03 00 04 04  4C 00

This places the appropriate ground tile under the sprite.
It will also transition the ground tile for variable snow lines.
I can (and have done) add different sprites for each ground tile that also transition with the variable snow line. This is not an issue.

So the question remains ... How can we detect the 1/4, 1/2 and 3/4 snowed tiles?

[planetmaker]

So the question remains ... How can we detect the 1/4, 1/2 and 3/4 snowed tiles?

Very simple, check for height differences, not for tile types:

* query the tile height and the snowline.
* calculculate the difference and
** height - snowline <= -2: no snow
** height - snowline = -1: 1/4 snow
** height - snowline = 0: 2/4 snow
** height - snowline = 1: 3/4 snow
** height - snowline >= 2: 4/4 snow

You only need the tiletype to check whether it is a ground tile.

See e.g. http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/ope ... locks.pnml which makes mathematically slightly faster use of comparisons and creation of a properly crafted temporary register which then is used to decide on the snowyness of the sprites to show.

OpenGFX users can enjoy smooth transitions e.g. for rivers, locks and canals already since last Christmas

EDIT: Also mind that the definitions of the height variables differ in grf v7 and grf v8. The linked code is grf v8.

[wallyweb]

Very simple, check for height differences, not for tile types:.

Should be easy enough.

... .pnml

Unfortunately I only code in the pure environment of NFO ...

which makes mathematically slightly faster use of comparisons and creation of a properly crafted temporary register which then is used to decide on the snowyness of the sprites to show.

which should be doable in nfo?

OpenGFX users can enjoy smooth transitions e.g. for rivers, locks and canals already since last Christmas

Is Saint Nicholas aware of this?

EDIT: Also mind that the definitions of the height variables differ in grf v7 and grf v8. The linked code is grf v8.

Good to know as I code for OTTD/TTDP compatibility.

Now all I have to do is find out in which variables snow line and tile height are hiding. I assume that GRFSpecs will have these ... It will, won't it ?

Thanks for this.

[planetmaker]

Very simple, check for height differences, not for tile types:.

Should be easy enough.

... .pnml

Unfortunately I only code in the pure environment of NFO ...

which makes mathematically slightly faster use of comparisons and creation of a properly crafted temporary register which then is used to decide on the snowyness of the sprites to show.

which should be doable in nfo?

OpenGFX users can enjoy smooth transitions e.g. for rivers, locks and canals already since last Christmas

Is Saint Nicholas aware of this?

Of course The changelog as of 24 Dec 2011 knows it

EDIT: Also mind that the definitions of the height variables differ in grf v7 and grf v8. The linked code is grf v8.

Good to know as I code for OTTD/TTDP compatibility.

Now all I have to do is find out in which variables snow line and tile height are hiding. I assume that GRFSpecs will have these ... It will, won't it ?

Thanks for this.

Of course all that can also be implemented in NFO; NML cannot do more than is feasible with NFO. But it might (or might not) turn out much more lengthy for cases like these (would take me hours to figure out these things in NFO - less test them). Tile height is var 0x62 for objects, snowline is global variable 0x20 for varaction2 usage.

[wallyweb]

...

/me goes to play with his new toys.

[SwissFan91]

Here's something I finished off and added:

dom both.png (2.38 KiB) Viewed 5598 times

From:

Photo0019.jpg

(769.19 KiB) Downloaded 7 times

[SwissFan91]

Here's my brainstorm for how to draw snow transitions:

Code: Select all

0 (no snow) 	= 	no snow on roofs
			           no snow on edges
			           no snow on floor

1		        =	 small lumps on edges of roofs
			           no snow on edges
			           snow only on floor where sheltered e.g. under overhanging areas and behind walls

2		        =	 medium sized lumps on bottom half of roofs, less on sides facing 'sun' (light in TTD)
			           no snow on edges
			           snow in small lumps on floor

3		        =	 snow on most of the roof bar any areas of heat (chimneys, etc.) or steep areas of roof. Partial melt on roofs facing the 'sun' (light in TTD)
			           snow on edges that are in shadow (protected from the 'sun' (light in TTD))
			           mainly snow on floor but pathways worn away

4 (full snow)  =	 full snow on roofs
			           full snow on edges
			           full snow on floor 

*edges = top of walls, fences, railings etc.

Here's an in-game screenshot for reference (with the OLD method of snow on buildings):

screenshot#7.png (43.36 KiB) Viewed 5490 times

What do people think? Advice would be very much appreciated.

[planetmaker]

Nice

I think at 1/4 snow the snow patches could be less but slightly larger
At the no-snow stage the grass could be like the surroundings - similar like for all the snow stages.

[SwissFan91]

Thanks for the feedback, PM. I hope you noted that the screenshot is with the OLD version of doing snow transitions, not the outlined method above it

The grass below the buildings will be fixed, too. That is unintentional.

[planetmaker]

Thanks for the feedback, PM. I hope you noted that the screenshot is with the OLD version of doing snow transitions, not the outlined method above it

Sorry, no, I overlooked that

[SwissFan91]

I've stressed it a bit more now

[SwissFan91]

Here's something I did quickly:

OLD:

for sac.png (3.24 KiB) Viewed 5422 times

NEW:

new snow transitions.png (3.31 KiB) Viewed 5422 times

Done based on the criteria I outlined above. Thoughts?

[Supercheese]

Very nice, definite improvement.