[Base Music] OpenMSX v0.3.1

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kamnet
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by kamnet »

There are elements and techniques that you can borrow, but you can get into an area where you've borrowed just enough from a particular song that it is no longer mimicking technique, but instead straight out sampling.
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by -lucas- »

Yup, and that's what happens when you redo an mp3 in midi :)
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by Roujin »

-lucas- wrote:(which is why the soundalike that i did for the theme is really on the edge of what's allowed - it's just different enough to be a unique piece the way it is now, but i didn't dare to go closer ;-))
May I say my honest opinion? I think it's too close. Having heard the original years ago in times of TTD, and many times in OpenTTD, I can't help but think it's a rip off from the original.
Please don't take these words too personally, I know you've probably put a lot of time into it, and I respect that.
It's just that I can make out sooo many parts of the original in there (even if you e.g. altered the timing a bit, or added a little twist to it), throughout the whole piece. You may have zero 100% copies in the piece, but so many "75% copies" that I personally think you did go too close.

I would really prefer something that matches only the style of the original intro, and does not consist of a lot of parts similar to these of the original (with more or less alterations) besides some completely new parts.
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by NekoMaster »

If anyone wants to know of a decent Midi Composing program, try anvil studio. Its decent enough for the job, as I have used it to make my own music and also edit other midis
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by -lucas- »

Roujin wrote:
-lucas- wrote:(which is why the soundalike that i did for the theme is really on the edge of what's allowed - it's just different enough to be a unique piece the way it is now, but i didn't dare to go closer ;-))
May I say my honest opinion? I think it's too close. Having heard the original years ago in times of TTD, and many times in OpenTTD, I can't help but think it's a rip off from the original.
Please don't take these words too personally, I know you've probably put a lot of time into it, and I respect that.

It's just that I can make out sooo many parts of the original in there (even if you e.g. altered the timing a bit, or added a little twist to it), throughout the whole piece. You may have zero 100% copies in the piece, but so many "75% copies" that I personally think you did go too close.
Thanks for the feedback, and i don't take it personal :)
I didn't spend that much time on it, as in - less than a saturday, including analyzing the original midi, so it's no problem either.

Like i said, it's a hommage to the original piece, and i agree it is very close and i kind of expected your comment sooner or later :) There are some other instruments, other chords, but a very similar chord progression and the same midi instruments, which, being midi, will sound exactely the same as the orignal piece.

I try to learn something from each project that i do and the thing here was to mimick the TT style, so while i succeeded in that, it might come off too much as a rip off. It is kind of interesting though, from a psychological point of view: the visuals are very close to the original (> 75%) and that's a good thing, but with music apparently it becomes annoying :)

I might return to it later to change it - there's not much needed to make it a piece of its own. It's just that i don't want to compose something entirely different from the original music, that makes no sense to me.
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by muhtadi »

Roujin wrote:I would really prefer something that matches only the style of the original intro, and does not consist of a lot of parts similar to these of the original (with more or less alterations) besides some completely new parts.
Well, I like lucas' effort so far and I think as far as homages go I think it does a good job. I didn't feel it had too many similar parts and too little original parts. It's still rough, sure, but hey it's early days.
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by RedPandaFox »

Will there still be the old music included? The full library of the originals?

IMO the old music was one of my favourite parts, If its not going to be in the new versions, I wont be playing them ill just roll back. Just my opinion tho. Ill still listen to the new music, I just love the old music.
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by NekoMaster »

RedPandaFox wrote:Will there still be the old music included? The full library of the originals?

IMO the old music was one of my favourite parts, If its not going to be in the new versions, I wont be playing them ill just roll back. Just my opinion tho. Ill still listen to the new music, I just love the old music.
Um, all you have to do is have the original music from the TTDx DOS or Windows Disk (or ISO)
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by planetmaker »

RedPandaFox wrote:Will there still be the old music included? The full library of the originals?

IMO the old music was one of my favourite parts, If its not going to be in the new versions, I wont be playing them ill just roll back. Just my opinion tho. Ill still listen to the new music, I just love the old music.
Of course that will NOT be done as it would be plain and plumb rip-off and copyright infringement.

If you own them legally, you're still free to do what Nekomaster says.
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by jvlomax »

I think he was meaning for people who own the original cd and still being able to do with the music what you can still do with GFX/SFX
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by WWTBAM »

NekoMaster wrote:
RedPandaFox wrote:Will there still be the old music included? The full library of the originals?

IMO the old music was one of my favourite parts, If its not going to be in the new versions, I wont be playing them ill just roll back. Just my opinion tho. Ill still listen to the new music, I just love the old music.
Um, all you have to do is have the original music from the TTDx DOS or Windows Disk (or ISO)
The DOS music is not supported and will not be for a long time as its music is stored in a cab in a format that has not been reverse engineered.
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by orudge »

Actually, the format is known, although I think the actual MIDI files within are not in quite the standard MIDI format.
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by WWTBAM »

orudge wrote:Actually, the format is known, although I think the actual MIDI files within are not in quite the standard MIDI format.
Well said. I should have been more clear. The cat format is the same as sample.cat but the midi's inside the cat are not standard midi.
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by neob »

robotboy wrote:
orudge wrote:Actually, the format is known, although I think the actual MIDI files within are not in quite the standard MIDI format.
Well said. I should have been more clear. Thecat format is the same as sample.cat but the midi's inside the cat are not standard midi.
in that case i guess theProject wiki page is not up to date.
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by NekoMaster »

robotboy wrote:
orudge wrote:Actually, the format is known, although I think the actual MIDI files within are not in quite the standard MIDI format.
Well said. I should have been more clear. The cat format is the same as sample.cat but the midi's inside the cat are not standard midi.
the sample.cat is for sound, which theres already a replacement for. the Midis arn't your typical midi, they're in general midi format to increase compatibility with sound cards that include general midi, though now a days, this isn't needed really, unless you still own a really old computer running Win9x or DOS
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by WWTBAM »

NekoMaster wrote:
robotboy wrote:
orudge wrote:Actually, the format is known, although I think the actual MIDI files within are not in quite the standard MIDI format.
Well said. I should have been more clear. The cat format is the same as sample.cat but the midi's inside the cat are not standard midi.
the sample.cat is for sound, which theres already a replacement for. the Midis arn't your typical midi, they're in general midi format to increase compatibility with sound cards that include general midi, though now a days, this isn't needed really, unless you still own a really old computer running Win9x or DOS
DOS TTD uses two (maybe more) files for Music, ROLAND.cat and ADLIB.cat which contain non standard midi's for the respective soundcards. It does not use the same format as Windows TTD. I did not say the music was in sample.cat for DOS TTD, I said the cat files I just mentioned use the same format as sample.cat :!:
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by Mr.Killer »

Hello,

I was yesterday at Ottd.org and saw the third beta of version 1.0.0.... GREAT WORK! VERY MUCH! (BIG THUMB UP! for all the hard work you people put in there)

I was really stunned how well it ran, the sounds and graphics and besides the minor glitch in the upcoming AI's it went perfect, compliments.

As i was reading the music discussion, i copied from my original TTD the music files to the \gm dir, and noticed along the way that it wold not accept my own music files i had gathered through the years. I tried even to change the .obm file and added one file. It came out wrong, all files were corrupt according to OTTD, understandable but a pity. I did not add the MD5 hash code (if i'm correct) because i did not know how to get that.

Life within OTTD would be much easier if i could actually add some of my own music. I wish that programming was my thing, i'd wrote you a mediaplayer that took evrything you feeded. (music files ofcourse :) )

I hope, and i will track progress in this, that there will be something in the near future that accepts all kind of sounds.

Good luck to all.
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by orudge »

Mr.Killer wrote:Life within OTTD would be much easier if i could actually add some of my own music. I wish that programming was my thing, i'd wrote you a mediaplayer that took evrything you feeded. (music files ofcourse :) )
Well, that's what my old patch did, and my new patch may well do something similar in time. But it quite likely won't make 1.0, maybe 1.1 if we're lucky. ;)
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by FooBar »

Mr.Killer wrote:I did not add the MD5 hash code
Well, there's your problem. :)
Those MD5 hashes are there for a reason, so they need to be updated as well if you change something else.

You can put your own music in, which is really not that hard actually if you know how the obm files work. You do need to know that all music needs to be in the General MIDI format. Then copy the original obm-file and name it something you like. Open it using your favourite plain text editor and start changing it. Stick to the format provided and you'll be fine. Or have a read here first: http://wiki.openttd.org/Base_graphics#The_.obg_file The obg-file format is quite similar so that should get you to understand the obm-format as well. Good luck!
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Re: OTTD Music Replacement Project

Post by peter1138 »

Mr.Killer wrote:Life within OTTD would be much easier if i could actually add some of my own music. I wish that programming was my thing, i'd wrote you a mediaplayer that took evrything you feeded. (music files ofcourse :) )
Why. Why Why Why. Why Why Why Why Why Why. No doubt you already have a standalone media player. Why should OpenTTD take over this function, while also being a game? What possible purpose is there?
He's like, some kind of OpenTTD developer.
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