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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 10:56 am 
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UPDATE 2014-11-22:
Version 0.2 is out! It includes a few minor updates and is now available on Bananas.
Here's the source: (note the makefile doesn't fully work yet so you have to make and compile separately)
Attachment:
NewCC 0.2_src.7z [35.43 KiB]
Downloaded 204 times



Original Post wrote:
I just found out how easy it is to make new company colours via NewGRF. I wonder why nobody has done it before (apart from Pikka and his purple/mauve to black GRFs)

This is a prototype of the NewCC set, which replaces or improves almost all company colours. The intention is to make them into colours that are more likely to be used by both modern and old liveries However, for now it is first company colour only because making a full set of 256 2CC recolour sprites is a bit of work. Note that this means it will only work on vehicles that don't have the 2CC bit set in the misc flags; 2CC vehicles will be displayed with the old company colours. This does, however, give a good way of comparing them (note: use the AL1 and AL6 in UKRS1; they are almost the same but one is 1CC and one is 2CC)

I am releasing this test version to see what people think about the new colours. I will eventually get the 2CC version finished, because I have something planned for it to go with my European trainset. There is also a side effect that changes the colours of some GUI elements and windows, but it shouldn't be a problem as such, it's just different. I found everything perfectly legible, but please say so if you find a problem.
Of course, I would like feedback on the choice of colours I made, please tell me if you think something is too bright or looks awful on a certain vehicle, etc.



What I did to each colour: (UPDATED)
Dark blue: Used darker versions of the normal blue
Pale green: Made greenish-brown colour
Pink: Made into dark red
Yellow: Made yellower
Red: Same as original
Light Blue: Same as original
Green: Made into same as 2CC green, slightly darker
Dark Green: Same as original
Blue: Made into black (dark grey)
Cream: Default brown in 1CC, lighter beight in 2CC
Mauve: Made into reddish-brown colour
Purple: Used different purple
Orange: Default orange in 1CC, brighter orange in 2CC
Brown: Used much browner brown
Grey: Made light grey
White: Same as default pale green

Since I have changed some colours significantly, the names don't match up anymore and I don't think it is possible to change default strings via NewGRF (or is it?) so if this really bugs you, there is a patch included in the tar that changes the colour names to the ones in the screenshot in the UK English language.


Attachments:
File comment: Image of original test version (OUTDATED)
newcc.png
newcc.png [ 270.21 KiB | Viewed 16894 times ]
File comment: Screenshot of various 2CC trains in new colours.
newcc_4.png
newcc_4.png [ 190.54 KiB | Viewed 16551 times ]

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Last edited by Emperor Jake on Sat Nov 22, 2014 6:27 am, edited 5 times in total.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 11:11 am 
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Quite nice, though I think orange and yellow are a tad on the bright side. I think they could use some more shading (bigger color range from light to dark). Especially yellow seems to be very bright. (I wouldn't mind it being more gold-ish, or orange-ish, much like the emoticons at this forum. :wink: )

Additionally, I think white and grey are a bit close to each other. Not sure how they end up being on actual vehicles. (Can you show more CC'ed vehicles?)

Also, I miss a light green color.



A question though, is this a GRF which is supposed to work with any 2cc colored GRF set or will it only work with it's own NewGRF?

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 11:19 am 
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i vaguely remember a program that can generate the 256 colour tables for you.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 11:32 am 
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@Purno: Unfortunately I am limited by TTD's palette and 16 different colours, so some things simply aren't possible. The grey and white are actually quite different; the new grey is the blueish-grey colour. If you use the TTD-style forum theme, you can compare the grey GUI on the screenshot with the forum's colour. Why don't you just download the GRF and see for yourself?
What if I reverted yellow to the way it was before and replace Rust Brown with the pale green colour?
OR: What if I removed grey and replaced it with the original pale green? (because many vehicles have lots of grey already and it isn't a commonly used colour anyway)

And yes, once the 2cc recolour sprites are done, it will be able to be used with any company coloured vehicle. One of the reasons I'm making this is to allow some better looking and more realistic liveries for the 2cc set :)

@Eddi: I am writing it in NML, and I have figured out how to speed up the process using modular nml files and the find & replace tool :wink:

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 12:09 pm 
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Here's an update:

Changes:
- Shifted yellow one shade darker
- Made white one shade darker and called it "Light Grey"
- Replaced white with Teal Green (unchanged pale green)

(Outdated files removed)

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Last edited by Emperor Jake on Fri Sep 23, 2011 2:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 12:56 pm 
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Emperor Jake wrote:
Now since I have changed some colours significantly, the names don't match up anymore and I don't think it is possible to change default strings via NewGRF (or is it?) so if this really bugs you, here is a patch that changes the colour names in the UK English language.

theoretically the newgrf spec allows this, but this was never adapted to OpenTTD's new string system, so it needs implementation of a mapping between original TTD strings and their OpenTTD counterpart (if applicable). new strings introduced by OpenTTD couldn't be changed by this method, though.

Quote:
@Eddi: I am writing it in NML, and I have figured out how to speed up the process using modular nml files and the find & replace tool :wink:

i tend to meta-program NML. it's funny how 100 lines of python code and a 300 line table can generate 30.000 lines of nml code :)

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 1:01 pm 
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Emperor Jake wrote:
@Purno: Unfortunately I am limited by TTD's palette and 16 different colours, so some things simply aren't possible.


I know, no worries, we'll just have to find the best possible way with those limitations :)

Quote:
The grey and white are actually quite different; the new grey is the blueish-grey colour. If you use the TTD-style forum theme, you can compare the grey GUI on the screenshot with the forum's colour.


Aye true, but I really need to see them on vehicles to really see the difference.

Quote:
Why don't you just download the GRF and see for yourself?


At work ATM :P

Quote:
What if I reverted yellow to the way it was before and replace Rust Brown with the pale green colour?


1. I liked Rust Brown (I guess especially nice for cargo wagons)
2. Original Yellow is indeed closer to what I meant. :P
3. When I said I was missing light green, I meant light green, not pale green, though admittedly I used pale green frequently too. :P

Quote:
OR: What if I removed grey and replaced it with the original pale green? (because many vehicles have lots of grey already and it isn't a commonly used colour anyway)


Grey may not be used a lot, but what about silver?

Quote:
And yes, once the 2cc recolour sprites are done, it will be able to be used with any company coloured vehicle. One of the reasons I'm making this is to allow some better looking and more realistic liveries for the 2cc set :)


Epic. Once you got the colors right, will it work with the 2nd company color too?

Quote:


I still think the orange could use a wider color range from light to dark. The orange colored bus got less shading than the other colors.

Good work though, and I guess every user will have their own view upon colors :P

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 1:18 pm 
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@Eddi: Surely it should work since the company colour names are unchanged from TTD?

Purno wrote:
1. I liked Rust Brown (I guess especially nice for cargo wagons)

So did I, that's why I'm keeping it :P

Purno wrote:
Grey may not be used a lot, but what about silver?

The new Light Grey looks pretty good for silver - see the lane on the new screenshot

Purno wrote:
Epic. Once you got the colors right, will it work with the 2nd company color too?

Yes, once the colours are decided, I will make the 2cc recolour sprites, which means it will work fully with 2CC sets.

Purno wrote:
I still think the orange could use a wider color range from light to dark. The orange colored bus got less shading than the other colors.


Sorry, there just aren't enough orange shades. I will try tweaking it though. I also tried using red as the darkest shade of orange and that looked horrible. And yes, flashing colours still flash if you map them to company colours.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 1:46 pm 
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Emperor Jake wrote:
Sorry, there just aren't enough orange shades. I will try tweaking it though. I also tried using red as the darkest shade of orange and that looked horrible. And yes, flashing colours still flash if you map them to company colours.


http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Pa ... s#Palettes

Original Orange seem to be decent. I guess you couldn't use any colors from the B2-BF line either?

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 1:56 pm 
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That's what it already uses. As I said, using the reds as the darker shades of orange looks awful because the parts of a vehicle that are supposed to be shadow turn out bright red

I never liked the original orange because it's not orange enough. It's almost the same as yellow.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 2:52 pm 
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You could add parameters for activating/disabling each color. Also the black should be darker.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 12:35 am 
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Was wondering when somebody would ask that... It would require a full set of 256 colours for every possible combination of parameters. That's a LOT of code, 16384 2cc tables for 13 colours, and 65535 if I were to replace all 16. That's over 16 million recolour sprites! I might do it, but first I have to learn python and meta-program it like Eddi said. Unfortunately I am no proper programmer (yet) :wink:

I will try tweaking the black.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 5:54 am 
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TBH, I don't think we should have (m)any parameters for changing color options. It may end up with everyone using another setting and, especially on multiplayer, getting confused, lost or upset. (Oy, why did you disable my favourite NewCC color? :evil: )

And I guess it's not really worth the effort and data.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 6:33 am 
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Actually, since this set only replaces default sprites, it will work as a static NewGRF. The only problem is that you might use a nice dark red and beige combination, and to other people on multiplayer it will appear as horrible pink and cream.

Anyway, I've finally put together this fully 2CC compatible beta version. It wasn't as much work as I thought when I went about it with good planing. It is easy to change if any separate colours may still need fixing.
Changes:
- Made black darker
- Tweaked orange and a few other colours

See the first post for the new version and please report any bugs and stuff :D

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 8:00 am 
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Wow, great idea, I mainly like the orange. Though what I am missing is a more of the original "blue" while there are 2 quite similar reds and the 2 of the greens are also quite close... maybe merge light blue and teal would be my suggestion and replace one of them with blue..
I think something could be changed with the 2 reds, although I do not know what exactly :) Maybe one of them to be pink?

Either way, it is a brilliant and refreshing idea, thanks for that!
Bananas soon? :) It does not matter that the strings are not matching in my opinion, players dont have to use the newgrf if they dont like that...

Superb stuff!

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 8:04 am 
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Emperor Jake wrote:
Was wondering when somebody would ask that... It would require a full set of 256 colours for every possible combination of parameters. That's a LOT of code, 16384 2cc tables for 13 colours, and 65535 if I were to replace all 16. That's over 16 million recolour sprites! I might do it, but first I have to learn python and meta-program it like Eddi said. Unfortunately I am no proper programmer (yet) :wink:

Sorry but now you missed my point. :)

By each color I meant those 16 CC colors, because if you want to use only one or two of the new ones, you could turn the rest off and they'd be the original ones.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 8:10 am 
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alluke wrote:
Emperor Jake wrote:
Was wondering when somebody would ask that... It would require a full set of 256 colours for every possible combination of parameters. That's a LOT of code, 16384 2cc tables for 13 colours, and 65535 if I were to replace all 16. That's over 16 million recolour sprites! I might do it, but first I have to learn python and meta-program it like Eddi said. Unfortunately I am no proper programmer (yet) :wink:

Sorry but now you missed my point. :)

By each color I meant those 16 CC colors, because if you want to use only one or two of the new ones, you could turn the rest off and they'd be the original ones.


Yes, and that would require that much code, because each combination of parameters would require its own set of 256 recolour sprites. For example, if you set the parameters to "all normal, except pink=dark red", that requires its own full set of recolour sprites where all colours are left the same as the originals except for dark red. Believe me, I've done the maths :wink:

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 10:36 pm 
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I've given it a quick go with FIRS and this is definitely going to be an 'always on' NewGRF for me. It's another change that raises the game to a new level. TYVVM!

The colours in some of the game windows do take a little bit of getting used to, but if they had been those colours all along I don't think I'd have really noticed - having the window colours harmonized with the game's livery colours is actually a nice touch. The biggest shock was the brown shade used for the minmap, and the industry windows, which are now off-white, looked a bit washed out. I think that would be best fixed by further patching the game itself. The OTTD colours are a bit garish in places - as a personal preference I'd rather have the game changed to match your patch than the other way round. I can foresee most of the 'artistic' screenshot games adopting this NewGRF becuase it's so much more in keeping with the colours and styles that suit the game.


Minor issues:

I noticed a FIRS aluminium plant with a red corporate colour scheme, and that didn't quite work as well as with the original colours; the red was a bit jarring in a couple of places. Conversely, a nearby brick works appeared to benefit from some gentler colour contrasts and was subtly improved. On the whole, there definitely seem to be more places where the new colours are better than the old.

Because I haven't applied the naming patch yet, I did find the mix of old colour names and new colours confusing. It's like playing B3ta's 'Click the Colour and Not the Word' game. :-) For this reason I really recommend applying the colour names patch to anyone planning to use this NewGRF.

I was trying to think of some older-fashioned colour names that could be used - so far I've come up with 'ivory', 'silver', 'maroon', 'racing green', 'navy blue', for example. Not that any of them necessarily have places in your current palette. My only current concrete suggestion is to maybe make 'Teal green' just 'Teal'?


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:54 pm 
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How Does it work? :?:

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 4:57 pm 
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Like any other NewGRF.

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