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PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 8:24 am 
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Hi all,

This thread is regarding a (re-)release of a larger depot GRF, it was originally made by Snorbuckle back in the early days of TTD GRF modification (Long Before OTTD). I plan to update the GRF to make it compatible with modern versions of OTTD and TTDPatch by taking the sprite data from the original exe file and making a newGRF...

Snorbuckle has now shown his support for the GRF :D


In the coming weeks i also plan to produce a version of the sprites for use in a station complex, one day i hope i will be able to make trains be serviced at stations containing these tiles, but time will tell on that one. In the mean time i need help coding the sprites as a station... The details, core PCX and a basic NFO based on the current Big Depot GRF can be found further down the thread...


Cheers

EDIT: Current release is http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=102622

+++UPDATED TO VERSION 0.3+++ +++5th/12/2008+++

+++Added to http://content.openttd.org for Multiplayer Content Control+++ +++17th/1/2008+++

+++Thanks to frosch since OTTD r14902, using the "Advanced setting to keep various building tools active" you can build bigger depots even easier! So thanks frosch :mrgreen: +++

+++racetrack has created a patch to allow Drive-Through Depots here... viewtopic.php?f=33&t=42312&start=0 This is really useful to accompany the Bigger Depots GRF+++

Attachment:
File comment: Bigger Depots can be created by placing depot tiles side-by-side...
Bigger Depot 1.png
Bigger Depot 1.png [ 94.52 KiB | Viewed 63065 times ]


Attachment:
File comment: Bigger Depots used with the ISR set can be used to create impressive illusions...
Bigger Depot 2.png
Bigger Depot 2.png [ 129.4 KiB | Viewed 64928 times ]


Attachment:
File comment: A heavily used, Service and Fuel Depot for passenger trains... A small Class 08 Diesel Manages the yard... (Created using ISR 0.8.0, Open GFX, SAC's Stolen Trees, Pikkas Urban Renewal, UKRS, TTRS 3, and Bigger Depots)
Bigger Depot 3.png [496.35 KiB]
Downloaded 1409 times

EDIT: Current release is http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=102622

Version 0.1
- Made GRF compatible with OTTD and TTDPATCH (Untested; I use OTTD nowadays)

Version 0.2
- Added Title and Description thanks to help from Ammler and the NFORenum utility

Version 0.3
- Added Snorbuckle's credit to the GRF as original sprite author :) (Thanks to "White Rabbit" for this info :bow: )

Know Issues:
- There is a noticeable area within the entrance to the depot that is occupied by grass... I would remove this, but it doesn't work with all track-sets as a result. Suggestions are welcome.

To Do:
-Modify the Bigger Depots GRF to be compatible with NuTracks and the UK Railway Track Set, and update the BaNaNaS distribution
-Add more modern depots after 1990
-Add Bigger Monorail Depots
-Add Bigger Maglev Depots
-Add Bigger Narrow-gauge Depots
-Add SNOW versions of each Depot
-Add SAND-SWEPT versions of each Depot
-Add a parameter to select Bigger/Modern/Monorail/Maglev/NG graphics for further rail types
-Wait to see if Depots are changed in OTTD to permit conjoining and drag-drop placement and modify GRF as appropriate
-Wait to see if Depots in OTTD are permitted to be part of station complexes for "go to station xxx for service" orders as i suggested in this thread and modify GRF as appropriate

EDIT: Current release is http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=102622

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Last edited by JacobD88 on Mon Jan 31, 2011 12:45 pm, edited 38 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Big Depots GRF
PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 8:55 am 
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Try grdtogrf.
Or grfcrawler.
Or the request-for-graphics thread in the TTD forums.
Or, if all else fails, Google.

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 Post subject: Re: Big Depots GRF
PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 10:05 am 
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CUT FROM ORIGINAL 1st POST....

I need a little help, back in the days of early GRF modification/creation, a larger depot was created for TTDPatch that modified the core graphics using an exe, this is attached. Now i can't seem to find the original developer to ask permission to modify the graphic, but i would like to know if there's someone out there who knows how to extract it from the exe and make it an independant GRF to use in OTTD... Or if no-one can do it for me be able to explain it in step-by-step to me, I'm aspergic and find the mass of different instructions confusing...

The reason for wanting this depot is it's really the only "long/big depot" grf i've ever liked... But if i use it in OTTD now, OTTD complains on start-up that the core files have been modified... In addition i use OpenGFX so even if i do patch the game, OpenGFX overides the depot anyway... With a seperate GRF i can give that priority over OpenGFX...


DaleStan wrote:
Try grdtogrf.
Or grfcrawler.
Or the request-for-graphics thread in the TTD forums.
Or, if all else fails, Google.


Hi thanks to the pointer regarding grdtogrf, i now have the attached grf file...

However OTTD doesn't accept it as a valid newgrf, nor does it recognise the one already in the TTD graphics request thread, so i need to work out what in need to do next, I'm guessing from what I've read i now need to decode the grf and modify it to be recognised and used by OTTD... From what I've read i need GRF codec for this??

I seem to remember reading something about nfo files containing the data i need to modify the bigdepots grf, but i have no idea of how to add this data, then recompile it... Googling just leaves me with a mass of seemingly irrelevent data, most of which was written a long time ago...

Any help would be great as its probably easier to compile this grf myself than wait for someone to do it as a request...

Cheers

EDIT: GRF Crawler doesn't contain this big depot, nor can i find it on the forums...

EDIT: Please also find the nfo file and pcx file created by GRFCodec... Now what do i need to edit or add??

EDIT: Files Removed

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Last edited by JacobD88 on Thu Nov 20, 2008 11:40 am, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: [WIP] Big Depots GRF
PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 2:08 pm 
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well, firstly, decode with grfcodec useing -p2, as that is the windows palette, hence the "wierd pink" colors...

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 Post subject: Re: [WIP] Big Depots GRF
PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 4:12 pm 
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DJ Nekkid wrote:
well, firstly, decode with grfcodec useing -p2, as that is the windows palette, hence the "wierd pink" colors...


Ah i did wander about that, i just thought maybe those colours were displayed correctly in-game...

OK find attached PCX and NFO...

What do i now need to change in the nfo to make it OTTD compatible (and override OpenGFX) before recompiling (using the -p2 command again im guessing)??

Thanks

EDIT: Files Removed

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High-Functioning Autistic & Proud... National Autistic Society * Asperger Foundation
My (O)TTD Work...BIGGER DEPOTS (REL.) & SERVICING-STATIONS (WIP) * Advanced DEPOT DESIGNS * SCREENSHOTS
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I now work for DE PHOTO - CLICK TO BOOK US TO SHOOT YOUR EVENT! We Shoot Kids with Canons!


Last edited by JacobD88 on Thu Nov 20, 2008 11:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: [WIP] Big Depots GRF
PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 6:37 pm 
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The easiest solution, IMO, is to run grdtogrf again. But this time, use the -g command-line option.
Using -i would also be nice, but is not required.

If not that, then modify the action 8 appropriately and re-encode. NFORenum can be used to check your work.

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 Post subject: Re: [WIP] Big Depots GRF
PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 6:54 pm 
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DaleStan wrote:
The easiest solution, IMO, is to run grdtogrf again. But this time, use the -g command-line option.
Using -i would also be nice, but is not required.

If not that, then modify the action 8 appropriately and re-encode. NFORenum can be used to check your work.


Ah thanks... Got a working GRF now... Though i still can't get my head around action 8 so i can add a GRF title and description... I just want to add the title "Bigger Train Depot" and the Description "A larger train depot, original graphics by unknown"... Will keep trying and hopefully get sorted for a second release...

Still i now have it in OTTD at least. Thanks for the help with which commands to use...

Please find attached...

1st Release :D ---FILE REMOVED--- See first post for current version

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Last edited by JacobD88 on Fri Dec 05, 2008 11:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: [WIP] Big Depots GRF
PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 10:28 am 
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JacobD88 wrote:
Though i still can't get my head around action 8 so i can add a GRF title and description... I just want to add the title "Bigger Train Depot" and the Description "A larger train depot, original graphics by unknown"...


http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=Action8
Code:
0 * 0   08 07 ID ID ID ID "Bigger Train Depot" 00 "A larger train depot, original graphics by unknown" 00


Check the wikipage for the GRFID and be sure, it is unique.

Greets
Ammler

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 10:49 am 
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JacobD88 wrote:
Please find attached...

Welcome another dubious member to the unmanageable zoo of .grfs.

regards
Michael

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 11:45 am 
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Michael, what's the problem with yet another depot grf? People will use only one per game anyway. :)

And I kind of like this big depot because of its simplicity, usually I use this one in TTDP.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 12:21 pm 
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Nagyzee wrote:
Michael, what's the problem with yet another depot grf? People will use only one per game anyway. :)

And I kind of like this big depot because of its simplicity, usually I use this one in TTDP.


Thanks for the support for the GRF, this is the main reason i wanted to re-code and re-release the original sprites. I too love the simplicity and it accompanies the UKRS and ISR sets so nicely. In addition, it is appropriate to all decades of TTD and OTTD, it never looks too modern or too old :D

As to Michaels comment about the unmanageable zoo of GRFs; now i have actually added the title and description to the GRF (With great thanks to Ammler btw) as well as found a (hopefully) unique GRF ID, i will add the GRF to GRF Crawler so it can be found easily, and not get lost in the forums... And as far as i can see it will be the only other Depot GRF there apart from Nivlheim's and Ben_K's work 8)

Find 2nd Release attached :mrgreen:

---FILE REMOVED--- See first post for current version

NOTE: The GRF ID is different to previous release so if loading a saved game with the old grf in use you will have to re-add the GRF to your list in-game and save/apply the settings to get the depot back in your game :)

EDIT: Now added to GRF Crawler :P

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Last edited by JacobD88 on Fri Dec 05, 2008 11:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 12:38 pm 
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That's not entirely true. :)
Nivelheim has made a very nice depot, too. And there are the modern ones, which are Ameecher's work, if I remember correctly. Also some train sets have unique depots as well, if I'm not mistaken.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 12:57 pm 
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Nagyzee wrote:
That's not entirely true. :)
Nivelheim has made a very nice depot, too. And there are the modern ones, which are Ameecher's work, if I remember correctly. Also some train sets have unique depots as well, if I'm not mistaken.


Apologies i thought Ameecher's modern depots were actually ben_k's :oops: and yep forgot Nivelheims at first, especially bad as i used to use them before creating this GRF :roll: but i still wouldn't call it a zoo of GRF's, and as there are only a few on GRF Crawler (3 including mine that i can find at time of writing this) and a few on the forums and the rest are part of other sets anyway... I wouldn't say it was unmanageable...

Anyway it doesn't matter i don't want to turn this thread into an argument over Michaels comment. As one of the GRF Kings, he's been there pretty much from the start and I've used his GRFs in my games from the moment he released them... I also greatly miss his fantastic website... So i can't really argue with the guy, he knows his GRFs... I just sometimes wander what drives his intermittent random, sometimes derogatory comments... To say welcome then add an insult or pompous remark doesn't seem too friendly (I'm not sure how to take what he said or even why he would waste a post saying it)... I remember a few years ago when i tried to code a Class 220 train with his help it ended with a comment that i didn't like from him... But i shall leave it there as at heart i have no problem with him, i just think these intermittent comments around the forums are just him being himself... and like i said the "Michaels Comment" part of the thread ends with this message... ++JOB DONE++

The only comments on this thread i need now are ones regarding suggestions, problems, or leads on who the original sprite author is as i REALLY need to credit them... Let alone get to know if i can even use their work in this GRF...

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 12:25 am 
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Answers a basic though trivial problem with OTTD's semi-realism. I will definitely put this one to good use!! 8)

And don't be surprised if .grf authors want to include this in their building sets.

(Now we can work on making it bi-directional! :P )


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 6:54 pm 
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SirXavius wrote:
Answers a basic though trivial problem with OTTD's semi-realism. I will definitely put this one to good use!! 8)

And don't be surprised if .grf authors want to include this in their building sets.

(Now we can work on making it bi-directional! :P )


Yes making it bi-directional would be great... Does anyone know if Bi-Directionality and Station-like construction of Depots/Servicing yards is currently a feature being worked on?

I know it has frequently been suggested and there are a few threads about it... Both for road vehicles and trains... But i've never been fully sure if it will get to trunk or even be liked as an idea by the OTTD devs... For example Custom Bridgeheads is wanted by many an OTTD player, the lack of it has even stopped some people converting to OTTD (SAC springs to mind as an example of a well-known user) and the devs have never seemed too happy to implement it... Just wandered if custom depots will go the same way... Or if they are (hopefully) in the works?

If so i will definately love to update this GRF to make it compatible as and when i can, but for the time being like i said on my FP... The ISR does an excellent job of creating illusions with this GRF...

I have no qualms with the GRF being used in sets so anyone can feel free to use it, but i think it a matter of courtsey that we at least know who the original sprite author is before that happens, if not i suppose it should just be accredited as mine and unknowns work with help from the forums (as per the credits in the current GRF) :)

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 11:59 am 
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Thanks for your work on this! I am looking forward to trying this out. As someone who uses OTTD as more of a virtual model railroad than a game, I like to make things look semi-realistic, and the big depots are gonna be awesome.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 4:47 pm 
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Funny inverted avaitar, JacobD88. :)

On topic - I will really appreciate such depots if entering speed will be faster - of course train doesn't have to go faster all the length of the depot and then stop on a dime.
I would say some form of station-like speed decrease based on train's max speed (which behaviour at stations is not based on) would be the best.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 4:48 pm 
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very good work :D

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2008 9:49 pm 
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Thanks for the positive feedback everyone :D

My avatar :mrgreen: Yeah i was playing around with a photo of myself and hue/saturation settings in photoshop and got that :lol:

On topic though...

ostlandr - Yes, i love the semi-realism networks that can be produced with all the TTD games, and that's probably the main reason that i wanted to work towards resurrecting this sprite into a new GRF; it's the best UK themed one there is in my opinion... My main hope now is that the devs will do something that will either allow conjoining depots so multiple engines can enter/exit a single depot at once depending on how many are built side-by-side, as well as allowing a drag-drop way to build them as per the stations, or at least go for allowing drag-drop placement to make them easier to build as separate depots... Another idea i would like to see implemented is below...

SirkoZ - Yes, speed into depots is my biggest issue with regards to servicing in TTD games, however one idea i've been toying with and i would love to know if the devs think possible is to change depots from being a unique structure to being a specific group of tiles that can be added to a station complex... I.E they would appear in the station-construction dialogue... This would also allow for them to be added into station sets and it would be great to see the timetable orders to be made to allow "go to station XXX for servicing". I see this as a much easier alternative to rewriting all the depot code to allow for drag-drop, conjoining depots, etc. As the station building code already seems to allow for this so i imagine it is simply of a dev or patcher being able to find the time and means to change the station code to allow some stations to be marked as "Servicing yards"; I.E. Specialist stations that can perform the function of a depot... One of the aspects of these stations could be that the enter/exit speed could be modified using a GRF parameter... Afterall they modified the depot code to allow for "go-to and re-fit" orders so why not change the station code to allow for servicing providing certain depot tiles are present...

The other bonus of changing the station code to allow for servicing is that it would also, hopefully by default allow for bi-directional depots like discussed above, as stations already allow for pass-through or reversing of trains within them...

At least then my mock-ups above wouldn't have to be mock-ups any more, they'd actually work as servicing yards :D

Don't know if this is actually possible, and i'm aware that some coding would be required, but hey suppose i will just wait to see if a dev posts a comment here on what is possible and what isn't :wink:

Also, with me now being predominantly an OTTD player, having left TTD/TTDPatch a year ago, would the OTTD devs even like my idea enough to implement it let alone have the time to do so... Again I'm left thinking back to the fact that whilst custom bridge heads were a great idea, and they even appear in TTDPatch they still seem to be against implementing them in OTTD...

But to summarise, i do have lots of ideas for this depot grf, i'm just waiting to see if OTTD develops in such a way i can add the features to the GRF...

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 05, 2008 6:24 pm 
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