Food Processing Plant Problem

[Siema]

I have problem with my food processing plant. I'm suppling it with grain and livestock and it produces more than 400 tonnes of food but none of this goes to the station (and I hope I didn't make some stupid mistake). Wagons are of course reffited to food. Screenshot, save, newgrf and ttdpatchcfg attached:

[Death]

I don't know but your save game is in Arctic climate.
You cheat and now the food prossesor doesn't make food.
Try to play without cheating.

(edite) I played the game in the Arctic climate, and I cheat to the temp. climate, and it's just like your problem.

[DaleStan]

/me points Death at MB's newcargos[w].grf file, which, among other things, puts the food processing plant in temperate.

EDIT: Siema, why'd you post a temperate screenie? The savegame you posted, as Death points out, is in arctic.

Death, only cheat Siema might have used in the savegame he posted is cht:used.

[michael blunck]

> why'd you post a temperate screenie?

He´s playing AlpineClimate which is essentially arctic, ATM.

regards
Michael

[Death]

Death, only cheat Siema might have used in the savegame he posted is cht:used.

Dah! really? I "didn't" know it!

[Siema]

1. I haven't cheated in this game, I'm sure.

2. This game is in MB's Arctic climate, as MB said moment ago.

3. Screenshot is of course from game in attached save.

[DaleStan]

/me reminds himself to read newgrfw.cfg a little more thoroughly next time.

[Siema]

Sorry, but I don't know where the problem is, so could you point me to this place, please?

[Csaboka]

I think I've found the problem. Try opening the cargo payment rates window - there will be two buttons called "food" there. The first is the original arctic food (ID 0B), the second must be Michael's food (ID 0C). The food processing plant produces the arctic food, but your train is refitted to the "MB-food". The two cargoes are exactly alike, but TTDPatch will still handle them as distinct cargoes.

I guess the NewCargo set should be rewritten to use the built-in food in Arctic and supply its own on Temperate. Alternatively, it could be declared incompatible with temperate paper and use ID 0B in temperate for food.

[Siema]

Yes, there are two food buttons, I have even seen this already but didn't know what it should mean. Now I understand. So, I have to wait until NewCargo will be corrected. And thanks Csaba for checking this

[michael blunck]

[2 "food" cargoes]
The first is the original arctic food (ID 0B), the second must be Michael's food (ID 0C). The food processing plant produces the arctic food, but your train is refitted to the "MB-food". The two cargoes are exactly alike, but TTDPatch will still handle them as distinct cargoes.

According to the documentation, the original "food" in TTD is cargo-ID 0C. In the NewCargo set, another "food" (for temperate) is introduced which uses also cargo-ID 0C (in an attempt to make both identical). Then, by a climate-dependant bit switch, the appropriate industries are enabled.

Now, the problem is that the complete cargo-ID scheme is ambiguous whenever it comes to climate dependency.

I guess the NewCargo set should be rewritten to use the built-in food in Arctic and supply its own on Temperate. Alternatively, it could be declared incompatible with temperate paper and use ID 0B in temperate for food.

But then, again, I´m not sure how we could handle all those different climate-dependant cargo-IDs, especially for the new cargoes. Even "paper in temperate" makes horrible problems.

Couldn´t we have an un-ambiguous cargo-ID? Remember, I had to change cargo-IDs before (because of "paper") and I would like to avoid it again.

And how would we handle "new cargo IDs" for the different climates? Would they be the same (numbers) or would they also have to be different (= climate dependent)?

regards
Michael

[DaleStan]

According to the documentation, the original "food" in TTD is cargo-ID 0C. In the NewCargo set, another "food" (for temperate) is introduced which uses also cargo-ID 0C

Arctic-food is *bit* 0C, but *ID* 0B. There's an important difference there. Bit numbers are Type A, IDs are type B.

This would be arctic-food's action 0:
-1*7 00 0B 01 01 0B 08 0C
As opposed to MB-food, which is (if I'm reading the readme correctly):
-1*7 00 0B 01 01 0C 08 0C

One possible solution is to write 0B/0C into a parameter, according to the climate, and then use action6s to write it in all the appropriate parts of the appropriate sprites.

[michael blunck]

> One possible solution is to write 0B/0C into a parameter, according to the climate, and then use action6s to write it in all the appropriate parts of the appropriate sprites.

Yes. And now I want to hear from Csaba that this would be needed with all of the new cargo-IDs depending on the used climate.

regards
Michael

[Csaboka]

According to the documentation, the original "food" in TTD is cargo-ID 0C.

The documentation can't say that original food uses slot ID 0C, simply because there are only 12 original slot IDs (0..B). It uses bit 0C, but that is irrelevant here.

Now, the problem is that the complete cargo-ID scheme is ambiguous whenever it comes to climate dependency.

I think I've explained it some time ago, but it won't hurt explaining again

First, you have cargo slot IDs. These are climate-dependent, slots 00..0B are used by old TTD cargoes, slots 0C..1F are available for new cargoes.

You also have bit numbers, or climate-independent IDs. These were added by TTDPatch in an attempt to make cargo handling easier (they allow having one refit mask and action 3 instead of several climate-dependent ones). Therefore, these are used only in few places, namely in action 3 cargo types and for vehicle refit masks. (I hope I didn't forget anything...) If two cargoes have the same number, refit masks and action 3's won't distinguish between them.

In most places, you will need the climate-dependent ID, simply because this is what TTD uses most of the time.

Couldn´t we have an un-ambiguous cargo-ID? Remember, I had to change cargo-IDs before (because of "paper") and I would like to avoid it again.

TTD uses the climate-dependent IDs everywhere. Patching all places to use some translation would be overkill. I'm afraid you'll have to live with climate-dependent IDs.

And how would we handle "new cargo IDs" for the different climates? Would they be the same (numbers) or would they also have to be different (= climate dependent)?

You can make your life easier if you use the same slot in every supported climate (just like passengers is in slot 0 in each climate). In this current case, this is not possible, though: you need a new slot in temperate, but must use slot B in arctic. I'm afraid that you'll have to use different action 0s for arctic, where you use slot B instead of C (and don't define your own food).

[edit]

Yes. And now I want to hear from Csaba that this would be needed with all of the new cargo-IDs depending on the used climate.

As I said, this isn't necessary if you use the same slot for the same cargo type on every climate you support. This is easy to do for "brand new" cargoes, problems arise only if you want to "bring over" a cargo from another climate, and you need to support the original climate as well.

DaleStan: You're right, action 6 is easier than an action7 and two action 0s. Thanks.

[michael blunck]

[...] So, I have to wait until NewCargo will be corrected.

You may try NewCargo v0.12.

regards
Michael

[Siema]

Thank You very much

[DaleStan]

[...] So, I have to wait until NewCargo will be corrected.

You may try NewCargo v0.12.

regards
Michael

http://www.ttdpatch.de/download.html might work slightly better, though.

[Siema]

And version number....