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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 7:58 am 
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Tycoon
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Thanks for this set of buses. Waiting for further updates set. :))

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 8:22 am 
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Tycoon
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Transportman wrote:
And I'm still waiting for that heads-up

Ahem... ooops.... Hey Transportman! Heads-up! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Jyratos wrote:
Don't worry, the position of the pixels doesn't change anything in the code

I know but I sometimes forget to do some final things like that P-menu sprite of the Van Hool. BTW, here it is if you want it.
Attachment:
Van Hool ExquiCity 24.PNG
Van Hool ExquiCity 24.PNG [ 11.59 KiB | Viewed 1344 times ]



BTW people, only 4 buses remain on my "to-do" list and these will be done by tomorrow latest. :D
(One of them is the truck-based Camello and I need to figure out some small details regarding that one - thanks Jake!)

So, I'm inviting you to make your last-minute suggestions because I'm moving onto the... drums please... 2CC TRUCK SET!

BTW, would anyone mind if we use this same topic for the truck set as well? Less clutter on the forums...

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 12:00 pm 
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Tycoon
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Voyager One wrote:
So, I'm inviting you to make your last-minute suggestions because I'm moving onto the... drums please... 2CC TRUCK SET!

BTW, would anyone mind if we use this same topic for the truck set as well? Less clutter on the forums...

If it are two separate NewGRFs, I would suggest opening a new topic + project on the DevZone for that.

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 12:42 pm 
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Tycoon
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Transportman wrote:
If it are two separate NewGRFs, I would suggest opening a new topic + project on the DevZone for that.

I would tend to agree :)

In the meantime, send suggestions and stats for trucks to me! Voyager's put me in charge of research because I know a fair bit about Australian road train configurations, but I need a bunch of nice European types to round it out.
The (VERY WIP) tracking table can be found here

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 1:13 pm 
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Tycoon
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Emperor Jake wrote:
tracking table

Regarding that table, two small remarks please.

First of all, don't put "drawing lengths" in x/8ths. Just fill in RL meters please, I have a small table of conversion of my own.

Second, I was planning to make a refittable variant of every truck anyway so they can be refitted to anything that existed IRL. E.g. you have a Mercedes-Benz L Series listed as "rigid" and as "tractor". Don't differentiate them like that. I will make one single "Mercedes-Benz L Series" that will change rigid/tractor grafics when refitted. E.g. it will have a rigid dump truck, a rigid tarpaulin-covered truck, an (articulated) tractor-hauled flatcar trailer, etc. etc. - all in one sprite file.


Transportman wrote:
If it are two separate NewGRFs, I would suggest opening a new topic + project on the DevZone for that.

Okay then, it will be a separate topic/thread. :wink:


EDIT: ... and not to just write... some drawing as well...

Attachment:
GM TA60-102N Bendy Bus.PNG
GM TA60-102N Bendy Bus.PNG [ 10.83 KiB | Viewed 1299 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 1:52 pm 
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Tycoon
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Voyager One wrote:
Regarding that table, two small remarks please.

Ok, see my PM.

In the meantime, send me suggestions with stats for trucks you'd like to see added. Especially older ones are appreciated. :mrgreen: PM them until the new thread is created, this is still the bus thread :P

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 2:11 pm 
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Engineer
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I disappear because Christmas (and academics; whee university life) and all I can say is: Awesome has occurred. All the awesome.


Voyager One wrote:
So, I'm inviting you to make your last-minute suggestions because I'm moving onto the... drums please... 2CC TRUCK SET!

If you want a good suggestion for a last minute bus (or three) to add. How's about the New Flyer Industries Xcelsior buses? Here is a link to the page on New Flyer's website that gives the specifications for the Xcelsior buses. I'm providing the link as the buses come in 35', 40', and 60' (60' being articulated) versions. So if any of them seem interesting you can choose which seems best.



I love how the TA60-102N turned out. Definitely going to be spamming those when I pick up the GRF and they become available. Hehe. And the 2CC Truck stuff sounds interesting (though I'm afraid I don't know much at all about trucks).


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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 4:54 pm 
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Tycoon
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Emperor Jake wrote:
Ok, see my PM.

Yup. :D

Creideiki wrote:
Xcelsior

I'll take a better look. I know I've considered it but I don't remember why I haven't included it. Boh, I'll re-check.

---

One more...

Attachment:
Yaroslavl Hk-2.PNG
Yaroslavl Hk-2.PNG [ 8.67 KiB | Viewed 1257 times ]

---

EDIT:
Voyager One wrote:
I re-check all files before uploading them to devzone and only those are "safe" for coding.

... and he puts his foot into his mouth... :lol: :lol: :lol:

I've just used the Ford AA for some reference for the Yaroslavl bus and guess what's happened. I discover I've forgotten the tail lights on one direction.

@Jyratos - All in all, not even devzone files are 100% foolproof. Let's make it like this, after I'm done here with these few buses I'll re-check ALL of them and upload new files with ALL buses (3 separate ZIP files IC/Urban/Suburban), then you can simply change files, there will be no messing around with anything except a few mistaken pixels.
---

EDIT2:

The one before the last...

Attachment:
NFI DE60LFR.PNG
NFI DE60LFR.PNG [ 10.98 KiB | Viewed 1232 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 11:49 pm 
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Engineer
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Voyager One wrote:
Creideiki wrote:
Xcelsior

I'll take a better look. I know I've considered it but I don't remember why I haven't included it. Boh, I'll re-check.

Possibly because they're similar to other buses? I actually went and decided to look at the introduction dates on the various Xcelsior buses and they're not that new. I know Hamilton is considering XN60s to replace the discontinued DE60LFRs, but I had figured the Xcelsior XN60 was a "new" bus (as in released in the past three years); turns out I was wrong.


Voyager One wrote:
{NFI DE60LFR}

Shiny, but I'll admit I've never seen a five door configuration personally.



This is more a question for the coder; but how difficult would it be to implement something akin to the options for CC variation like in eGRTVS 2? That is something I absolutely love to use in eGRVTS 2, and I'd love to see more of. (Mostly because it makes my boring fleet of buses, trams, and trucks more interesting by adding in some variation.)


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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sun Dec 28, 2014 7:54 am 
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Engineer
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Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:47 pm
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Location: A small village near Paris, France
Voyager One wrote:
qSo, I'm inviting you to make your last-minute suggestions because I'm moving onto the... drums please... 2CC TRUCK SET!


Good news ! Now we will have trucks matching to buses! :)

Creideiki wrote:
This is more a question for the coder; but how difficult would it be to implement something akin to the options for CC variation like in eGRTVS 2? That is something I absolutely love to use in eGRVTS 2, and I'd love to see more of. (Mostly because it makes my boring fleet of buses, trams, and trucks more interesting by adding in some variation.)


I'm currently on vacation so I don't have the tools for coding but I think it will not be very hard to introduce.


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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sun Dec 28, 2014 8:32 am 
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Tycoon
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Creideiki wrote:
NFI DE60LFR...Shiny, but I'll admit I've never seen a five door configuration personally.

I've noticed there are two variants, one with 2 double doors, one with 3 double doors. I've decided to go with the 2 double doors to make it different from other buses from the same period.

Where do you see 5 doors please? :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Sun Dec 28, 2014 9:10 am 
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Engineer
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Voyager One wrote:
I've noticed there are two variants, one with 2 double doors, one with 3 double doors. I've decided to go with the 2 double doors to make it different from other buses from the same period.

Where do you see 5 doors please? :lol:

Yeah, looking at it again, it does only have two doors. I have no idea how I saw five doors, I'll blame it on the fact I hadn't gotten enough sleep when I posted, heh.


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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 11:34 am 
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Tycoon
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Digitalfox wrote:
Now my boy, don't forget buses can't live without trucks
Voyager One wrote:
Hush! That's the Easter surprise...
Marshy wrote:
Easter?! You spelt New Years wrong
Voyager One wrote:
New Year? I'm not even 1/3rd done with this thing...


Ahem... still not New Year... DONE! :]

Attachment:
Autobus Camello.PNG
Autobus Camello.PNG [ 11.99 KiB | Viewed 1103 times ]



Don't be surprised about this weirdness in this template. Jake was kind enough to make a test coding of this and it works great! Thanks again Jake!

@Jyratos - As written, code the truck as 2/8th long regardless of its real 4/8th size. This way we'll get a nice overlap between the truck and the trailer, all with nice bending in curves. It does look complicated and it surely is complicated to draw as it clashes with some "normal" and "routine" behaviour during drawing but... well... it works. :D

You can see by yourself, here's the mockup coding that Jake has kindly made. Note that sprites in this test are also crude and un-detailed, not like they will be (above is the finished file).

Attachment:
camello_test.grf [3.51 KiB]
Downloaded 26 times


So, this will also be the way for doing trucks and in the meantime - Jyratos - get to coding before I get a whip!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
(joking of course)

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 11:49 am 
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Tycoon
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Voyager One wrote:
You can see by yourself, here's the mockup coding that Jake has kindly made. Note that sprites in this test are also crude and un-detailed, not like they will be (above is the finished file).


I took 2 seconds to recompile the GRF with the new graphics :wink:
Attachment:
camello_test.grf [3.91 KiB]
Downloaded 32 times


edit: Upon closer inspection, it looks like you've covered the rearmost wheel hub of the tractor going in the </ direction.


@Jyratos: Did you agree to coding the truck set? If so that's awesome but otherwise if we don't find a coder then I'll hav a go at it. :)


Oh, and I've had another idea. Why don't we add a couple of American style school buses to this set? We may not be able to transport students in OTTD yet, but they're used elsewhere as general purpose buses too.

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 12:19 pm 
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Tycoon
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Emperor Jake wrote:
I took 2 seconds to recompile the GRF with the new graphics

Great! Thanks mate!

Emperor Jake wrote:
Upon closer inspection, it looks like you've covered the rearmost wheel hub of the tractor going in the </ direction.

Yeah, I know. Unfortunately that's a copromise I had to make to make it look better in other aspects. Besides, those wheelcaps shouldn't be silverish at all, I should have painted them dark grey so they would have been ever more hidden.

Let's leave it like this, IMO.

Emperor Jake wrote:
@Jyratos: Did you agree to coding the truck set?

AFAIK not yet but I'm sure you two can get to an understanding. There's plenty of work for both of you. :wink: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 2:56 pm 
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I second the idea of some american schoolbuses - older ones are often used in the US as cheap buses by private organizations and churches, and outside the US for more fun purposes: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiva_bus

If used as intended as a party bus maybe they would be articulated - with fast decay rate for alcohol and no decay for passengers so long as the alcohol remains!


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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 3:36 pm 
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Tycoon
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supermop wrote:
If used as intended as a party bus maybe they would be articulated - with fast decay rate for alcohol and no decay for passengers so long as the alcohol remains!


Sorry to spoil your fun but you can't carry a passenger and a non-passenger cargo in the same road vehicle due to the way road stops work - otherwise we could have Postbusse :wink:

Also if a school bus is drawn I would make it 2nd company colour all over, since yellow is more commonly used as 2nd CC.

Also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_bus

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 6:23 pm 
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You're both insane... :lol: :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 12:26 am 
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Engineer
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Location: A small village near Paris, France
Voyager One wrote:
So, this will also be the way for doing trucks and in the meantime - Jyratos - get to coding before I get a whip!!!


For the moment I'm skiing in the alps so it will be difficult :D
Emperor Jake wrote:
@Jyratos: Did you agree to coding the truck set? If so that's awesome but otherwise if we don't find a coder then I'll hav a go at it. :)


No problem for the coding. I will to finish to code the busses this week to have free time for trucks.


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 Post subject: Re: The 2cc Bus Set
PostPosted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 12:30 am 
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Traffic Manager
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Nice work everyone, after playing it with just a few minutes I already like this set a lot! It's another great vehicle NewGRF that I just cannot avoid.

Jyratos wrote:
I've joined the GRF so you can tell me if there is something to correct.

Could you please create a parameter that allows the player to limit the top speed of all buses to a specific value through the NewGRF settings? It'd be awesome if such a parameter could feature several settings in a drop down list like with the loading speed (example: 80, 90, 100, 110, 120, 136 km/h (85 mph)).

While it's possible for players to limit vehicle top speeds through the timetable, I noticed that a vehicle with a higher technical top speed will never be passed by one with a lower top speed. If a player tries to replicate real-life conditions with speed limits featuring light utility vehicles / cars going faster than buses and trucks on motorways, this will break the gameplay for that player.

Example:
- highway speed limit for trucks >4 tons: 80 km/h
- highway speed limit for buses: 100 km/h
- highway speed limit for vehicles <4 tons: none

Vehicle examples:
- truck >4 tons: MAN F90 (technical Vmax: 90 km/h) from the Hungarian Truck Set FIRS beta
- bus: Setra S415 HDH (technical Vmax: 186 km/h (!)) from this set
- utility <4 tons: Bedford Astramax (technical Vmax: 120 km/h) from the BRBV set

If I limit the heavy truck to 80 km/h and the bus to 100 km/h, the bus will pass the truck. If the Astramax travelling 120 km/h approaches the bus from behind after passing the truck as well, the Astramax will slow down to 100 km/h and never pass the bus.

I guess I don't need to add that 186 km/h are pretty much impossible to achieve in real life unless you drive that bus off a cliff at 100 km/h or more. :-)

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