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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 2:25 pm 
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lordazamath wrote:
FooBar wrote:
[GUI icons]
lordazamath, I hate to say, but I think yours are too much of a derived work. Either the shape is changed and the colours kept the same, or the colours changed with the same shape.


Hmm.. if you say mine are very similar to original, then I succeeded :D.. I tried to make them as similar as possible while still having difference.. And I did NOT copy anything.. All new was done by scratch but following the original ones.. For the difference please look this.. I didn't make animation about the cursor ones because thay are different surely.

Hi. Your flashing animation actually would be proof enough of origin. It is clear that they are derivative works "following the original ones". What is needed is to say "I need an icon for Message Settings." and coming up with an idea, and drawing that. The icons are quite important to be visually different, as they will always be in view of every player.

Not saying yours dont look nice - I just think that they sail awfully close to the line (and maybe over it). :)

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 2:34 pm 
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Mchl wrote:
Aren't the coins and the cup a bit to green?


Yes, and you are not the first one to tell :D

I tweaked it a little bit and the green is gone..
(or the other possibility is that I'm colour-blind) :P


Attachments:
GUI_wip.png
GUI_wip.png [ 12 KiB | Viewed 7906 times ]

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 2:34 pm 
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Perhaps it's all copper money.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 3:19 pm 
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Started working on spark effects. What do you think so far?


Attachments:
Ginningstone Transport, 19th Dec 2000.png
Ginningstone Transport, 19th Dec 2000.png [ 52.58 KiB | Viewed 7863 times ]
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 4:03 pm 
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richk67 wrote:
lordazamath wrote:
FooBar wrote:
[GUI icons]
lordazamath, I hate to say, but I think yours are too much of a derived work. Either the shape is changed and the colours kept the same, or the colours changed with the same shape.


Hmm.. if you say mine are very similar to original, then I succeeded :D.. I tried to make them as similar as possible while still having difference.. And I did NOT copy anything.. All new was done by scratch but following the original ones.. For the difference please look this.. I didn't make animation about the cursor ones because thay are different surely.

Hi. Your flashing animation actually would be proof enough of origin. It is clear that they are derivative works "following the original ones". What is needed is to say "I need an icon for Message Settings." and coming up with an idea, and drawing that. The icons are quite important to be visually different, as they will always be in view of every player.

Not saying yours dont look nice - I just think that they sail awfully close to the line (and maybe over it). :)


Ok.. I now drew another three sprites... These are not in style of original graphics, but mean the same.. Is this better? Airport, Trains and Road Vehicles resp.


Attachments:
gui_new_wip.png
gui_new_wip.png [ 1.86 KiB | Viewed 7780 times ]

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 4:04 pm 
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Soeb wrote:
Started working on spark effects. What do you think so far?


Dunno, would have to see it 'sparking', but looks promising!

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 4:14 pm 
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I like those icons for GUI. And here is a little more. I've started working on road reconstruction too. But not vehicles.


Attachments:
Fendtown Transport, 3rd Sep 2000.png
Fendtown Transport, 3rd Sep 2000.png [ 96.94 KiB | Viewed 7766 times ]
OpenGFX_-_newRoadReconstruction_v0.1.grf [901 Bytes]
Downloaded 723 times
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 4:35 pm 
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Based on feedback from IRC, I changed those three sprites a bit. Now I'll draw further, and I'm going to edit the old ones when I'm ready.. So we have all GUI icons needed first and then I can change them and do stuff...
Attachment:
gui_new_wip.png
gui_new_wip.png [ 1.86 KiB | Viewed 7696 times ]


EDIT: Today I shall draw no more..

Todo:
- Finish off all GUI sprites
- Redraw train.. I was told it's indistinctive..
- Redraw some things more
- Get feedback and redraw more
- Code and publish

OpenGFX - GUI-v0.1
Attachment:
GUI_wip.png
GUI_wip.png [ 18.63 KiB | Viewed 7535 times ]


Lord
Ps. Zephyris, you can add 60 more sprites to your sprite count ;) (if you didn't include the arrow things already before...).

EDIT: Updated two first posts. If something is unmentioned in first post, tell me :)

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:15 pm 
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Nice going guys. I've applied what you've done so far to my current savegame (Arctic climate), and the new graphics have given the game a new lease of life.

I cannot draw to save my life, so the only thing I can contribute is a couple of screenshots showing the new graphics in action so everyone can see their work working together in an actual game, and of course some feedback.

The new tracks when used in the arctic look too dark. When used on the snow-tiles (even the new-terrain snow-tiles), the contrast between the snow and the track totally eclipses any contrast within the track. I think the track could do with some greater contrast.

With the new farm-tiles, the darkest farms look almost like recently-terraformed land. It's only the texture that tells them apart, but if the texture's contrast is too low, it might be mistaken for terraformed land. Also, some of the farms (especially the light-brown ones) seem to have some kind of eerie green glow (especially on the 'up' side). This is shown in one of my screenshots.

The rail depot looks like it belongs in the toyland climate. One way to remedy this would be to make the depot's CC a bit darker. Perhaps it should use a similar texture to the road vehicle depot. Also, the back looks a bit too similar to the front (with the low contrast tracks, the entrance at the front of the depot looks like the rectangle at the back). Also, the ElRail depot looks the same as the regular rail-depot (although I'm not sure if the game supports a separate ElRail-depot graphic).

The distinction between the bus-stop and the goods-vehicle stops seems to be less than it is in the original graphics. Perhaps the goods-vehicle stop could contain a wall like the original.

In toyland, the rough land (with stones) berars too much resemblance to regular land.

Anyway, here are two screenshots to show off everyone's work (alas, I'm using UKRS/LV4/ECS so it does not show replacements for natural vehicles/industries). Also they show which versions of the GRF files I'm using. Needless to say, I'm looking forward to the new Arctic buildings...

AE.


Attachments:
File comment: Arctic climate with farms (and new road reconstruction). Note the eeerie green glow and that recently terraformed land looks like the darkest farm.
AE Transport 1b, 21st Apr 1951.png [357.25 KiB]
Downloaded 293 times
File comment: Arctic climate above snowline. The tracks are too dark. The low internal contrast of the tracks contrasts highly with the snow-tiles.
AE Transport 1b, 26th Feb 1952.png [638.85 KiB]
Downloaded 254 times
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:32 pm 
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Maybe you have screen set to dark or something (or mine to bright), but I saw the difference between the farm land and domelishhed tiles very well... And another issue you had with darkness, the rails look normal too.. Dunno why that.. Anyway, good night fellows.

Lord

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I know I have a BBCode error in my signature but I really cba to fix it.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:41 pm 
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Soeb:
Sparks: Well, we 've got to see the animation, but it is a very good start.
Road Reconstruction: I 'd personally go for one tone darker.

LordAzamath:
1. I will not nag about resemblance with original. With so few pixels what more can you do? A raize tool has to have a terrain tile and an up arrow. Check a dozen other games and they have similar tool. I like them.
2. Diskette: It is OK, but color is wrong. It had a reason it was blue in original. Diskettes were blue. There are still commercial programs in the market and they use a blue diskette. Blue is not derivative work. We could keep the color you used for toyland though. :wink:
3. Smoothed a bit the bulldozer. Hope you don't mind. That yellow looked a bit too much to me compared wth rest of sprites.
4. To my opinion, we should make rail sprite narrower. For real life it is OK, but compared to game's sprites, rails seem to far apart from each other.
5. I see you resized the bus. Now it fits better with rest. :D Could airplane be a pixel or 2 bigger? OR:
6. Last sprites (vehicles) are somewhat very dark. Especially the ship. You can barely distinguish it.
7. Keeping in mind plane is white, ship ( brown? I don't know), shouldn't train differ in color from road vehicle?
8. The crates sprite uses different color for crates that the color used in the money sprite for crate. Shouldn't they use the same, for the set to be consistent?

Once again: Good job guys! :]

NOTE: Would it be wise to add a suggestions-TODO column in wiki, our use the comments column for things discussed here that may need to be fixed later? But please not to write absurb things there.


Attachments:
bulldozer_zoomed.png
bulldozer_zoomed.png [ 543 Bytes | Viewed 7330 times ]
bulldozer.pcx [1.44 KiB]
Downloaded 99 times

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 9:59 pm 
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athanasios wrote:
LordAzamath:
1. I will not nag about resemblance with original. With so few pixels what more can you do? A raize tool has to have a terrain tile and an up arrow. Check a dozen other games and they have similar tool. I like them.

:)... EDIT: You can see that it's pretty impossible to replace some sprites... for example the playback sprites -> I had to empty them inside so they would not look as original.. I dunno though will it look good in-game...
Quote:
2. Diskette: It is OK, but color is wrong. It had a reason it was blue in original. Diskettes were blue. There are still commercial programs in the market and they use a blue diskette. Blue is not derivative work. We could keep the color you used for toyland though. :wink:

hehe.. I know it's damn pink.. I picked the colour from the music sprite and then madi it lighter and darker... This can be fixed easily
EDIT: I'll use it in toyland... Actually maybe if I get this done, I'll make everything smoother and toyland-only GUI can take place too :P
Quote:
3. Smoothed a bit the bulldozer. Hope you don't mind. That yellow looked a bit too much to me compared wth rest of sprites.

Actually it needs darker line (it's not black outline)on right side too, but that isn't the main priority.
Quote:
4. To my opinion, we should make rail sprite narrower. For real life it is OK, but compared to game's sprites, rails seem to far apart from each other.

You, my friend, are again right. It seemed odd when I completed it, but it's one of things I mentioned in todo -> to be redrawn. It'll be like airport -> looked from sky and maybe a pseudo train on it (same for roads and waterwats I guess), but again, this is something I'll do when the other sprites are done.
Quote:
5. I see you resized the bus. Now it fits better with rest. :D Could airplane be a pixel or 2 bigger? OR:

the problem is that wings are too long and don't fit well when I make it bigger.. I might make it with shorter wings though, but that's gonna wait.
Quote:
6. Last sprites (vehicles) are somewhat very dark. Especially the ship. You can barely distinguish it.

I now start to think that my screen is indeed brighter that others'.. I don't see that it's darker, but I can modify it ..especially for recolouring..
[ quote]
7. Keeping in mind plane is white, ship ( brown? I don't know), shouldn't train differ in color from road vehicle?
[/quote]
That was said to me previously too.. Again, I'll change it when I have the base GUI sprites ready
Quote:
8. The crates sprite uses different color for crates that the color used in the money sprite for crate. Shouldn't they use the same, for the set to be consistent?

If you scroll back, you see that originally it was green.. with coins and trophy.. Then I made one effect so they became more yellowish. I dunno though if the crates are needed to be yellow or green. I think I'll change the second (refit) to green back
Quote:
Once again: Good job guys! :]

NOTE: Would it be wise to add a suggestions-TODO column in wiki, our use the comments column for things discussed here that may need to be fixed later? But please not to write absurb things there.

I think it would be a good idea.. Maybe to use Talk more (and move the old talk to Talk:Old_Graphics_Replacement ). And Athanasios, would you be so kind and help me out with the roof or train depot?

Lord

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I know I have a BBCode error in my signature but I really cba to fix it.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 10:16 pm 
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1. I am not so good on drawing roofs. More noob artist than you. :oops: :oops:
You see I didn't even touch the roof you used for the road depot. Just recolored for toyland and tropic. Oops, I said something more. Yep tropic is finished but I want to patch to get a decent screeshot with CC before I make it available, otherwise I have to do a mockup.

2. Get rid of part of one of the airplane's wing?
3. I like the color of crates you used in coins sprite. Use that for all crates sprites in game instead of original game's brownish one?

regards
athanasios

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 10:26 pm 
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Engineer
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Wow, great work! This project is great. The gfx look really good.

I've examined closely the screenshots made by electricmonk, especially the first one. And I have some observations. Maybe you'll be interested. Because some things look like graphical glitches, and I think could be made better.


Attachments:
Some_observations.png [71.41 KiB]
Downloaded 317 times
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 11:00 pm 
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athanasios wrote:
NOTE: Would it be wise to add a suggestions-TODO column in wiki, our use the comments column for things discussed here that may need to be fixed later? But please not to write absurb things there.

We can use the Talk: page for that: http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Talk: ... eplacement
I already posted something in there, but it seems nobody noticed.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 11:03 pm 
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I was actually very impressed with the fencing, just getting them to line up how they do. The originals match up very badly, and getting them all to fit is far from easy. If there made better I will just be more impressed, but it's a very minor concern I think.

The screenshots in general are great. It's quite a landmark, as they look like screenshots that could have been entirely randomly taken, and yet some are, as said, 100% new graphics.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 11:24 pm 
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I realised I hadn't uploaded the coded newVehicles - Road v0.1
I know there are several issues people have with this with these graphics, but it is an important set of graphics and it is better to have something than nothing!


Attachments:
OpenGFX_-_newVehicles_-_Road_v0.1.grf [113.37 KiB]
Downloaded 1358 times

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 11:54 pm 
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LordAzamath: Now that I looked at the screenshots, I think that the train depot roof is generally OK. Personally I would currently leave it as it is. A few pixels later to break the long bright and dark lines. It is the shading of the walls, that should be fixed. As already stated, east wall should be brighter. Then roof will fit way much better.

Strange greenish fields: That 's what I though yesterday. But actually it is natural. There is few vegetation in this stage. Flat terrain makes it possible to see the ground, whereas in sloped terrain you view from an angle, and the top of the vegetation prevails soft green and ground is hidden.

Terraform is same color with farm: Shouldn't it be so? When you cultivate the land you dig it. Don't you do the same when you terraform?

Rail glitches: May I assume not all sprites are drawn?

Rail Fence: Some things is impossible to solve without extra code-sprites, some other yes.

I noticed 2 issues in screenshot with farmland:

1. On East slopes of farmland lines mismatch a bit.
2. Fences, as already stated do not connect smoothly.


Attachments:
glitches.png
glitches.png [ 75.17 KiB | Viewed 7166 times ]

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 12:28 am 
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The fences are very hard to get to line up properly. I would say impossible actually. However-it is possible to get them to line up a little better than yours (mainly the ___ view. at the moment they seem too short. more ---)
I attatched a shot of my fences. They also dont meet properly at corners and junctions. I think this style of fences may be harder than the originals as there is a definate post at the corners- but the originals were really bad too.

note-in the shot you can also see some of my trees in action. I dont have a lot of time though and i think zephyris is going to have a go too.

(a little off topic) Ben_Robbins- your trees look so good. Can't wait to see some more.


Attachments:
fences.png
fences.png [ 257.22 KiB | Viewed 7143 times ]

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 12:41 am 
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re: Loop
Rail glitches: That isn't the most recent version of newInfrastructure - in the latest version the rail colour is corrected.

re: athanasios
The lines on the slopes don't match up well generally, its quite a lot of effort to fix for relatively little gain. The greenish slopes are directly as a result of trying to simulate plant growth in lines, Im glad you think its accurate!

re: mph
I will have a go at the trees, they dont take too long to draw. I think yours are better, but I would rather see bad sprites soon (which could be updated/replaced) than slowing down the project...

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