Dutch Tram Set Release Candidate 1 released 2008/08/12

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FooBar
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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by FooBar »

Rendall wrote:I have finished a non motorized tram which were attached behind a motorised car.
Nice. I think the _ view needs to be a bit less square. Maybe removing the upper left and upper right pixels will help.
Rendall wrote:But I hav to put it behind the motorised tram How do I do that or is that coded?
That's coded. Don't worry about it.
Ameecher wrote:FooBar, it looks good but I think you need to make the Pantograph larger, remember you've got to make it look like it is touching the wires in the game, that current one looks to short to even reach the top shelf in a newsagents
I guess you're right about those pantos. I just copied and pasted the ones Purno made. I'll see if I can make some bigger pantos of my own.
Rendall wrote:@Foobar: I am still looking for the co wagon behind the werkspoor 21 - 150 but I can't find it. But I have draw before the Allan 127 - 151. It was my first creation... Shall I refurbisch it, strip the engine and give it al little painting
Weren't the old horse-driven open wagons used behind the Werkspoors? Would be cool anyways, but maybe a bit hard to draw.

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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by AndersI »

Rendall wrote:@AndersI: It makes a difference. But I tried also on the \ / -- view but that wasn't a succes.
Yeah, the diagonals are difficult - and for road vehicles and trams, that's what will be seen. I did some more fiddling with your sprites, maybe something like this?
Example3.png
Example3.png (609 Bytes) Viewed 2613 times
And don't forget the shading - light comes from the right (or front-right depending on who you ask). When you mirror the image not every pixel should be mirrored. The slanted roof should be lighter on the right side that the left side, irrespective of the direction the tram is moving. Also, I thnk the pantograph should be positioned in the midle of the roof (sideways), not at one side.

I hope you take all this as constructive criticism!

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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by FooBar »

Here's my new pantos. I included the first attempt, for comparison.
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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Rendall »

@ Foobar, you will find the newer vesion in the FTP

[EDIT] @AnderI I already did but I don't want to cut the edge because than the tram will be to small as you know what I mean. But I am glad you are willing to think with us on this project.

Still a little sleepless about this :lol: I hav changed a bit, the / \ views are much better. But the _ view hase become a little small at the front and the rear. Just 1 pixel and you maybe do not see it in the game. And that's exactly where I am just worried about. And be aware of that silly battery on top of the roof. Maybe I should level all the roof a bit but .... I don't know. :?

And I have changed the pantograph a bit. You are absolutely right about that. Thanks a lot

Rgrds,

Rendall
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Werkspoor_21_150_v2[3].PNG
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Example3.png
Example3.png (609 Bytes) Viewed 2549 times

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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Hyronymus »

I like the progress of this set but I wonder if it's smart to focus on trams alone. Rendall, Purno and I already discussed a complete Dutch trams + rv's set over PM's and I think it will be beneficial. The most important reason is compatibility with an a possible independent Dutch rv set. Noone mentioned starting one yet but it's not unimaginable that someone will one day. And since trams use rv slots I don't think it's such a bad idea to go for a combined (maybe better call it complete though) tram + rv set.

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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by FooBar »

I too had a little discussion with Rendall about a possible complete set...

My opinion is that we should focus on a set with only trams first. If we use the available IDs wisely (i.e. use only toyland IDs for trams), it shouldn't be too much of a problem to add regular RVs later on. There's 36 toyland IDs and 52 regular IDs.
Another option is to make two sets: one with the trams, and another with the regular RVs. It should be possible to use either one of the sets, or both together.


EDIT:
I updated the tracking table. Here's version 0.2. I added some stats and played around a bit with it.

The GVBA Combino is finished now.

EDIT2:
I ported the tracking table to Google Spreadsheets. This way updates can be viewed real time and it allows easy access for everyone, because there's no additional software required. You don't need a Google Account to view it.
http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key= ... _6-YDLrhYQ

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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Rendall »

Due too the different ID's and because we have more of them I suggest we draw and code them seperately. But at the and we can release them both as two sets (2 grf's in 1 zip file) or, when possible two sets in 1 grf file. It would be nice we have a RV drawer with us (Hyronymus) :P (just kidding)

[EDIT] The Werkspoor wasn't a tram from R'dam but A'dam. Will change that asap....
[Edit2] OK FooBar: just a way of thinking.... build in A'dam but used in The Hague :mrgreen:

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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Rendall »

I am struggling with a problem how to draw my next tram. I have included 2 pictures. On those you can see that there are or 4 windows or 3 windows and a door. The door and the window (or 2 windows at side front) area much smaller as tehe 2 doors to the middle next to the entrance. Also the entrance is small and has little windows.

The problem is: when I draw it with al the windows the tram becomes way to large. When I draw the entrance a little wider and remove the second windows side view front and rear than it is about the right size. Makes it a nice tram but not as real I want to. How should you solve this? I have draw a little side view impression to make clear what I mean. It's not shaded or someting else. It's just an impression.

Also the front is difficult but I think that is OK.
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BEIJNES1.jpg
BEIJNES1.jpg (13.3 KiB) Viewed 2341 times
Beijnes2.jpg
Beijnes2.jpg (22.62 KiB) Viewed 2339 times
Beijnes_76_v1[0].PNG
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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by athanasios »

Pretty hard.
At least do not draw 4 windows, draw 3. Maybe narrower and darken (grey instead white between the windows) - but not so nice?
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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by FooBar »

That larger side-view looks good to me. The length of it seems pretty good too. You might even make it a bit longer, to gain some extra pixels for / and \ views.


I also have the very first development screenshot!
The alignment still needs to be fixed, so please don't complain about that :)
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Naamloos-1.png
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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Addiction »

FooBar wrote:That larger side-view looks good to me. The length of it seems pretty good too. You might even make it a bit longer, to gain some extra pixels for / and \ views.


I also have the very first development screenshot!
The alignment still needs to be fixed, so please don't complain about that :)
Looking good =]

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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Rendall »

FooBar: De larger image looks better. But the scale is a mismatch with other trams. Sometimes you have to smugle or fetch a little to make a drawing looks good in the game. Both of the I can draw, that's not the point. But is there an other solution to make the tram not to large but with a viewable 4 windows / 3 windows + door That's the "problem"

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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by FooBar »

I guess you'll end up with 2 windows + door + 2 windows in / and \ views. Maybe try one of those views first and make them look good and after that figure out what to do for a _ view. _view is displayed only in corners anyway.


Here's the second development screenshot. I fixed the alignments and think it looks pretty good right now.
The leftmost tram is the 1905 The Hague HTM Series 21-150. The one in the middel is the 1913 Rotterdam RET 152-206 with towed wagon 600-629. The vehicle at the right is the 2002 Amsterdam GVB Combino.
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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Rendall »

Yeah, you are right. I will try / and \ view and than try what is the best. I will try the screenshot / grf at home. A little typing is OK but real drawing or trying isn't "nice" at the office ;-)

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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Rendall »

And here is the Beijnes drawing nr1. But there has something to be done. Its hard to draw broken white. I have no more broken white ;) Suggestions someone?
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Beijnes_76_v1[0].PNG
Beijnes_76_v1[0].PNG (2.92 KiB) Viewed 2114 times
Beijnes.txt
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Beijnes2.jpg
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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by AndersI »

Rendall wrote:Its hard to draw broken white. I have no more broken white ;) Suggestions someone?
You have all the 'broken white' you need - it's called different shades of grey, all the way down to black (which BTW comes from an old word meaning 'white'). Suggestion (BTW, I think you should do something more to the windows - not so much light/dark contrast, more of a 'cloud' of different shades of grey, just hinting at the white parts between the windows):
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Example5.png
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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Rendall »

OK. Someting like this... Looks much better indeed. Shading is sometimes very hard.
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Beijnes_76_v1[1].PNG
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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Rendall »

OK Lets introduce the next tram. Brugeoise 821-830 is the name. The Hague it's terratorium. This tram build from 1929 is the first in the next era. I draw it 7 pix wide in the front. 6 pix diagonal. 5 pix is shown because the edges of the tram is also diagonal. Liitle though cause I could not get all the windows in the / \ view but I think its OK.... shoot... !!!!

[little edit] two black dpts in the / \ view
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Brugeoise_821_830.jpg
Brugeoise_821_830.jpg (28.23 KiB) Viewed 1945 times
Brugeoise_821_830_v1[0].PNG
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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Rendall »

And the towed car of the same manufactorer. It's the almost the same. Just a window extra, no engines, no pantographs and no lights. The base of the tram has another color but I think that's because it's repainted. But I am not sure about that. I like it cause it makes just a little difference in this stage. Trams after 1945 will have the same colors, lights etc...
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Brugeoise_751-781.jpg
Brugeoise_751-781.jpg (28.6 KiB) Viewed 1929 times
Brugeoise_751_781_v1[0].PNG
Brugeoise_751_781_v1[0].PNG (2.46 KiB) Viewed 1929 times

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Re: Start Dutch Tramset

Post by Rendall »

Removed by Rendall
Last edited by Rendall on 27 Jul 2007 20:33, edited 1 time in total.

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