Cumbria Rail accident

csuke · Post by **csuke** » 24 Feb 2007 21:05

retracted for the good of the forum because people dont like me expressing opinions and what i believe to be true

andel · Post by **andel** » 24 Feb 2007 21:05

csuke wrote:NB: Flame away for calling me a conspiracy theorist, but the Potters bar information, i am informed, is true, I know a lot of people who work in the railway industry. The second piece is pure speculation but just wait and see...

I too know a lot of peope in the industry. Such comments can lead to law suits. I would suggest you retract your statement.

csuke · Post by **csuke** » 24 Feb 2007 21:07

Im sorry, you appear to be joking but seem to have missed any sort of smilies off your post which confuses me slightly...

TheGrew · Post by **TheGrew** » 24 Feb 2007 21:08

andel doesen't joke about something this serious

andel · Post by **andel** » 24 Feb 2007 21:11

csuke wrote:Im sorry, you appear to be joking but seem to have missed any sort of smilies off your post which confuses me slightly...

There were no smilies intended. Please be aware, with the seriousness of such an incident, speculation often leads to upset. Please take this from someone who has a legal-minded approach to such things, and retract your statement.

Best wishes,

Griff · Post by **Griff** » 25 Feb 2007 11:49

An early report into the Cumbria train crash is likely to be published within the next few days, investigators say.

Investigators are spending the day shoring up the road leading away from the crash site to allow heavy lifting gear to gain access to the carriages.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6394451.stm

Train-a-Mania · Post by **Train-a-Mania** » 25 Feb 2007 17:46

It seems that the inspection is fairly straight-forward.

If an Amtrak train derailed on a Union Pacific line, Amtrak would sue the UP for faulty track, the UP would sue Amtrak for delays, etc. Maybe not quite that dramatic, but you get the point.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » 25 Feb 2007 23:18

Passengers are being reassured that the rail network is safe following checks on points similar to those at the centre of the Cumbria train crash.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6394451.stm

Brianetta · Post by **Brianetta** » 27 Feb 2007 11:32

jpmaster wrote:Indeed, but thats what you get when Network Rail subcontracts track maintenance to other companies where the workers are either incompetent and too lazy to do it properly or 'foreigners' who do not know what they are doing.

You should go to university and get a degree in railway maintenance before you are let loose on the railways, at least then we could be sure they people working the line are qualified.

Nobody on the railway is there without knowing what they are doing, foreign or not. There are specific qualifications that railway maintenance workers are expected to complete before they are "let loose" on the actual line.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » 27 Feb 2007 14:30

Brianetta wrote:
jpmaster wrote:Indeed, but thats what you get when Network Rail subcontracts track maintenance to other companies where the workers are either incompetent and too lazy to do it properly or 'foreigners' who do not know what they are doing.

You should go to university and get a degree in railway maintenance before you are let loose on the railways, at least then we could be sure they people working the line are qualified.
Nobody on the railway is there without knowing what they are doing, foreign or not. There are specific qualifications that railway maintenance workers are expected to complete before they are "let loose" on the actual line.

And yet the investigation into the Potters Bar railway crash showed that nuts and bolts on the tracks were not being screwed in correctly, they were hitting the bolts so thenuts would not be able to come off. That doesnt hold much hope for knowing what they are doing.

Post by **Dave** » 27 Feb 2007 14:56

Doesn't it?

I'd call it careless rather than a lack of knowledge.

John · Post by **John** » 27 Feb 2007 15:17

Dave Worley wrote:Doesn't it?

I'd call it careless rather than a lack of knowledge.

indeed, just because someone is qualified to do something doesn't mean they will do it correctly...

Griff · Post by **Griff** » 27 Feb 2007 15:20

John wrote:
Dave Worley wrote:Doesn't it?

I'd call it careless rather than a lack of knowledge.
indeed, just because someone is qualified to do something doesn't mean they will do it correctly...

They should do! ..its a railway after all, if they dont do it correctly you're putting lives at risk. Surely that would be an incentive to do it properly.

John · Post by **John** » 27 Feb 2007 15:31

jpmaster wrote:
John wrote:
Dave Worley wrote:Doesn't it?

I'd call it careless rather than a lack of knowledge.
indeed, just because someone is qualified to do something doesn't mean they will do it correctly...
They should do! ..its a railway after all, if they dont do it correctly you're putting lives at risk. Surely that would be an incentive to do it properly.

they should indeed - if it was the same reasons as potters bar then there is no excuse. sadly however we only really change our ways when tragedy does occur... (because then people realise it is vital to do it properly as people will die, instead of thinking - oh the quality inspector/h&s officer is just being pedantic)

Post by **orudge** » 27 Feb 2007 16:48

And, despite everyone being utterly careful, accidents will still happen, as an episode of Thomas the Tank Engine once said.

Thankfully, they're very rare on our railway network, and in this case, the loss could have been much worse.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » 27 Feb 2007 16:57

orudge wrote:And, despite everyone being utterly careful, accidents will still happen, as an episode of Thomas the Tank Engine once said. Thankfully, they're very rare on our railway network, and in this case, the loss could have been much worse.

Just lucky the 390 is built like a tank.

Ameecher · Post by **Ameecher** » 27 Feb 2007 17:04

The RAIB interim report into the accident

I heard on the Radio this morning (this is radio 4 by the way) that Network Rail had accepted responsibility for the accident.

Post by **Dave** » 27 Feb 2007 17:10

The RAIB interim is a very nice report which clearly shows that the main investigation is on the points.

I've seen more pictures of the Pendo's frame and it's actually mind-blowing how well it stood up to the challenge. Even the driving car is intact.

The driver's been speaking frm hospital up in Preston today.

Sounds like he's got nothing at all to do with the accident, at least.

Ameecher · Post by **Ameecher** » 27 Feb 2007 17:13

Dave Worley wrote:Sounds like he's got nothing at all to do with the accident, at least.

apart from being the driver! Ok, serious. The report basically is saying that the train derailed at the points and stayed upright for a few hundreds yards, then the front car was spun round by the following coaches and dragged the first 5 down the embankment. Nothing wrong with the driver or the train itself, the blame here lies with the points. Whether that is due to poor maintenance or fatigue of the points themselves is so far yet to be known.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » 27 Feb 2007 17:16

Ameecher wrote:
Dave Worley wrote:Sounds like he's got nothing at all to do with the accident, at least.
apart from being the driver! Ok, serious. The report basically is saying that the train derailed at the points and stayed upright for a few hundreds yards, then the front car was spun round by the following coaches and dragged the first 5 down the embankment. Nothing wrong with the driver or the train itself, the blame here lies with the points. Whether that is due to poor maintenance or fatigue of the points themselves is so far yet to be known.

BBC news was saying yesterday that the stretcher bars were out of place and/or missing nuts and bolts.

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