TEmpire Engines - TRoS Engine - Uzurpator Engine

Discussions related to programming Transport Empire.

Moderator: Transport Empire Moderators

Post Reply
User avatar
eis_os
TTDPatch Developer
TTDPatch Developer
Posts: 3602
Joined: 07 Mar 2003 13:10
Location: Germany
Contact:

TEmpire Engines - TRoS Engine - Uzurpator Engine

Post by eis_os » 16 Mar 2007 09:28

Hello

As uzurpator wishes to have his topic free from side discusssion I started now the dedicated topic. (This is a personal view and understanding of them, you can correct me keep in mind, if I did something fundamental wrong in the review it may be the problem of your PR)

First, where do we get the Engine(s)?

Uzurpator Engine - non existent - I call them UzuEngine because I am lazy :)
TRoS - http://tros.ath.cx/subversion

Some review:
TRoS Engine is a addition on top of OpenGL, in it current state it looks like that you still need to handle quite a bunch of OpenGL stuff yourself. You seem to have all builddepencies (except nvidia cg) in the svn so a compile should be possible without much problems. Some signs of Network support spotted, aswell as MySQL support. Personally I don't know why an engine needs MySQL support. In TROS there is already a gui system. Currently from outside you can't yet see the goal or the design of TRoS when you want to use it.

The license for it isn't yet clear. Consindering the TEmpire agreement that the Game should be GPL the decision useing TRoS engine is astonishing.


UzuEngine
Nothing really to review yet, from the said specs, it should be quite good on multiprocessors, this can create subtile problems however. uzurpator promised it shouldn't by design. Currently we don't have much to see.
It will have the necessary base, aka 3D Support, Network, Multithreading, GUI, Terrain rendering
As it's an engine directly for TEmpire it may be better in code size and overhead.
-edit-
Uzurpator writes it together with the game core, but still seperate so the core can be used together with TRoS. Uzurpator made a deadline: "16 of june 2007" for a "running TE alpha" with thread, modifable terrain, and a some bits of a GUI
-/edit-

The license for it isn't clear either as we don't have seen code. We can only speculate if UzuEngine will do what TEmpire need.

Both Engines looks like useing OpenGL exclusivly. As XeryusTC pointed out atleast TRoS is fixed to it. The OpenGL experience on low end hardware may be crippled on Vista.

---
Other Engines you may want to look:
Lightfeather http://lf.mmdevel.de/
Irrlicht: http://irrlicht.sourceforge.net/
Ogre: http://www.ogre3d.org/
Linderdaum: http://www.linderdaum.com
Last edited by eis_os on 16 Mar 2007 10:39, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
uzurpator
Transport Empire Moderator
Transport Empire Moderator
Posts: 2134
Joined: 10 Jan 2003 12:21
Location: Wroclaw, Poland / Katowice, Poland

Post by uzurpator » 16 Mar 2007 09:39

Clarification.

UzuEngine is TE engine - ie, it aims to write the game logic. All the auxiliaries - like graphics, sound etc are pluggable by switching the interface class (I might go for dynamic linking). The only hard dependancy (ie - found all over the code) is boost::threads.

TRoS is the general purpose game engine. It has all the auxilaries, and leaves the core to the programmer. I am writing the core (hint, hint).

Both are not comparable, as thay deal with different things.

I see no problem with switching to another auxilary later.
All art and vehicle stats I authored for TT and derivatives are as of now PUBLIC DOMAIN! Use as you see fit
Just say NO to the TT fan-art sprite licensing madness. Public domain your art as well.

User avatar
XeryusTC
Tycoon
Tycoon
Posts: 15415
Joined: 02 May 2005 11:05
Skype: XeryusTC
Location: localhost

Re: TEmpire Engines - TRoS Engine - Uzurpator Engine

Post by XeryusTC » 16 Mar 2007 13:59

eis_os wrote:Personally I don't know why an engine needs MySQL support.
Because there is a need for storage on TRoS' game server as it is a MMORPG.

And if UzuEngine is "only" for TEmpires logic and not a complete engine we could look into it using TRoS. I don't agree with the way uzurpator informed what UzuEngine is too us in that case as it was explained to be a complete replacement engine.
Don't panic - My YouTube channel - Follow me on twitter (@XeryusTC) - Play Tribes: Ascend - Tired of Dropbox? Try SpiderOak (use this link and we both get 1GB extra space)
Image
OpenTTD: manual #openttdcoop: blog | wiki | public server | NewGRF pack | DevZone
Image Image Image Image Image Image Image

User avatar
uzurpator
Transport Empire Moderator
Transport Empire Moderator
Posts: 2134
Joined: 10 Jan 2003 12:21
Location: Wroclaw, Poland / Katowice, Poland

Post by uzurpator » 16 Mar 2007 14:17

What I am working on is a complete package - but this package has very little hard dependancies - that is - i can throw away Ogre and use something else. I really have no objections that TRoS will be linked in instead.

This is also in the lines of my advice to you - if you already made an engine - make it as modular as logically required - Ie - if someone just wants to use the rendering pipeline, then he/she sould be able to just do that.
All art and vehicle stats I authored for TT and derivatives are as of now PUBLIC DOMAIN! Use as you see fit
Just say NO to the TT fan-art sprite licensing madness. Public domain your art as well.

User avatar
XeryusTC
Tycoon
Tycoon
Posts: 15415
Joined: 02 May 2005 11:05
Skype: XeryusTC
Location: localhost

Post by XeryusTC » 16 Mar 2007 14:22

You are able to only use some parts, we have the core, graphics, network, database and sound currently. You will always need the core but all the others can be left out, TRoS client doesn't use the database part ATM and the servers don't use the graphics and sound parts. So it is (almost) fully up to the coder what to use.
Don't panic - My YouTube channel - Follow me on twitter (@XeryusTC) - Play Tribes: Ascend - Tired of Dropbox? Try SpiderOak (use this link and we both get 1GB extra space)
Image
OpenTTD: manual #openttdcoop: blog | wiki | public server | NewGRF pack | DevZone
Image Image Image Image Image Image Image

User avatar
Purno
Tycoon
Tycoon
Posts: 16663
Joined: 30 Mar 2004 12:30
Location: Almere, The Netherlands

Re: TEmpire Engines - TRoS Engine - Uzurpator Engine

Post by Purno » 16 Mar 2007 14:33

XeryusTC wrote:
eis_os wrote:Personally I don't know why an engine needs MySQL support.
Because there is a need for storage on TRoS' game server as it is a MMORPG.
Same would apply to a TE server, I assume?
Contributor to the The 2cc Set and Dutch Trainset. Inventor of the Metro concept. Retired Graphics Artist.
Image Image
Download TT | Latest TTDPatch | OpenTTD | OpenTTDCoop | BaNaNaS: OpenTTD content system | 2048² OTTD scenario of the Netherlands
GRF Codec | GRF Crawler | GRF Maker | Usefull graphics & tools sites | NML Documentation Wiki | NFO Documentation Wiki
All my graphics are licensed under GPL. "Always remember you're unique, just like everyone else."

User avatar
XeryusTC
Tycoon
Tycoon
Posts: 15415
Joined: 02 May 2005 11:05
Skype: XeryusTC
Location: localhost

Re: TEmpire Engines - TRoS Engine - Uzurpator Engine

Post by XeryusTC » 16 Mar 2007 14:36

Purno wrote:
XeryusTC wrote:
eis_os wrote:Personally I don't know why an engine needs MySQL support.
Because there is a need for storage on TRoS' game server as it is a MMORPG.
Same would apply to a TE server, I assume?
No, because TE doesn't have to store any of it's client information into a database or sth. It only needs to be able to read savegames/scenarios. TRoS OTOH will fetch character and account information from a database.
Don't panic - My YouTube channel - Follow me on twitter (@XeryusTC) - Play Tribes: Ascend - Tired of Dropbox? Try SpiderOak (use this link and we both get 1GB extra space)
Image
OpenTTD: manual #openttdcoop: blog | wiki | public server | NewGRF pack | DevZone
Image Image Image Image Image Image Image

User avatar
Purno
Tycoon
Tycoon
Posts: 16663
Joined: 30 Mar 2004 12:30
Location: Almere, The Netherlands

Re: TEmpire Engines - TRoS Engine - Uzurpator Engine

Post by Purno » 16 Mar 2007 14:53

XeryusTC wrote:
Purno wrote:
XeryusTC wrote: Because there is a need for storage on TRoS' game server as it is a MMORPG.
Same would apply to a TE server, I assume?
No, because TE doesn't have to store any of it's client information into a database or sth. It only needs to be able to read savegames/scenarios. TRoS OTOH will fetch character and account information from a database.
Wouldn't a account thingy be cool for TE multiplayer too? Eventually? At least that could somehow prevent the cheaters and noobs they have at OTTD multiplayer, couldn't it?
Contributor to the The 2cc Set and Dutch Trainset. Inventor of the Metro concept. Retired Graphics Artist.
Image Image
Download TT | Latest TTDPatch | OpenTTD | OpenTTDCoop | BaNaNaS: OpenTTD content system | 2048² OTTD scenario of the Netherlands
GRF Codec | GRF Crawler | GRF Maker | Usefull graphics & tools sites | NML Documentation Wiki | NFO Documentation Wiki
All my graphics are licensed under GPL. "Always remember you're unique, just like everyone else."

User avatar
eis_os
TTDPatch Developer
TTDPatch Developer
Posts: 3602
Joined: 07 Mar 2003 13:10
Location: Germany
Contact:

Post by eis_os » 16 Mar 2007 17:37

No, you can't cheat in *TTD*, as soon as you cheat in TTD it will desync... This doesn't mean exploiting game / design flaws to be able to cheat, but this wouldn't be solved with an Database either (I may be helpfull to reproduce the conditions)

ObjData in SQL? How should an user install and uninstall a new object?
TTDPatch dev in retirement ... Search a grf, try Grf Crawler 0.9 - now with even faster details view and new features...
Image

User avatar
Purno
Tycoon
Tycoon
Posts: 16663
Joined: 30 Mar 2004 12:30
Location: Almere, The Netherlands

Post by Purno » 16 Mar 2007 17:57

eis_os wrote:No, you can't cheat in *TTD*, as soon as you cheat in TTD it will desync... This doesn't mean exploiting game / design flaws to be able to cheat, but this wouldn't be solved with an Database either (I may be helpfull to reproduce the conditions)
I rather mean annoying behaviour, like blocking ones railroads with the buy land tool, or crashing people's trucks with trains on purpose, etc.
Contributor to the The 2cc Set and Dutch Trainset. Inventor of the Metro concept. Retired Graphics Artist.
Image Image
Download TT | Latest TTDPatch | OpenTTD | OpenTTDCoop | BaNaNaS: OpenTTD content system | 2048² OTTD scenario of the Netherlands
GRF Codec | GRF Crawler | GRF Maker | Usefull graphics & tools sites | NML Documentation Wiki | NFO Documentation Wiki
All my graphics are licensed under GPL. "Always remember you're unique, just like everyone else."

Post Reply

Return to “Transport Empire Coding”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest