Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

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GarryG
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

I forgot to tell people what version I am using in OpenTTD. I've been using OpenTTD Nightlies. At the moment I have version r27295. It loads ok with this version.

If anyone wants the latest Nightly can get it from http://www.openttd.org/en/

I just tested it on OpenTTD 1.5.1-RC1 and got same problem as you mentioned about the town.

When I was making the game one town called Hurstville, it would not allow me to use that name said the name must be unique. So I left the last e off the name so that could use it.

Wonder if the problem is in that or one of the other towns having a name that is confusing OpenTTD.

I been making backup of my scenarios since May 28 and I tested every version using OpenTTD 1.5.1 and all have that problem.

Guess back to the drawing board.
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by Toffo »

If I were you I'd hold off on starting again (if that's what you mean by "back to the drawing board"). I'm not a dev but I would assume if you made a game in, say, r27295, and then OTTD 1.5.2 came out after r27295 was released then I would expect the save game would work on 1.5.2 as it's a newer version. Maybe that's not how it works, I'm happy to be corrected.

I'm not really enough of an expert to say how to proceed. If it were me, I would just keep working on the scenario and hope that a newer stable version of OTTD comes out that supports my scenario! :)

That's a strange one with Hurstville. This is probably a heaps basic suggestion but you could check the town listing and see if you can find Hurstville and Hurstvill and delete the incorrect one.

Anyway, I'm off.

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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

I think your right. Bit like using word processor, spreadsheets etc. Any thing you make in a later version will not work in a earlier version.

I wanted an excuse to change the scenario board size to 2048 by 2048 and do make the different divisions. I used to work with the railway and have the Working Timetables and Local Appendix to each division.

Had Sydney Metropolitan Division, Western Division, Southern Division, Northern Division and Illawarra Division. So I might make a scenario for each of those Divisions and make it on OpenTTD 1.5.1.

But I will sleep on it and see what tomorrow brings.
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by kamnet »

I would suggest using the oldest OpenTTD stable release version that your NewGRFs can support, which also offers all the features you want to use.

For example, if the traditional 16 height levels is sufficient for your scenario, then I'd consider using OpenTTD 1.4.0 instead.

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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

Thanks Kamnet for your suggestion.

I will use OpenTTD 1.5.1 as I believe the scenario heights will go higher then 16 levels. When the rail level rises or falls I intend to do same. If only a short climb and descend of less then 10 metres, most places I will ignore, but longer climbs and descends I wish to include. Raise or lower the heights accordingly.

Sydney by the Curve and Gradient information I have on PDF shows Sydney is 20.4 metres above sea level, so I will start it 2 levels high. The line west of Sydney to Lithgow highest station is called Bell, it is 1067m above sea-level. The highest section of railway line is the Northern line to Tenterfield between Llangothlin and Ben Lomond a height of 1377m.

The ratio I been working on is any height changes that are significant I been trying to use a ratio of 1 level per 20 metres or part thereof.

Good thing about starting the scenario again is I can now include the Canadian and the US station sets you told me about. I like the freight (goods) shed with the Canadian set. The US set has some platforms suitable for the country.

Hope I will have new scenario ready for testing in about a weeks time.
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

In case people wonder why I doing this and telling everyone about it. Due to disability I have I find it hard to concentrate and to finish a task. To help my problem I need to keep my brain active.

Doing something for myself I keep giving up. Finding hard to carry on with the task.

The people who have visited and left replies on this site, I thank you all kindly as you have giving me the reason to keep trying and finish this task.

Again thank you all.
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by Toffo »

Hi GarryG,

Well I, for one, am very grateful to you! I put together what I though was a good and relatively accurate scenario from Port Stephens to Nowra but my effort looks half-arsed compared to yours! You're putting incredible attention to detail into your work and keep on keeping on when I would have given up long ago. I'm pumped to play this new scenario and will be really excited when you get it done. Keep at it! :)

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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by romazoon »

I gave a look at your scenario and i see that you use an "heightmap" but then add relief "by hand"

i thought maybe you d like to have a more "detailed" heightmap of the area :
Eastern Australia (resized).png
(370.05 KiB) Downloaded 9 times
it s 1024x512 BUT i would recommand you to use it as a 2048x1024 for your project (with around 30/32 tiles max heights)

you can also try 4096x2048 with around or more than 70 tiles max heights

Also, if the area i cropped is too large for your project, using "paint" to "crop a smaller part" is relatively easy (or ask me)

Note : this map is a bit "distorted", i haven t totally respected "ratio" when resizing ( the vertical is untouched, but i enlarged the horizontal to make it fit in 512 pixel large (it was 1024x 320 pixel large after i cutted it from an australian heightmap and so i resized it to fit OTTD sizes)

also simply shout if you need help with the map (resizing or if you want me to recrop from original, etc)

Good luck

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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

Hi romazoon, thank kindly for your effort in providing the map.

I've tried using heightmaps before, but they not allow enough room to include the suburbs around Sydney and Newcastle, and if make them large enough to allow suburbs the country towns are 2 far apart.

The scenario I did is all done by hand .. no heightmap used. I used Google Earth to view to get rough idea of placing rivers and towns.

I use the ruler in google to measure distance between towns and other objects to roughly put the town in the correct place. The use a formula I have in a spreadsheet to calculate how many squares between towns and places of interest.

The spreadsheet also has list of all NSW railway stations in order from Sydney. Been putting in where bridges, level crossing and other sidings used to be and any other information I find.

I want the game to be realistic as possible. A lot of lines throughout NSW is single line. The railway lines on the North Coast between Maitland and Newcastle is all single lines with a passing loop every 10 to 12 km all the way to Brisbane. If I used a heightmap, that puts them about 250 squares apart. Long time for trains to wait at a pass loop in the game.

Maitland to Brisbane is 794 km. Imagine playing a game if not all the north coast put a large amount and only having single lines. I used to work at a place called Craven on the North Coast and we averaged in the 1980s 50 trains a day.

So where ever single lines are I try to reduce my scale to 1 square equals 5 km.

The new scenario I started I using a 2048 by 2048. Start at Newcastle in centre of East side on the coast. When building north and south when get to end of map, I thinking of bending the coast 90 degrees so that the top and bottom will also be part of the east coast.

Thank you again for the offer of the heightmap, but afraid that idea not work for what I plan.

UPDATE: Just been suggested to me from people I staying with .. Since I put in so much time and effort into the work with the scenario I already started using nightly, why not finish it or at least make it playable for those who also use nightlies. What you all think?
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by romazoon »

indeed the heightmap isn t that much of help in your case, seems it would require much more "precise" heightmap" than i can get.

Wish you good luck and courage ;)

P.s : i thought you used an heightmap as a base cause a few part of the land seemed like not "hand made" ( the relief inland where you haven t built anything )

edit: and ofc you can finish and release what you have done already (but beware that you might get tons messages asking for where they can find the missing "newgrf")

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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

Here is a list of the NewGRF files used in the scenario in the Nightlies and where they can be found.

The following can be found at http://grfcrawler.tt-forums.net/index.php
Australian Standard Gauge v0.1.1, New Stations v.0.614.08.2014, Jezulkim's stations v0.6, Container freight station and harbour, MariCo v.0.32, New Water v0.7.

The following can be found at https://bundles.openttdcoop.org/?C=M&O=D
FIRS Industries Replacement Set 2015-05-18-snakebite, 2cc Trains in NML v5628, WAS 2015-05-31 5629 - please note: These are not released versions, we use them at our own risk.

The following can be found at Simucape .. http://www.simuscape.net/
WSF Ferry Set v0.4, Finescale Standard Gauge and 3rd Rail (Uk Rail Set Tracks), osignalsw.grf, Urban Transit System Bridge v0.1 beta.

2cc Tram Set at http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... &start=160

The Tunnel © MiJ © Zeleznicni Portaly (Tunel002.grf) can be found at http://forum.tycoonez.com/viewtopic.php ... 4012fcd766

Generic Australian Set (GARS) r06 at http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... t+GARS+r06

NLHS - Dutch Houses v.0.1.1 at http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... 8&start=60

Forest Objects at http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... est+object

ISR Train Depot v.0.1 at http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=67&t=59299

The next one I can not remember where I got it from "TTD Landscape Objects v3.0" so I hope they don't mine if I make a copy of this file here so you can download.

All the other files can be found when you start OpenTTD Nightlies and Check On Line Contents.

Previously I listed all the files I used. They are in order of how they should be loaded.
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TTD_landscapew3.grf
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

Hi all,

Here an update to the scenario I been doing. Going to finish the one I posted earlier. Those who don't have nightlies can get it from http://www.openttd.org/en/

I've extended the game south to Campbelltown and west to Penrith. This version I removed all the roads (I hope).

Will need to get latest of FIRS and WAS to run this scenario from https://bundles.openttdcoop.org/?C=M&O=D

Cheers
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Sydney to Newcastle Updayed June 6.scn
Sydney to Newcastle Updated June 6
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

Hi all, I stopped building the previous scenario for now as bit large plus with some different newgrfs, could do better. So started a 2048 by 2048 .. a bit smaller. So far done from Newcastle to Singleton, Newcastle to Wrong, Toronto line, Belmont line, the collieries around Teralba, Fassifern and Cockle Creek, and make the game a lot more fun and harder too, I've done all the coal lines for the South Maitland Railways from Maitland to Cessnock and beyond, also the coal lines that go from Hexham across the swamp to Minmi and later joins the Cessnock line. Over 20 mines on those lines.

Been putting in the railway lines too and making what sidings and collieries as realistic as possible as shown in the diagrams on the DVD called "New South Wales Track and Signal Diagrams" I purchased from the Australian Railway Historical Society. If want to buy go to there website at http://www.arhsnsw.com.au/bookshop.htm

The first image shows a diagram from that DVD of the Northern Extended Colliery at Teralba. Then the other image is the colliery I built for the game. Actually think these designs for industries handle trains better then balloon loops or stations with many platforms.

I like some collieries as they had repair shops, good place to put a train depot and show it as the repair shop. Trains can start and do maintence at the colliery.

To my knowledge there are no oil wells in New South Wales, so what I've done if put some Oil Rigs off the coast and intend to act as if these are Oils that Australia has imported to Newcastle.

To Export items, I put land bottom corner to pretend that is New Zealand. Can export coal and other material to there for the fun of the game.

Any one want to try what I made so far? I've attached the scenario (it includes the railway lines and some signals, but no trains, that your job), so you have a choice add your own ideas to the scenario or play the game or both.

Keep you busy for the weekend. Please any mistakes you find let me know.

Almost forgot to mention, to get trains to use this style of stations, need a waypoint on the arrival road to the sidings, then send them to the station to load. Some of these have a waypoint in the design of a sign, and some I have not done yet.

Update: A new copy of the scenario just added. Noticed 3 persons downloaded previous. Not sure if I put New Zealand in other ne, so to be sure here it is again. Note can be played on OpenTTD 1.5.1

UPDATE .. below is a new version of the scenario.
Attachments
Northern Extended Colliery.png
Image from the DVD New South Wales Track and Signal Diagrams
(30.27 KiB) Downloaded 6 times
Colliery.jpg
My version of the colliery for the game
(154.27 KiB) Downloaded 6 times
Newcastle Gosford with trees.scn
This is a new version of scenario .. dated 15th June
(2.3 MiB) Downloaded 71 times
Last edited by GarryG on 15 Jun 2015 09:36, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

Forgot to let you know what files needed and where to find them.

Latest versions of FIRS Industries Replacement Set (snakebite), 2cc Trains in NML, 2cc Tram Set, World Airlines Set, all can be found at https://bundles.openttdcoop.org/?C=M&O=D

ISR Train Depot v.0.1 found at http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=67&t=59299

© MiJ © Zeleznicni Portaly (Tunnel Portal) http://forum.tycoonez.com/viewtopic.php ... 4012fcd766

NLHS - Dutch Houses v.0.1.1 http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... 8&start=60

Canadian Station Set v0.3d http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... &start=400

VAST + Fences 0.3.0 http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... hilit=VAST

Forest Objects http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... est+object

Australian Standard Gauge v0.1.1, New Stations v.0.614.08.2014, Container freight station and harbour, MariCo v.0.32 all found at http://grfcrawler.tt-forums.net/index.php

WSF Ferry Set v0.4, osignalsw.grf, Urban Transit System Bridge v0.1 beta, Finescale Standard Gauge and 3rd Rail (Uk Rail Set Tracks) all found at http://www.simuscape.net/

And the following can all be found when you start OpenTTD and Check on Line contents : xUSSR Set. Static Objects, NuTracks 2 r247, North American Railway Set, UK Renewal Train Set v3.04, UK Renewal Train Set v3 Add-ons.04, Invisible Leading Engine, Fish 2.0.2 (Squid Ate Fish), eGRVTSv2.0-r188, Road Hog road-hog r536, Long Vehicle v4 (13 Jan 2008), OpenGRX + Airports v5597, AV9.8, Dutch Catenary, Brick Tram Depot v.0.1, Total Town Replacment Set 3.14, Town and Industry - UK Houses, Dutch Road Furniture r175, Dutch Road Furniture - UK Signs add-on 1.0.0, Dutch Station Set, Dutch Stations Addition Set c.0.8, Hungarian Stations 1/3, CS Station Set - Platforms & Stops c0.3, CHIPS Station Set 1.4.0, Japan Set3:Stations, Jezulkim's Stations, Industrial Stations Renewel v5574, ISR-Style Dock V1.3, Modular Locomotive Sheds 0.2.6, Generic Buffers, Total Bridge Renewel Set Version 1.2 - Modified for ARRS, UK Waypoints Set v1.1, VAST (Objects) 0.3.0, VAST: Assortment of Station Tiles, Fake Bridge, FRISS - Stations and Other Infrustracture 0.5.2, ISR/DWE-Style Objects v1.0, New Company Colours (purpletoblack.grf), Fake Airport Objects, Empty GRF.

Last night I finished the line from Singleton to Muswellbrook and today will continue the line Muswellbrook to Merriwa and north to possibly Werris Creek.
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

Hi all, just finished the scenario to Werris Creek, but have an idea .. hope some of you might let me know which be better.

Much of the line between Maitland and Werris Creek was single lines in 1930. Wasn't till 1950s some of it was duplicated, but only as far as St Heliers near Muswellbrook.

Method of safeworking was Electric Staff working where driver need a token for each section to proceed. Train would slow down at each station and crossing loop t hand the signalman the token from the section he just come from and signalman would hand him a token for the next section.

Should I reduce the speed of the tracks passing through the stations. I am using NuTracks. Only first 3 tracks available in the 1930s. Using the Medium speed for main line working and mixed between slower 2 in sidings and crossing loops.

But what about main line through stations, would the game be a bit more realistic if I used the slowest track there too, so it look like the trains slow down to exchange the token?

Should I do full length of the main line, or maybe just a few squares each side where the signal box or station is located?

What you think?

Next few days will do the north coast line from Maitland to Taree and extend the line from Wyong towards Sydney.
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

Hi all, I basically finished my main objective with the scenario from Newcastle. I've attached a copy so you can change anything you wish in the scenario and play the game.

I know some not like the railway lines already added, but made it a lot easier for me to design it and try get as many locations to scale as possible.

I put in some trees, but I think that a mistake for the moment as they generate quickly. Might make it hard to find things.

Still need some other prettying up. Will do that as I play the game and see if any mistakes.

I've searched as many sites I know of to try find if any one has designed a coal stage, water tower and water columns, but so far no luck. In ISR Station raw section has a tower looks a bit like the Australian Square water towers. But that closest I can think of.

Raked the brain a bit (what I got left) and come up with a idea for a coal stage for coal stage for Broadmeadow. Used a bridge and objects, what ya thing? If any one has a idea for this and for water columns and water towers let me know.

The game spans from Newcastle to the north west as far as Werris Creek, north coast to Gloucester, south to Gosford. Many coal mines north of Maitland are not included as they did not exist in the 1930s.

Next step for this game if you like the idea .. beyond Werris Creek and Gloucester is a little room. Thinking of just putting in the industries and raw material that was railed from places beyond these 2 locations. Will also extend the game beyond Gosford towards Sydney later.

Hope you enjoy.
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Newcastle Gosford with trees.scn
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GarryG
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

Been a bit idle on touching up the scenario as been testing some ideas.

Those who remember the steam days will remember the coal stages at locomotive depots to re-coal the locos.

Been seeing if can do one with all the GRF files I could find.

Unfortunately all the years TTD and OpenTTD been around, I don't think anyone has designed "Coal Stage", "Water Tower" and "Water Columns". If they have please tell me where.

Coal Stages 1 & 2 use the files xUSSR Set. Static Objects, NuTracks 2 r247, 2cc Trains in NML v 5628, Australian Standard Gauge v0.1.1, Modular Locomotive Sheds 0.2.6, Urban Transit System Bridge v0.1 beta, ISR Train Depot v.0.1, Industrial Stations Renewal v5574.

The Loco Service shed. The first 2 buildings are from Industrial Station Renewal Set and the last one is the ISR Train Depot.

Coal Stage 3 used the wooden bridge from Expensive, Short and Slow Bridges.

I think the wooden bridge looks more realistic as coal stages where made of wood. If I use this bridge set in next scenario, there be no brick bridges.

The 2 towers come from Industrial Station Renewals .. I think they suppose to be for coal, but they are a lot like water towers used in NSW, Australia. I also seen square tanks in Queensland too, not sure of other states, and other counties if they have the round or square tanks.

Hope the people who like designing bridges for the game might make a set that has all the bridges we have available now and so that wooden and brick ones too can be used in same game.
Attachments
CoalStage1.jpg
Coal Stage 1
(192.37 KiB) Downloaded 3 times
CoalStage2.jpg
Coal Stage 2
(196.41 KiB) Downloaded 3 times
Coal Stage 3
Coal Stage 3
CoalStage3.jpg (142.4 KiB) Viewed 2378 times
Soot Happens
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All my projects are GPLv2 License unless stated.
Auz Road Sets: viewtopic.php?f=29&t=87335
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GarryG
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

Hi all, I started the scenario again with lots improvements. I could have just updated the ones I done, but I also updated and added some files not used before so to use them need to start from scratch.

Some of the new files I am adding are:

Useless Tracks - found at Check on Line Contents. reason to use this, I'm only building lines that where in use between 1930 and 1940. Any lines opened after 1940, I intend to use useless tracks to mark out this area and put a label showing what date that line was opened. Also labelling dates lines closed too. See if you can play the game to these time lines.

CS stations - extras - (stat-cs_extras-win-ottd.grf) can be found at http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php? ... lit=fences .. has some great station tiles and car parks to place at your railway stations and next to bus depots.

Brick Freight Stations - Some nice freight station tiles .. can be found at https://bundles.openttdcoop.org/?C=M&O=D .. look for the "grfpack" has some other goodies in it too.

Industrial Stations Set v0.98 - (jcindstaw.grf) has some extra freight station tiles can be found at http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=336878#p336878

Pre-industrial era houses - (preindustrial.grf) .. check on line contents .. adds a power station and allow houses to accept coal. When you add this file to your games don't forget to change the parameters if you want the houses to accept the coal. Remember many houses used coal to do there cooking and heating and I believe some still do. This file if loaded before FIRS 1.4.4 and some of the FIRS snakebites will work fine.

Also intend to add Town and Industry - Basic Industries (tai_industry.grf) - Check on line contents. If loaded before FIRS 1.44 and some snakebites versions will work fine and provide a few extra industries.

Last time I lengthened many goods sidings to fit a train, but in real a whole train never entered these sidings. A portion of the train was left on the main line while the engine placed or picked up wagons in the siding. many sidings where small and only held a few wagons, so I will make the sidings small too. I will not put in stations and signals, let you have fun doing that.

Broadmeadow Marshalling yards, honeysuckle, Newcastle and Port Waratah were large. A bit hard to make them to the plans I got, but will make it close as possible.

The plans I have for collieries, many had wagon repair sidings and work shops. I think these be good places to put a train depot to maintain your train. So I putting these sidings in too and you can decide if you want to put a depot there or not.

Like to thank those who have held me with ideas to improve what I done so far.

I will not be releasing this version I making now till finished. Could be a few weeks.
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Toffo
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Posts: 52
Joined: 04 Jun 2009 10:59
Location: NSW, Australia

Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by Toffo »

That sounds really cool, great job!

If I might make a suggestion, it would be good if you could make one version without the rail already built, and when the "base scenario" is finished then make another version with the rail added in. Maybe the barebones version could even have no vehicle or eyecandy NewGRFs and then you could add those NewGRFs in to your final version.

I've checked out the versions you've made and while they've got excellent attention to detail (I feel like I'm checking out Google Maps in OpenTTD, I could practically see my house!), it doesn't really leave much for another player to do.

Anyway, awesome job again, congratulations on what you've achieved!

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GarryG
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Joined: 14 Feb 2015 00:44
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Re: Want to building a scenerio Newcastle Australia

Post by GarryG »

Thanks for your suggestion.

I will do what you suggest and make one without rails and objects and a another with rails added but without stations, depots, signals and objects.

Been looking at idea just do Sydney suburban network. If so might border it with Waterfall (Illawarra Line), Campbelltown (Southern Line), Emu Plains (Western Line) and Cowan (Northern Line). Beyond those places do one or 2 major stations so can arrange cargo that was handled on those lines are available. When you got a good passenger suburban network running, see if can run the freight trains on those lines too.

What Scenarios I build will be of New South Wales Australia, as I have access to track and signal diagrams and other information to help me make it that much better

All suggestion that you and other provide is appreciated.
Soot Happens
Screenshot Of The Month Winner March 2020
All my projects are GPLv2 License unless stated.
Auz Road Sets: viewtopic.php?f=29&t=87335
Auz Project Releases: viewtopic.php?f=67&t=84725
Auz Trains: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=74193
Auz Industry Sets: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=74471
Auz Objects: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=75657
Auz Bridges: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=75248
Auz Stations: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=76390
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