Reorganisation of graphics forums

[Purno]

I'd suggest one subforum for vehicles, one for infrastructure & anything else and one for tools and technical discussion.

And the 8-bit and 32-bit split?

[Chrill]

I'd suggest one subforum for vehicles, one for infrastructure & anything else and one for tools and technical discussion.

Yes, the Graphis could have subforums with the same/similar categories to what GRFcrawler has. Depending on what you want, you'll find every set of that type located in a particular subforum.

Arrangement similar to this:
Vehicles
Stations
Town Sets / Buildings
Industries / Cargoes
Infrastructure
Landscape
Others

[Kerygma]

I'd suggest one subforum for vehicles, one for infrastructure & anything else and one for tools and technical discussion.

And the 8-bit and 32-bit split?

IMHO there's no need to split between 8 and 32bbp. The number of 32bbp threads is pretty small from what I've seen (but I don't follow the 32bbp development that closely to be honest).

Arrangement similar to this:
Vehicles
Stations
Town Sets / Buildings
Industries / Cargoes
Infrastructure
Landscape
Others

I don't think there'd have to be that many subforums. The number of e.g. landscape and industrie sets that are actively developed is very low.

[Chrill]

I quoted GRFcrawler there, it could certainly be re-engineered to fit the forums better

[Purno]

I'd suggest one subforum for vehicles, one for infrastructure & anything else and one for tools and technical discussion.

Yes, the Graphis could have subforums with the same/similar categories to what GRFcrawler has. Depending on what you want, you'll find every set of that type located in a particular subforum.

Arrangement similar to this:
Vehicles
Stations
Town Sets / Buildings
Industries / Cargoes
Infrastructure
Landscape
Others

IMO such a categorizing is only necessary for GRF users. People who play the game and want to find a fun GRF to play with. IMO, those people should be using GRFCrawler and similar sites, and should *NOT* try to find the Graphics Forums. IMO, the Graphics forums are for those poeple *developing* a project, and IMO they don't need such a system. Several projects spread over different categories. For example the 2ccSet also develops the metro track. (One project, two GRFs). Discussion about Dutch trams has also taken place in the Dutch Trainset topic, and possibly the same for Dutch stations). I think GRF Developers and the projects itself will be better of with as less subforums as possible, with previously mentioned reasons.

Summarized; the Graphics forums shouldn't be used to search for a fun GRF to play with. They should be used to develop a project, and once there's a finished GRF, it should be placed upon sites as GRFCrawler. Most of the projects in the Graphics forums don't have a released GRF anyways. No use looking there for one. GRFCrawler links to the discussion topics incase someone wants to contribute or got a question to the development team.

Just my POV.

[jonty-comp]

IMHO there's no need to split between 8 and 32bbp. The number of 32bbp threads is pretty small from what I've seen (but I don't follow the 32bbp development that closely to be honest).

I would like to believe that there aren't many 32bpp threads basically because it's been developed quite restrictively. I mean take a look at the graphics forum as it stands. 99% of the threads are for 8bpp projects, and most 8bbp developers don't support 32bpp projects. I like to think the whole project would flourish a bit if it got given its own (sub)forum. Or it might not!

One forum for all tools, so GRF Developers got a quick overview of the available tools they can use to create their project

The problem with that is I can only think of two or three GRF tools. There's GRFMaker, grfcodec, nforenum, and a couple of projects that haven't been updated in years (anyone remember GRFWizard or whatever it was called? Those were the days!). However, I think an idea of a general GRF Development forum could be good, where people go to get tools, read tutorials and ask questions. Then you have a GRF Projects forum for the actual sets and for showcasing work.

[Gremnon]

I think the original plan of 8bpp/32bpp forums is fine, but that the specific sets should have a subforum in the 8bpp (or 32bpp, if they support it too) forum instead.
I don't see the need to over-organise it into types of GRF, at least not yet, and if everyone uploaded GRFs to GRFCrawler, then there and Bananas are your easy-access.

Related, is it possible to somehow make GRFCrawler GRFs available to Bananas? if there was a unified system, TTDP users could use that system to download - unless they too have a content download, which I don't think there is - and OTTD can use the content download service for pretty much everything, though I'll admit it'd probably be a huge amount bigger... maybe tabs in it like the Bananas page on the OTTD site?

'kay, I'm done. Feel free to tear my ideas apart telling me they won't work, I'm expecting it.

[Hyronymus]

Why not move GRFcrawler into the forum as a sub-category?

[Gremnon]

I don't think (From an outside view) it's possible. But I know little to nothing about how GRFCrawler works.
I was thinking integration with Bananas would be more beneficial, one place to download any GRF that's on it... but, even as it is now, it relies on people adding to them/it.

[Chrill]

There is the possibility to make a link to somewhere and make it look like a sub-forum, as far as I know

[Purno]

One forum for all tools, so GRF Developers got a quick overview of the available tools they can use to create their project

The problem with that is I can only think of two or three GRF tools. There's GRFMaker, grfcodec, nforenum, and a couple of projects that haven't been updated in years (anyone remember GRFWizard or whatever it was called? Those were the days!). However, I think an idea of a general GRF Development forum could be good, where people go to get tools, read tutorials and ask questions. Then you have a GRF Projects forum for the actual sets and for showcasing work.

GRFMaker alone is important enough to never get out of sight. I've been looking for GRFMaker when it sank down to the fifth page or something, and I knew it was there somewhere! Tools like GRFMaker should always be easily findable.

Why not move GRFcrawler into the forum as a sub-category?

Forums don't got enough search abilities you want, to select multiple categories and stuff. Besides, it'd probably need a mod and a hack to GRFCrawler's database. Why not just make a link-forum to it?

Bananas

Aye, BaNaNaS, forgot about that one. Aye, too bad there's several systems for the same thing. Would be nice to intergrate them into one. Hmm... perhaps adding a subforum to link to sites where people can find GRFs to play with? Would probably also motivate developers to add their GRFs to websites such as GRFCrawler and BaNaNaS, as they're always in attention. (Can't miss them).

Summarized; You shouldn't be able to miss links to GRFCrawler, BaNaNaS, GRFMaker and similar things. Even when you try hard, you shouldn't be able to miss them. They're just too useful to be able to miss. They should always catch the eye. At least, IMO.

[DaleStan]

GRFMaker alone is important enough to never get out of sight. I've been looking for GRFMaker when it sank down to the fifth page or something, and I knew it was there somewhere! Tools like GRFMaker should always be easily findable.

Search topic titles in the Graphics forum for grfmaker. Easily findable.

[jonty-comp]

Related, is it possible to somehow make GRFCrawler GRFs available to Bananas? if there was a unified system, TTDP users could use that system to download - unless they too have a content download, which I don't think there is - and OTTD can use the content download service for pretty much everything, though I'll admit it'd probably be a huge amount bigger... maybe tabs in it like the Bananas page on the OTTD site?

Unfortunately I believe GRFCrawler and BaNaNaS work in different ways with regards to the licensing and legal stuff. GRFCrawler only hosts links to GRFs, whereas bananas hosts the actual GRF itself, which means you can't just bung all the GRFs from the Crawler onto it without getting permission from every author!

[wallyweb]

Reorganization is fine, especially with a view to combining accessibility to OTTD and TTDPatch graphic topics. As noted by a couple of posters, Identification in the title line is critical. I am an inveterate TTDPatch player and I'm moving into some authoring as well. It is extremely frustrating to see some excellent graphics not available cross platform. If a title starts with {OTTD 32 bpp }, I will know to avoid it rather than torture myself. Hopefully, most topics would begin with {OTTD,TTDPatch,8bpp,32bpp}

I do not have a problem for large projects having one sub-forum. A good candidate would be the Canadian/US/North American stuff. There are inumerable topics that fall into this grouping. Due to shifting focus, these topics will occasionally drop from view and require some super search term talent to locate them. The point here is that the topic is not dead. It is merely on temporary hiatus while the focus has shifted elsewhere.

[AndersI]

GRFMaker alone is important enough to never get out of sight. I've been looking for GRFMaker when it sank down to the fifth page or something, and I knew it was there somewhere! Tools like GRFMaker should always be easily findable.

I hope you are aware that GRFMaker has a page of its own here: http://users.tt-forums.net/grfmaker/

I have tried to collect all downloads there, GRFMaker, example projects, tutorials, link to the forum thread etc. Every GRFMaker user is welcome to contribute!

[Purno]

GRFMaker alone is important enough to never get out of sight. I've been looking for GRFMaker when it sank down to the fifth page or something, and I knew it was there somewhere! Tools like GRFMaker should always be easily findable.

I hope you are aware that GRFMaker has a page of its own here: http://users.tt-forums.net/grfmaker/

I wasn't. And nobody will unless the topic advertising that link is easy to find for people not looking for it.

I have tried to collect all downloads there, GRFMaker, example projects, tutorials, link to the forum thread etc. Every GRFMaker user is welcome to contribute!

Such a complete website is a great effort, but the problem is finding it. I have full faith in you that there's good stuff on that website *once you found it*.

[Redirect Left]

I think sets getting own subforums will result in A LOT of "omg no fair they got one" behaviour.

[Gremnon]

I think sets getting own subforums will result in A LOT of "omg no fair they got one" behaviour.

Simple - have them made only on request (which probably would be the case anyway) and have the set author(s) state why it's needed before it'll be created.

Related, is it possible to somehow make GRFCrawler GRFs available to Bananas? if there was a unified system, TTDP users could use that system to download - unless they too have a content download, which I don't think there is - and OTTD can use the content download service for pretty much everything, though I'll admit it'd probably be a huge amount bigger... maybe tabs in it like the Bananas page on the OTTD site?

Unfortunately I believe GRFCrawler and BaNaNaS work in different ways with regards to the licensing and legal stuff. GRFCrawler only hosts links to GRFs, whereas bananas hosts the actual GRF itself, which means you can't just bung all the GRFs from the Crawler onto it without getting permission from every author!

That's a problem... I'd say we'd need GRFCrawler to be in plain sight, maybe something like Purno's brilliant Linkage page, in a topic stickied as Sites to Know about, or Sites you must Remember to use. Okay, maybe not like that, but you get the idea. At least then, you can redirect people to it and other resources by topic, though I'll admit just pushing them toward Linkage itself is just as good.

[Purno]

About Linkage, as far as I know nobody is moderating it and it's probably filled with dead links by now.

[jonty-comp]

There are a couple of dead links, but otherwise it's still a great resource!