[NRT] RattRoads - 1.0.2 released 05-17-20!

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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by kamnet »

If you have no objections, could you replace one of those depots with Amecheer's similar looking "New Depot"?
https://users.tt-forums.net/ameecher/newdepots.html
Image
He's released use for his stuff in other projects.

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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

kamnet wrote:
22 Dec 2019 15:22
If you have no objections, could you replace one of those depots with Amecheer's similar looking "New Depot"?
I think we can do that. See if can make some object pieces to go with it.

The weed spray started to work on the ISR Road. Just wonder if should spray all the weeds?

Cheers
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

I made some Depots using the set that Amecheer had made.

However his set was for trains and I using it for roads. Hope that is ok.

The txt file he included with his grf file reads.

Code: Select all

By Gavin Dowland (Ameecher)

(C) 2006 Gavin Dowland

These are new depots to replace the default TT depots. It should work fine in both TTDP and OTTD. Version 2.0 is a depot without false doors painted on the rear, 2.1 is with the above doors.

**PLEASE DO NOT EDIT THIS .GRF AND DISTRIBUTE IT AS YOUR OWN***

This .grf is free for everyone to use and no-one should be charged for it's use. I allow distribution of it but please give me suitable credit.
Here image of the depots, but I not allow anyone access yet till it confirmed what I doing is ok with Ameecher.
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by kamnet »

Augh, I looked back through all messages here and in e-mail, and I can't find our correspondence now. Very frustrating. I guess I should drop him a message then.

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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

kamnet wrote:
23 Dec 2019 04:15
Augh, I looked back through all messages here and in e-mail, and I can't find our correspondence now. Very frustrating. I guess I should drop him a message then.
The way I read Amecheer text that his depot can be used, but not changed. The looks still the same just used for road instead of rail. So wonder if that is changing it.

Be happy to include this depot in my rail set too if he agrees.
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

MERRY CHRISTMAS to you all and your family.

Hope you been good and Santa brings you something nice. But best gift of all is the love from our families.

Stay safe all and catch up with you a bit later.
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by Andrew350 »

Indeed, hope everyone is enjoying the holidays :)

Unfortunately I don't have any presents to give you, but thought I'd share a little of what I've been working on. As shown a couple pages ago I started recoloring the dirt roads so that brown horses would be more visible. I've tweaked some pixels a little more on that and also started doing the snow and sand versions (for arctic and tropic, respectively):
dirt_revamped.png
dirt_revamped.png (31.67 KiB) Viewed 2151 times
Also behind-the-scenes I've been working a little here and there on the highway objects, I've managed to finally finish drawing and coding the corner pieces to work properly. Just need to draw slopes and the basics for the 3-lane pieces will be done:
Pupool Transport, 10_18_2020.png
Pupool Transport, 10_18_2020.png (40.19 KiB) Viewed 2151 times
And last but not least I have gone ahead and added a new "speed units" parameter so that those of you preferring metric units will get more sensible speed limits. As part of that change I removed the cost factor from the "difficulty" parameter (it now only changes speed limits) and added another option for even lower speeds.

No idea when 0.5 will be ready, but wanted to show some of the progress anyway :)

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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

Andrew350 wrote:
25 Dec 2019 02:09
As shown a couple pages ago I started recoloring the dirt roads so that brown horses would be more visible.
Nicely done :bow:
Also behind-the-scenes I've been working a little here and there on the highway objects, I've managed to finally finish drawing and coding the corner pieces to work properly. Just need to draw slopes and the basics for the 3-lane pieces will be done:
These looking good too. I been making some Road Signs to go with these and tweaking signs that I did previous.
And last but not least I have gone ahead and added a new "speed units" parameter so that those of you preferring metric units will get more sensible speed limits. As part of that change I removed the cost factor from the "difficulty" parameter (it now only changes speed limits) and added another option for even lower speeds.
That should keep the heavy footed players happy. :D
Hope all enjoying their Christmas Day.
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

Still fiddling around with the extra roads and objects for these roads.

In my object sets been removing what I can as many of the object roads will no longer be needed as you will have access to them as actual roads that vehicles can use.

Also changing the brown dirt roads so that not as dark. They look more like mud so making them look a dry dirt like Andrew360 is doing so horse can be seen easier.

This a sample of what I been up to.
RattRoadsAdditions_01.png
RattRoadsAdditions_01.png (32.28 KiB) Viewed 2102 times
Been tweaking some road signs so they show the direction the curve or intersection will be,

Hoping to eventually combine the AuzRoads and AuzFences into the RattRoadAll set. But still some work to do to them first. So I'll include the AuzFenceObjects here too. AuzRoadObjects changes not ready to upload yet.
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

Been doing bits and pieces with the roads but can not let you have a try yet.
I hope to have several dirt roads.
The narrow fake track to the left and next 4 actual roads. The middle one hope to make a single lane fake road of that style eventually as well.
RattRoadsAdditions_05.png
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I'm in process of separating the objects so most be in there own set. In the road set will be the different road signs, the fake lanes for those who want wider roads and maybe some depot extensions.

But you will have to wait till next year for any more news what doing.

HAPPY NEW YEAR TO ALL.
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by kamnet »

Could I make a request to add parameters to select which roads to enable? There's a lot of stuff being added here, and while there are 64 slots these expansions are already taking up 15 of them. Some people may not need or want all that is here because they want to add some eyecandy from other sets.

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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

kamnet wrote:
01 Jan 2020 01:56
Could I make a request to add parameters to select which roads to enable? There's a lot of stuff being added here, and while there are 64 slots these expansions are already taking up 15 of them. Some people may not need or want all that is here because they want to add some eyecandy from other sets.
I got no intentions of having 64 roads :D Andrew360 and I be keeping our sets separate but also have it so both sets can be used together if like.

My main idea is to have some roads same as Andrew360. His roads mostly designed for towns and cities and normal use and those players not interested much in making things look pretty :wink: My roads mostly designed for country use and before RVs was invented. I hope only have about 8 roads. 3 or 4 roads with the fences.

In image above the 2nd and 3rd from left will not have fences as these being designed to use before the RV was invented and I don't think the roads had fences and guide posts those days. The road far right will have the fence and change it a bit so will match the one next to it so have one suitable for in towns and one for country.

The Industrial Roads intend to just keep one of them .. but not sure if keep the ISR one or make something different.
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

Want your opinion?

I been experimenting with dirt roads and looked at using natural terrain from the game. I did some Farm Tracks in my object sets to see how it looked and today I did a test road and came up with this result.

Wondering if the Desert terrain from Sub-Tropic would suit better for a dirt road instead of the yellowish gravel I been using. Horse can be seen on this desert roads clearly. I also made the desert dirt a bit darker so can be seen in the desert.
DesertyRoad-1.png
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Should I change my gravel to the desert look?
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

These images are of the desert dirt road in Sub-Tropical, Temperate and sub-artic to get idea how it would look in all 3. Unless some one objects, I think I will change my gravel roads to this look.
DesertRoad-3.png
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Also Asphalt roads where I have the gravel shoulders can be changed too. When I look at Google Earth street views of country roads, there is the gravel shoulders as wide as where the white post are, but over time in grasses over.
So I hoping to remove most of the gravel and just have a narrow dirt shoulder some like these. At moment I replaced some of the gravel with Temperate Rough grass, it looks good most areas except on desert and snow.
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

Here is all the roads I have made.

These top sections are from Andrew360's original RattRoads and bottom of these is my additions with fences and white posts.

Origiannly I had gravel shoulders but removed them as images I seen of country roads do not show the gravel as it has all grassed over.
RattRoadsAdditions_07.png
RattRoadsAdditions_07.png (17.83 KiB) Viewed 1656 times
These are my gravel roads which have been changed by using terrains from the Sub-Tropic Deserts.

I think they look better. Other gravel looked too clean.

Also are 2 Industrial Roads. One of this need to be removed but not sure which one. Do I keep the ISR one or the new one using ISR roads, but has pathways. Any suggestions?
RattRoadsAdditions_08.png
RattRoadsAdditions_08.png (48.13 KiB) Viewed 1656 times
Here a copy of the roads if like to try. It has some new coding courtesy of Andrew360. You can choose the speed. Normal, Hard, Harder or no limits. Can also choose if want MPH, KMH or MPS

Enjoy
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by Andrew350 »

GarryG wrote:
07 Jan 2020 09:22
Also are 2 Industrial Roads. One of this need to be removed but not sure which one. Do I keep the ISR one or the new one using ISR roads, but has pathways. Any suggestions?
Just my 2 cents, I would go with the normal ISR road so it would fit in more places around an industrial area. I think I like the new gravel roads better also :)

Meanwhile, an icy bridge:
icy_bridge.png
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Drawing the rest of the snowy stuff is the "big" thing left to do now, it just takes a while because it's kind of boring ;)

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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

Andrew350 wrote:
08 Jan 2020 06:20
Just my 2 cents, I would go with the normal ISR road so it would fit in more places around an industrial area.
I accept your 2 cents and go that direction.
Andrew350 wrote:
08 Jan 2020 06:20
I think I like the new gravel roads better also
I think they look a better and natural. Whether I can tweak them now so middle might be a bit lighter and where wagons, horse and vehicle travel be the darker look .. but that is a lot like doing snow .. boring.
Andrew350 wrote:
08 Jan 2020 06:20
Drawing the rest of the snowy stuff is the "big" thing left to do now, it just takes a while because it's kind of boring
Does this mean we can make roads depending on the climate?
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by planetmaker »

GarryG wrote:
08 Jan 2020 07:23
Does this mean we can make roads depending on the climate?
Yes, sure. There is a terrain_type variable to check for the ground type (TILETYPE_NORMAL, TILETYPE_DESERT, TILETYPE_RAIN_FOREST, TILETYPE_SNOW )
And there is the always globally available climate variable: CLIMATE_XXX with XXX = [TEMPERATE | ARCTIC | TROPICAL | TOYLAND] (but I actually recommend to not use that and just make use of terrain_type. Rather offer different roads unconditional to climate or at least a NewGRF parameter to choose the default road type independent of selected climate)

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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by LaChupacabra »

GarryG wrote:
07 Jan 2020 09:22
These are my gravel roads which have been changed by using terrains from the Sub-Tropic Deserts.
I think they look better. Other gravel looked too clean.
Hi Garry

I don't know if they look better because previous versions both lighter and darker looked equally good. :)
For me, they certainly look more Australian. ;) And to be honest, what I miss most about your roads and the rest of your addons is the Australian Landscape addon. I have never been to Australia, but what I associate its landscape with most is the roads and the land with a distinctly orange / red shade, to which the last dirt and gravel roads suit very well. When these roads are used for European scenarios, these lighter or darker roads look much more natural.

Such a question: in what direction do You want your addition to develop? Will it be a part of Ratt Roads or a separate addition? At the moment, I have the impression that you haven't defined it yet. In my opinion you could go both towards creating a set of typical Australian roads, but an equally interesting option would be to develop Ratt Roads and enable it to choose the style of roads, separately for asphalt roads and separately for gravel / dirt roads. Or maybe both options?

Industrial roads
As for industrial roads, I really liked your concrete roads. Current asphalt roads with concrete pavements are also good. What is most missing in their case is ... an ISR station with just such a substrate. It is very lacking and unfortunately without these stations these roads will not make much sense.
I have never been particularly convinced of ISR roads. This grass stings the eyes (squares can sometimes overgrow but not roads), and above all the marking of intersections looks very strange or simply bad. Although Ufiby did not remove grass from his ISR roads, marking the roads and especially the intersections is much better - there are no questions: what do these lines mean? In my opinion, it shouldn't look like this as present.

Fences
I think that apart from highways this is a very niche solution. Perhaps in Australia this is more common, but in Europe and probably the rest of the world fences of ordinary roads and even less gravel are practically not found. Even in Sweden or Norway, which exceptionally care about road safety, fences are used almost exclusively on expressways. Another problem with fences is that in the case of a dual carriageway, the fence is also located between the roadways themselves.

Direction markings
If the direction marking method cannot be made dependent on the type of road, the only sensible way would be vertical signs as in the case of U&Ratt or CS Roads - the stripes painted on gravel look strange.

Road Edges
I am surprised that in the case of gravel roads they are even, while in the case of asphalt (Ratt) they are or appear uneven.

Vehicle Depot
For Improved and Basic Roads they seem to be too high and their interiors should not be bright - these colors blend together and it does not look good, from a distance it is not known what it is. Similarly, this open gates are gray as the ground. Sometimes simpler graphics can show much more. The base road depot is, for a change, too low, which means that many vehicles pass through the wall. All depot have slightly narrow entrances.

Speed ​​limit
It is nice that you have added distinction for metric and imperial speeds. This variant with cosmic velocities (mps) is unnecessary. ;) Most speeds, however, would require minor adjustments, because instead of e.g. 60 km/h it turned out 59 km/h. For the default settings they are almost good and only the fastest way is too slow. In general, slightly different restrictions are used in most European countries:
50 km/h - city roads (30 or 40 km/h in strict centers)
70 km/h - main roads within cities
90 km/h - intercity roads
110 km/h - express roads
130 km/h - motorways (unlimited - on some motorways in Germany)
In addition, players can only reduce these speeds or turn them off, which is not the best solution, because it does not include sets at all, where there are much faster vehicles. The good thing is that the default type of roads that build cities has a sensible, more urban restriction. Setting "difficulty" should also affect on speed limit for basic road.
By the way, "Difficulty level" doesn't fit well for the speed limit level setting.

Snow and versions for different climates
Andrew350 wrote:
08 Jan 2020 06:20
Drawing the rest of the snowy stuff is the "big" thing left to do now, it just takes a while because it's kind of boring ;)
It can be boring, but the snowy roads look really endearing and are worth it to get a bit bored. ;) In the case of dirt or gravel roads, this would rather not be too time consuming. For example, some time ago I converted a dark dirt road into a winter and desert version only by changing colors. I don't think you need more. You can, but you don't have to.
Dirt road on desert and snow.png
Dirt road on desert and snow.png (35.05 KiB) Viewed 1480 times
File and version naming
These files cannot be distinguished which is newer and which is older. You have to click and check on each of them. Sometimes the latest version is at the bottom, other times at the top and sometimes inside. This can be really annoying...
File and version naming.png
File and version naming.png (22.26 KiB) Viewed 1480 times
Which of all version 1 is the latest?
I am sorry for may English. I know is bed.

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GarryG
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Re: [NRT] RattRoads - 0.4.1 released 05-15-19!

Post by GarryG »

Hello LaChupacabra,

Interesting read from you.
LaChupacabra wrote:
09 Jan 2020 00:57
I don't know if they look better because previous versions both lighter and darker looked equally good
Deciding dirt colours for roads now easy as different as some colours don't suit some areas. The dark brown look good but as mention previous if you start a game using horses they not easy to see and in some cased you can not see the horse. That one of the reasons for the change.
LaChupacabra wrote:
09 Jan 2020 00:57
For me, they certainly look more Australian. And to be honest, what I miss most about your roads and the rest of your addons is the Australian Landscape addon.
I not used the Australian landscape add-on as to be honest didn't know it was available. I know some guys was working on it many years ago but didn't know if it was finished.
LaChupacabra wrote:
09 Jan 2020 00:57
Such a question: in what direction do You want your addition to develop? Will it be a part of Ratt Roads or a separate addition? At the moment,
They be separate game files, but we designing them so can be used together. I hope Andrew360s original RattRoads be the main file people use and mine be additions to most of his roads. For instance has Asphalt roads I have the same but mine have the fences.
In my opinion you could go both towards creating a set of typical Australian roads, but an equally interesting option would be to develop Ratt Roads and enable it to choose the style of roads, separately for asphalt roads and separately for gravel / dirt roads. Or maybe both options?
That probably be a good idea .. have sets designed for each country. Maybe when Andrew360 and I finish coding and have most of our roads we can upload the source here and that way players from each country can use the source to make their own style of roads.

Making a individual set just for Australia might go well too.
Industrial roads
The ISR industrial road are same as used in ISR. I like to try use some buildings from ISR with a overlap section so it will hide the bus stations and loading bays. So hope this will overcome that incite. The lines do look a bit odd on these roads, but that how it is in ISR.
Fences
I could leave fences out and players can add fences using the object fences. But it a long process adding one fence piece at a time when if included as part of road can built the fence and road same time.

We do have some roads in my country without fences. But those that are reasonably busy that pass through farms do have fences to stop animals being hit by RV'S.

If want dual roads than use the roads from RattRoads original. Andrew360 working on his Highways to allow roads to go parallel and look good.
Direction markings
That is something I been looking at too .. maybe have a object sign to place on side of road with a fake road overlap to cover the arrows. That something I hope to work on soon.
Road Edges
Back in the 1960s and probably a lot sooner that I can remember Asphalt roads edges was not even and also some gravel roads due to they didn't have the technology to make them so neat. Not sure what year they learned to lay the asphalt straight and even and asphalt where the edges didn't break away.
Vehicle Depot
Still work to be done to these. But I like to design them so can be used for RV, trams and trains. You could be right that some are a bit high. The base depot I did not design and I agree it looks to low.
Speed ​​limit
Something we still working on. Not sure if we can control the speeds on same road so in cities it lower and out of the city speed higher. As mentioned above .. I think once Andrew360 and I have a good working copy of both our roadsets we can upload the source here and players can use to make their own roads for their countries and just simply change the speeds to suit.
File and version naming
These files cannot be distinguished which is newer and which is older. You have to click and check on each of them. Sometimes the latest version is at the bottom, other times at the top and sometimes inside. This can be really annoying...
Don't know how you ended up with so many version cause each time I upload a version here and you copy it into your "newgrf" directory it should overwrite the previous version. I suggest you delete all the files of my roads from your directory and download the last version I did. I don't change version numbers yet until I have something that closer to a more permanent solution.

Cheers
Soot Happens
Screenshot Of The Month Winner March 2020
All my projects are GPLv2 License unless stated.
Auz Road Sets: viewtopic.php?f=29&t=87335
Auz Project Releases: viewtopic.php?f=67&t=84725
Auz Trains: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=74193
Auz Industry Sets: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=74471
Auz Objects: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=75657
Auz Bridges: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=75248
Auz Stations: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=76390
Auz Tracks: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=82691
Auz Subway Stations: viewtopic.php?f=26&t=85335

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