Japan Set Development

[Sanchimaru]

I have been working on the trees: dandan sent me a test GRF with my previous update, but I didn't like them. So here is a new version of them, which I hope looks better.

My next step will be some buildings, I wanted to ask something: dandan, are you familiar with the color replacement feature? it consists in having a color-swap palette that will allow random different color schemes for sprites. Mart3p is currently working on it for the ISR.
I'd like to use this feature better than the CC to represent more real-looking convenience stores (with the colors of LAWSON, Family Mart, Sunkus, 7eleven, etc)

[Aegir]

I'll have a look into coding those, Sanchimaru. Looks good!

I'm still in the process of getting back into TT, my computers at the moment have been geared more for photography work lately, and my server with all my files kinda blew up. Gotta rebuild another box as my server, the hard drives with all my files are fine though, don't worry about that .

Edit: And I'm already familiar with the colour swap stuff, it's already in use in some parts of the japanset buildings. I'll have to re-acquaint myself with that code, however.

Edit 2: And if dandan is taking over the landscape and buildings coding (YES! One less project to worry about), I'll contact him with my data files when I can get them from that disk.

[dandan]

Hi Aegir,

good to see you back! It would be great if you had time to do some coding for the Japan Set again. I am certainly not eager to take over all the coding since it is such a huge project. As far as the buildings are concerned, I currently need all the time I have for the trains, and I have no experience with buildings. So it'd be much better (and probably faster) if you continued working on them.

The landscape stuff is mostly quite trivial coding-wise. For now, I suggest I finish the trees, since I have already been working on them with that test version Sanchimaru mentioned.

And then there is also the stations with sprites waiting to be coded (for example platforms with passengers on them, I believe). Oh well...

Here are Sanchimaru's new signals. They look much better now and are also easier to use since they are closer to the standard. I hope there are no alignment problems this time...

EDIT: Removed attachments. See updated version below.

[krtaylor]

Do you think the Japan signals are now ready for a public posting on the the release site? It seems that the only thing they need is a readme file. I'd say the simplest thing would be to copy one of the existing readmes from one of the other parts of the set, and change it as needed. They're all available on the download area of the site.

http://www.as-st.com/ttd/japan/

[dandan]

Finally got a few things done today, so here are more grfs.

First a new version of the train set. Apart from the many new stats and several small bugfixes, the biggest change are Sanchimaru's new Shinkansen tracks and tunnels. They now work with any setting of unifiedmaglev and with both Japanese grass and normal grass (i.e. with and without the landscape set).

Known Bugs:
1) TTDPatch: E4 Max Shinkansen currently does not have higher capacity.
2) OpenTTD: Catenary is not displayed over Shinkansen tracks. (There is a patch by stevenh in the OpenTTD development section that adds this feature.)

I think this version is quite playable and as far as I'm concerned, it could be published in a more official form (on the website and possibly in a separate release thread?) Same for the signals. Anyone want to do the readme files?

This also means that I will now start coding the many new trains that have been drawn and reworking the multiple units both of which will take some time. In the meantime, I do not plan to improve this version any further (apart from possibly bugfixes).

The second grf are Sanchimaru's new trees:

JapanSet.png (191.79 KiB) Viewed 3334 times

EDIT: Removed train set. See updated version below.

[dandan]

And here are the dos files:

EDIT: removed

[krtaylor]

Wow! Those look gorgeous! Those trees are an incredible improvement, I had no idea they would look so much better - and the old ones were bad.

I agree, this should all be posted on the public website. And I will do so shortly. The only thing needed are Readme files. But this should not be a big problem, as we already have templates that simply need updating.

First, again, the public website is here:

http://www.as-st.com/ttd/japan

If you click on "Download", you will find a table of the various files to download, including links to their Readmes. There is already a readme file for the old version of the trees; I imagine the new version will have changed hardly at all, if any. dandan, can you take a look at the old readme, update it accordingly, and post it here?

For the trains, there is no readme posted, but there is an old draft one. You can find it here:

http://www.as-st.com/ttd/eastasia/Japanset_Readme.htm

Toni, can you take that file, go over it, and update all the train info since you are most familiar with it? And anything else that you think needs changing? Then, please post it here, and dandan can take a look to make sure all the technical instructions are correct, since he did the coding. It's important to get this one right.

Last, for the signals, there is no readme for that either, but I bet we could copy the one from the US set and just change the names as needed. Here's the US one:

http://www.as-st.com/ttd/newusa/USSignals_Readme.htm

Sanchimaru, since you drew the signals and understand them best, can you take care of that?

One last remark. I finally got the container EMU. What a killer train! I suppose that was the idea IRL - an all-wheels-powered container train is bound to have insane acceleration. Normally I'd say it is a category killer, but since it appears so very late in the game that's just fine. Cool, and unique!

Great work everybody! We are just about to finally roll this out!

[edit] Just noticed a major bug with the new version of signals - some of them are wired backwards. I mean, they are red when they should be green, and green when they should be red. Most confusing...

Also, did you change the reliabilities of the modern electric locos? They seem to really be suffering, down in the 30s even when they've come right out of the repair depot. That seems wrong.

[edit] Looks like you reduced the power of the container EMU in this last version. Now it's underpowered and can't climb hills, or accelerate to speed. I think it needs to be somewhere in between.

[dandan]

Just noticed a major bug with the new version of signals - some of them are wired backwards. I mean, they are red when they should be green, and green when they should be red. Most confusing...

Oops, that's embarassing. I'll look into that tomorrow and fix it ASAP.

Also, did you change the reliabilities of the modern electric locos? They seem to really be suffering, down in the 30s even when they've come right out of the repair depot. That seems wrong.

No, changed nothing there. But there is a certain amount of randomness involved, no? I must say, I always play with breakdowns off, so I don't really know what are reasonable figures for reliability.

[edit] Looks like you reduced the power of the container EMU in this last version. Now it's underpowered and can't climb hills, or accelerate to speed. I think it needs to be somewhere in between.

Well, I was surprised it was so powerful. When I took a look at Wikipedia, I noticed that the old figure used the power of the entire train (16 wagons) for every single wagon! So it is 1/16 now of what it was before, and that is the realistic value. It's possible of course that turns out too low in the game, I haven't really tried.

[DanMacK]

I actually find the new trees a little 'too' bright, the other ones were more subdued yet just as colourful. Just my opinion.

[krtaylor]

There's no way to use real-life data for the reliabilities, you just have to play a game and see if it feels right. That's what I've been trying to do.

One thing that is strange is that the max reliability appears to creep down over time, BEFORE the loco even comes close to its max age! This reminds me of the way TTD used to behave, years and years ago; it was one of the very first patches IIRC, to make it so that a train didn't become unreliable when it was discontinued, even if that specific loco wasn't very old. I wonder if maybe we broke something and that patch isn't working anymore?

Concerning the MUs, those are funny beasties anyway. The hills in TTD are way way steeper than you'd ever encounter on a real railroad. Normally you can make up for this by multiheading them, which is fine since the trains are unrealistically short. A 15-car train would never need multiheading IRL; but IRL also you'd often get trains way way longer than that, which aren't nearly so common in TTD. But with MUs, it is not possible to multihead them and increase the power/weight ratio; it is what it is. So I think it needs to be a little generous in the TTD world. I've also noticed some of the passenger MUs having trouble on hills, but less so because passengers are not so heavy. With a freight MU, it would be much more pronounced. And I use freighttrains 5. My guess is that the power should be doubled; let's see how that goes.

I don't find the new trees too bright, if anything they are duller than the last batch since there are not nearly so many Sakura trees. And it seems like there is a strong wind blowing, since they are all leaning to the right, is this on purpose?

[Sanchimaru]

>Danmack: indeed they are. I have yet to improve them a little bit more, I can darken them more by combining different tones of green and brown, I'll have to try

In the mean time; here are the latest improvement sprites: the convenience store and the Kakihara house. They include a color chart, but I'm not sure how to make one, so please, tell me how should it be done if there is anything that needs to be changed.

[krtaylor]

If we are moving on to doing more buildings, I think right now the very weakest area is in traditional Japanese early houses - with shoji and tile. Right now in 1920, a "Japanese" city looks pretty much like an American one, which is wrong. It looks more Asian later on when you get the skyscrapers, and that's good, which I think illustrates the unique look we are wanting. Dunno how possible it is to do a recognizable Japanese house though. What did a Japanese village in 1920 look like?

[Sanchimaru]

At the moment I will be updating sprites we already have, but I'll look for more information about older houses later

[krtaylor]

Hey, small alignment/clipping glitch here with the D58 and coal hoppers. Take a look at the rear loco on both trains - it's crunching over the last car immediately in front of it.

Scr2.png (10.64 KiB) Viewed 3191 times

[Toni Babelony]

*posting while quite drunk/pissed/almost got in a fight/not able to hook up a chick/head banging on eighties e.g. German metal. This post may be not to the point or whatsoever.*

Damn ace, those .grfs! I'll take a look at 'em later, as I can't really do anything rational ATM. (but is still posting a message, since I love you guys )

As for the buildings: if anyone is interested, I could make some pre-war buildings, as these were mainly made out of wood or (in bigger towns) out of concrete/cement in some mixture of American and Euro style. I've been to some boring villages in Japan that still look like that. I was surprised they had electricity and running water there sometimes... I've never been in such rural places in my life.

Regarding the trees: they look damn awesome, but they need more random pixeling to accent the leaves and such. They look like those trees you see on model railways. (sorry for the bad comparison) You could take a look at the SAC Stolen trees for such randomising. (IMO that .grf looks fecking awesome)

For the trains, there is no readme posted, but there is an old draft one. You can find it here:

http://www.as-st.com/ttd/eastasia/Japanset_Readme.htm

Toni, can you take that file, go over it, and update all the train info since you are most familiar with it? And anything else that you think needs changing? Then, please post it here, and dandan can take a look to make sure all the technical instructions are correct, since he did the coding. It's important to get this one right.

Sure, but it'll take some time. When the final grf of the JapanSet is ready to release (or if there are sum mid-term releases) please send me the file before it's released and I'll make a decent .pdf file. (maybe with some cute mascot to go along with the set, Densha de GO! Tetsuko-style.)



HURRRRRRR *goes to sing some Enka to annoy my neighbours before posting some moar insane stuff*

[dandan]

Here are updated versions of yesterday's grfs. Hope the signals work properly now.

I have yet to improve them a little bit more, I can darken them more by combining different tones of green and brown, I'll have to try

Sanchimaru, it has in the meantime occured to me that after our short exchange of PMs I should have asked you again whether you were now happy with your trees before posting the grf. Sorry for that. If you want to do further improvements, I will happily code them, of course.

Here is also a tiny update of the train set with more power for the M250. It kind of bugs me that we will have to use unrealistic HP values for the MUs when all the values for locos are accurate, but krtaylor's argument with trains lengths has convinced me that it is unavoidable. After a bit of testing I have indeed made it twice as powerful as in reality. Now with freight trains set to 10 it won't be able to run up every mountain at full speed (it shouldn't IMO) but it's still reasonably useful. I hope it's okay like this.

The alignment problem krtaylor pointed out will have to wait I'm afraid, but it's noted.

[dandan]

Plus the dos files again.

[Toni Babelony]

Nice update! I've noticed the set is now NewIndustries compatible! Hallelujah!

[krtaylor]

Thanks for the updates, dandan! I'll test them and let you know what comes up.

Aegir, when you get a chance to get at your hard drive, would you mind zipping up your working files and posting them here? That way if any worse hardware failures take place, there will be a backup; and if dandan winds up working on them, that'll be easier too. Better safe than sorry I think...

[dandan]

I've noticed the set is now NewIndustries compatible!

In your dreams...