Random Transport Chatter

[Chrill]

US transportation is so far behind Sweden's it's not even funny

Now now, let's learn from the Swedes. They know best.

[Pilot]

Well, today could be a fun day on Britain's railways!

The only one out of these 3 operators striking that I'm surprised at is Merseyrail, and that's simply because I thought they were all DOO already! I wonder how Northern would be able to "protect jobs and pay" as promised however, would they be doing a similar thing to Southern's train supervisor (is that what they were called?). If these guys still end up on the train's, I see a lot of drivers forgetting the DOO and asking them to do it anyway.

[YNM]

US transportation is so far behind Sweden's it's not even funny

Now now, let's learn from the Swedes. They know best.

Interesting they interviewed someone from down here

Still, I suppose the point is just public transport wasn't (and isn't) the main mode there. They have more roads than rails, and more airport / airstrip than stations.

Well, today could be a fun day on Britain's railways!

The only one out of these 3 operators striking that I'm surprised at is Merseyrail, and that's simply because I thought they were all DOO already! I wonder how Northern would be able to "protect jobs and pay" as promised however, would they be doing a similar thing to Southern's train supervisor (is that what they were called?). If these guys still end up on the train's, I see a lot of drivers forgetting the DOO and asking them to do it anyway.

Considering the size of the crowd on your network(s), would having more people to help around (least on platforms) helps ?

[Dave]

Well, today could be a fun day on Britain's railways!

The only one out of these 3 operators striking that I'm surprised at is Merseyrail, and that's simply because I thought they were all DOO already! I wonder how Northern would be able to "protect jobs and pay" as promised however, would they be doing a similar thing to Southern's train supervisor (is that what they were called?). If these guys still end up on the train's, I see a lot of drivers forgetting the DOO and asking them to do it anyway.

One would suggest that's not a safe system of work...!

[Pilot]

Well, today could be a fun day on Britain's railways!

The only one out of these 3 operators striking that I'm surprised at is Merseyrail, and that's simply because I thought they were all DOO already! I wonder how Northern would be able to "protect jobs and pay" as promised however, would they be doing a similar thing to Southern's train supervisor (is that what they were called?). If these guys still end up on the train's, I see a lot of drivers forgetting the DOO and asking them to do it anyway.

One would suggest that's not a safe system of work...!

Oh indeed it wouldn't be. I just feel a lot of driver's would start to flaunt these rules if you start to give them people who are fully qualified as Guard's on their "Driver Only" trains.

[Dave]

I think any driver found doing that would be called in for a meeting with no tea and certainly no biscuits! You can't refuse to carry out a safety critical task, even if someone else can do it!

[Redirect Left]

Had to get a bus to Denby Dale, as there are no trains at all running on the Penistone Line today.
From what I can tell, the unions are fighting a losing battle. At some point DOO will happen, nothing stands in the path of progress, only slows it down.

[Pacific RailRoad]

I just found out this topic and just wondering what this is?

P/s : picture by me.

[supermop]

I just found out this topic and just wondering what this is?

P/s : picture by me.

I am not sure - maybe someone who is more of an expert here can confirm - but I think it might be an Airplane.

[Pilot]

I just found out this topic and just wondering what this is?

P/s : picture by me.

I am not sure - maybe someone who is more of an expert here can confirm - but I think it might be an Airplane.

As I can't see a registration, nor make out which flight it is on, I can confirm that it is a UFO

Interesting to see Small Planet at Saigon though, however, it's probably similar to Vueling leasing some of their Aircraft out there.

EDIT - I should have probably called it Ho Chi Minh, shouldn't I?

Further EDIT - After a little research, I found this about Small Planet. Makes sense, they have very few Winter Operations in Europe

In September 2015 the company announced that during the next 5 winters, several aircraft (and flight deck crews) will be transferred to the Southeast Asia to operate from Siem Reap town in Cambodia to China, South Korea and Vietnam on behalf of Cambodian airline SKYANGKOR.

[Dave]

RL is right... the first trains had a brakeman in every carriage, a driver, a fireman...

This is just the final evolution before we see even the drivers off.

The railway has run on being more efficient for nearly 200 years.

[Redirect Left]

From what I can tell, the unions are fighting a losing battle. At some point DOO will happen, nothing stands in the path of progress, only slows it down.

As much as I hate being probably correct in this instance. I do believe progress is marching forward a little faster than advisable in this instance. No one seems to have proven that DOO is entirely safe, and the technology they'll use can entirely make up for the loss of a conductor. Hopefully before they fully implement it, they'll come up with some additional sensors, perhaps a line of sight down the train, to ensure that something like this cannot happen, admittedly in that case, it did happen with a guard though...

Unfortunately progress is and always will keep marching forward, although I do fear in this case, safety may be at genuine risk, ultimately though, and I think we all know it, the unions will lose the battle, and DOO will arrive sooner than they (and possibly those with technical knowledge of the situation like some of us here at TT-F) like.

[Pacific RailRoad]

can anyone tell me what's going on?

[Chris]

DOO has been proven as safe and effective though.. some trains in the UK have been run on it for years and years. I still agree with the strikers though - northern trains require conductors as it is rare for stations to have barriers. So there has to be 2 people on the train. The only reason I can see to implement DOO is to reduce the conductors responsibilities and thus pay.

[Pilot]

can anyone tell me what's going on?

This thread is for the discussion of anything Transport related, that doesn't warrant it's own thread. The current topic of conversation is mostly the phase in off DOO (Driver-only Operated) trains, which are currently causing a large amount of strikes in the UK.

northern trains require conductors as it is rare for stations to have barriers. So there has to be 2 people on the train. The only reason I can see to implement DOO is to reduce the conductors responsibilities and thus pay.

Indeed, even many of the major station's that Northern serve don't have barriers, and places like Manchester Piccadilly and Victoria only got there's in the last 2 years or so (and the one's a Piccadilly only cover platforms 5-10 (I think) - Piccadilly did used to have people on the platforms at Peak times instead of Barriers however). Of course, Northern have promised that they won't be cutting Pay or Jobs though, so I would imagine they will still keep someone on the train as something like a "Revenue Protection Officer" and remove their responsibilities towards the doors.

It will certainly be interesting to see if Northern start a rapid expansion of barriers in order to ensure that fares are collected, and I'd be interested in seeing how they implement this at some Commuter stations where the barriers would have to be out in the open (I've always seen the barriers in some form of Building, so I assume that they can't be left to the elements).

[Pacific RailRoad]

EDIT - I should have probably called it Ho Chi Minh, shouldn't I?

you could call it Saigon if you want lol , most people here prefer saigon because it's shorter to read.

[Redirect Left]

(I've always seen the barriers in some form of Building, so I assume that they can't be left to the elements).

I imagine for outdoors, they'd have to move all of the holes to the side, none on top, with some sort of overhangng bit of plastic to make sure the rain doesn't get into the machine. I imagine barriers that are outside would also get vandalised frequently, and probably need to be the type that returns your ticket instead of snatching it, so Northern don't need to hire someone with a van to go around emptying the barriers of used tickets. Furthermore, outside stations nearly always have more than one entry point (officially not but they're nearly always breachable somewhere), so they'd need to spend a lot to fix those, else people will just go around the barriers, if they don't jump the normal barriers to begin with.

Would look quite frankly ridiculous for some of the smaller middle of no where stations if they got barriers. So out of place

[Pilot]

Would look quite frankly ridiculous for some of the smaller middle of no where stations if they got barriers. So out of place

Just imagine Denton and Reddish South getting barriers for the one train a week that serves them

[Redirect Left]

I was thinking of the quiet village stations on Penistone Line, but yes, that'd be even more ridiculous

[Chris]

Of course, Northern have promised that they won't be cutting Pay or Jobs though, so I would imagine they will still keep someone on the train as something like a "Revenue Protection Officer" and remove their responsibilities towards the doors.

Yes, well forgive me for my cynicism, but these guarantees and promises are obviously designed to be betrayed in a few years. Reducing their responsibilities will result in a reduction in their pay packet.

What is the point of introducing DOO for the TOC in the first place if they genuinely will not reduce staff on trains or pay for those staff? They'll have to invest in the DOO equipment but won't make any financial saving.

In a few years the guard/conductor pay packet will be cut and the TOC will also have eroded the union's power as trains will be able to run with only the driver, thus preventing further significant strike action by the guards/conductors.